Asiatic influences on somali culture

[Hamzza]

1. Sword and sabre
The sword and sabre are unknown to the original Cushitic culture. In Abyssinia these weapons were certainly introduced by the South-Arabs, perhaps two thousand years ago or more, but they never became popular, Spear and javelin remaining the national arms." The Oromo were using no swords when they first made their appearance in history, as late as the XVI century; as a matter of fact, they appeared to have no knowledge of metals whatsoever.

The Somali, who as well as the Danakil had obtained iron from the Semites centuries before the Oromo, have long had, and still retain, a typical cutting weapon, a straight bladed dagger of a design peculiar to them alone . That this weapon is traditionally old among them, is proved by the ancient Somali rock engravings discovered by Graziosi at Bur Haybe which faithfully reproduce the unmistakable shape of their hilts and straight double edged blades.

The antiquity of this type of dagger would prove even greater if it were possible to identify it, as Révoil maintained, with that worn at the belt by Punt chiefs as depicted in the Deir-el-Bahri wall paintings.
Be this as it may, it is a fact that the Somali departed so unwillingly from this particular type, that when they started forging swords for themselves they remained faithful to the same model, merely making the blade longer . They adopted the Semitic word for »sword» (säyf or sëf), but Reinisch's texts show that they often continue to call this bilawa or bilâo, i. e. »dagger».

To this day, swords and sabres are very rare among them, as is the case with most Cushitic tribes.

 

[Hamzza]

2. Skull-caps(koofiyad)
The presence of the same cultural item both in Somaliland and in Indonesia does not always necessarily imply, of course, that the latter is to be regarded as the area from which such items originate. This is the case of elements introduced by Muslim culture in both areas, as for instance men's skull-caps made of straw or other vegetable fibres, and toepeg sandals. The former have a fairly wide distribution in Africa, though they appear to be typical of the Swahili area. On the other hand they are rare and particularly foreign-looking among the cushitic people of East Africa, who nearly always go bare-headed and are proud — especially the Somali — of their »fuzzy» hairdressing. In the coastal area of Tanganyika, these caps — called by the Arab name of kofia — are made of fibres of different colours, and are worn by the so-called »yumbe» or village elders. Similar caps, though made of uniformly brown fibres, are also used in Somalia, where they are called kofi . Here too,, they are not worn by the average man, but only by sheikhs or »priests» (wadadin), or by the hajji on their return from Mecca, as a variant of the kofiyyah proper, i. e. of the well-known embroidered white caps. These plaited fibre are not altogether, as one might believe, a purely African form of the kofiyyah: Stuhlrnann states that the above mentioned Swahili caps are usually not of native make, being mainly imported from Bombay, and Ferrandi informs us that the Somali ones are »lavoro proveniente d'Arabia, e specialmente da Giddah»

1. Somali 2. North Borneo 3. Hova, Madagascar 4. Swahili​

 

[Som]

1. Sword and sabre
The sword and sabre are unknown to the original Cushitic culture. In Abyssinia these weapons were certainly introduced by the South-Arabs, perhaps two thousand years ago or more, but they never became popular, Spear and javelin remaining the national arms." The Oromo were using no swords when they first made their appearance in history, as late as the XVI century; as a matter of fact, they appeared to have no knowledge of metals whatsoever.
View attachment 224141

The Somali, who as well as the Danakil had obtained iron from the Semites centuries before the Oromo, have long had, and still retain, a typical cutting weapon, a straight bladed dagger of a design peculiar to them alone . That this weapon is traditionally old among them, is proved by the ancient Somali rock engravings discovered by Graziosi at Bur Haybe which faithfully reproduce the unmistakable shape of their hilts and straight double edged blades.
View attachment 224142
The antiquity of this type of dagger would prove even greater if it were possible to identify it, as Révoil maintained, with that worn at the belt by Punt chiefs as depicted in the Deir-el-Bahri wall paintings.
Be this as it may, it is a fact that the Somali departed so unwillingly from this particular type, that when they started forging swords for themselves they remained faithful to the same model, merely making the blade longer . They adopted the Semitic word for »sword» (säyf or sëf), but Reinisch's texts show that they often continue to call this bilawa or bilâo, i. e. »dagger».
View attachment 224143
To this day, swords and sabres are very rare among them, as is the case with most Cushitic tribes.

You are using biased sources which attribute all development in Africa to non africans. Africans independently discovered iron working before the much of the rest of the world and Many central African and west African cultures have a pretty long and dense tradition of sword making.
While horners may have obtained Iron from semites ( you still need to prove this) their swords were designed independently. This is like saying Henry Ford didn't invent the first car because the wheel was discovered in the middle east.

 

[Hamzza]

While horners may have obtained Iron from semites ( you still need to prove this) their swords were designed independently. This is like saying Henry Ford didn't invent the first car because the wheel was discovered in the middle east.

Of course, somali swords were designed independently by somali blacksmiths. Who suggested otherwise?
But we call them seyf wich is arabic word.

1. Somali dagger sword 2. Arab-somali sabre​

 

[The alchemist]

Of course, somali swords were designed independently by somali blacksmiths. Who suggested otherwise?
But we call them seyf wich is arabic word.
View attachment 224281

1. Somali dagger sword 2. Arab-somali sabre​

Don't move the goalpost. You attributed the Somali swords to Peninsular Arabs, which is incorrect, the design is very different and not derivative. And now you're in a very weird fashion mentioning the use of the word 'sayf,' discussing a strictly semantic issue, thinking it justifies this silly thread trying to clearly downplay Somali cultural heritage, not that it would do that even if it was inspired from somewhere else, although the evidence burden has not yet been met in any capacity. The name of the swords in Somali is (bilawa, bilawai), so clearly there is a linguistic precedent that, again, sets a separate discussion in motion, still makes this sayf business debunked.

Sayf just means "sword". There is no particular style of sword that can be attributed as derivative from Arabic swordsmithing that can explain the Somali swords. It is very much indigenous. Where the smithing technology came from is very much irrelevant to the topic and likely not linear. Still, that is basically the history of swordsmithing everywhere; technology gets diffused geographically and then separate cultivation of smithing philosophy evolves in situ in respective local cultures. Somalis always made spears, if you can make spears, you can make other weapons as well.

Furthermore, you claimed the original Cushites never made swords. You don't know the original Cushites, what they did or did not do, other than clearly obvious things about subsistence of being broad-based agro-pastoralists that could take specialized and flexible adaptation depending on environmental potentiality, linguistics, and perhaps shared comparative ethnographic traits between current Cushitic speakers that with a fair margin for error speculatively trace origin to a previous point in time, although setting a timer on this or claiming it is as ancient as the tribal ethnogenesis continuum of original Cuhsites, something I interpret your claim to be, taking the bold stance of issuing knowledge about the ones who lived in Egypt/Sudan in the nascent stage long before migrating, a chiefly ridiculous claim.

 

[Hamzza]

Don't move the goalpost. You attributed the Somali swords to Peninsular Arabs, which is incorrect, the design is very different and not derivative. And now you're in a very weird fashion mentioning the use of the word 'sayf,' discussing a strictly semantic issue, thinking it justifies this silly thread trying to clearly downplay Somali cultural heritage, not that it would do that even if it was inspired from somewhere else, although the evidence burden has not yet been met in any capacity. The name of the swords in Somali is (bilawa, bilawai), so clearly there is a linguistic precedent that, again, sets a separate discussion in motion, still makes this sayf business debunked.

Sayf just means "sword". There is no particular style of sword that can be attributed as derivative from Arabic swordsmithing that can explain the Somali swords. It is very much indigenous. Where the smithing technology came from is very much irrelevant to the topic and likely not linear. Still, that is basically the history of swordsmithing everywhere; technology gets diffused geographically and then separate cultivation of smithing philosophy evolves in situ in respective local cultures. Somalis always made spears, if you can make spears, you can make other weapons as well.

Furthermore, you claimed the original Cushites never made swords. You don't know the original Cushites, what they did or did not do, other than clearly obvious things about subsistence of being broad-based agro-pastoralists that could take specialized and flexible adaptation depending on environmental potentiality, linguistics, and perhaps shared comparative ethnographic traits between current Cushitic speakers that with a fair margin for error speculatively trace origin to a previous point in time, although setting a timer on this or claiming it is as ancient as the tribal ethnogenesis continuum of original Cuhsites, something I interpret your claim to be, taking the bold stance of issuing knowledge about the ones who lived in Egypt/Sudan in the nascent stage long before migrating, a chiefly ridiculous claim.

I urge you to re-read the first post sxb, i have never claimed arabs teached somalis how to make swords, infact i said that the somali dagger(bilaawo) is very old among somalis is proved by the ancient rock engravings in bur haybe.

The name of the swords in Somali is (bilawa, bilawai), so clearly there is a linguistic precedent that, again, sets a separate discussion in motion, still makes this sayf business debunked.

Be this as it may, it is a fact that the Somali departed so unwillingly from this particular type, that when they started forging swords for themselves they remained faithful to the same model, merely making the blade longer . They adopted the Semitic word for »sword» (säyf or sëf), but Reinisch's texts show that they often continue to call this bilawa or bilâo, i. e. »dagger».

 

[Som]

Of course, somali swords were designed independently by somali blacksmiths. Who suggested otherwise?
But we call them seyf wich is arabic word.
View attachment 224281

1. Somali dagger sword 2. Arab-somali sabre​

The somali dagger called billao or toorey has a longer version which is still called billao. Sayf would be the term for an Arab type of sword. The billao design looks nothing like the arab sabre

 

[Hamzza]

The somali dagger called billao or toorey has a longer version which is still called billao. Sayf would be the term for an Arab type of sword. The billao design looks nothing like the arab sabre

Bilaawa with longer blade is called "seef" in somali.
There is no indigenous word for sword in all cushitic languages the national weapon was spear for these people.

 

[Som]

Bilaawa with longer blade is called "seef" in somali.
There is no indigenous word for sword in all cushitic languages the national weapon was spear for these people.

Billawa has many length and it's still called bilaawa. This oriental weapons website sells it as "billao sword" it is considered a short sword

Oriental-Arms: Very Good Early and Big Billao Sword from Somalia

 

[Som]

1. Sword and sabre
The sword and sabre are unknown to the original Cushitic culture. In Abyssinia these weapons were certainly introduced by the South-Arabs, perhaps two thousand years ago or more, but they never became popular, Spear and javelin remaining the national arms." The Oromo were using no swords when they first made their appearance in history, as late as the XVI century; as a matter of fact, they appeared to have no knowledge of metals whatsoever.
View attachment 224141

The Somali, who as well as the Danakil had obtained iron from the Semites centuries before the Oromo, have long had, and still retain, a typical cutting weapon, a straight bladed dagger of a design peculiar to them alone . That this weapon is traditionally old among them, is proved by the ancient Somali rock engravings discovered by Graziosi at Bur Haybe which faithfully reproduce the unmistakable shape of their hilts and straight double edged blades.
View attachment 224142
The antiquity of this type of dagger would prove even greater if it were possible to identify it, as Révoil maintained, with that worn at the belt by Punt chiefs as depicted in the Deir-el-Bahri wall paintings.
Be this as it may, it is a fact that the Somali departed so unwillingly from this particular type, that when they started forging swords for themselves they remained faithful to the same model, merely making the blade longer . They adopted the Semitic word for »sword» (säyf or sëf), but Reinisch's texts show that they often continue to call this bilawa or bilâo, i. e. »dagger».
View attachment 224143
To this day, swords and sabres are very rare among them, as is the case with most Cushitic tribes.

Your own sources says somalis adopted the word sayf but still use billao to indicate short swords with Somali design.
Anyway Somali warfare was mainly based on ambushes and quick combat, that's why throwing spears and arrows where more widespread. For close combat they used billao either in a dagger version or a longer short sword version.
Somalis , Oromo and afars also use Jile or Qolxad in af Somali which is a big dagger that has basically almost short sword size.

 

[Som]

You should also remember that the sword that conquered the world was the Roman gladius, it was a short sword. Basically a big dagger, not much different that the size of mani Qolxad daggers and Billawe
Blade length: 45–68 cm (18–27 in)
Length: 60–85 cm (24–33 in)

https://www.primaryhomeworkhelp.co.uk/romans/images/soldiers/sword1.jpg

 

[Som]

Quote from an Italian explorer in the 1800s. This guy was one of the first explorers of the horn. In this passage he describes a Somali native doctor who used common items as surgical tools.
After talking about the somali doctor's tools and medicines he adds QUOTE con la solita daga o lunga spada somala a due taglienti formavano tutto il suo armamentario chirurgico. Google translate: with the usual Somali dagger or long two-edged sword they formed all his surgical armamentarium.
Obviously the Italian explorer witnessed a long billao used as a surgical tool and called it sword (Spada in Italian)

Nel paese degli aromi

books.google.it

 

[Som]

This book from Bombay Geographical society 1844 clearly uses the term Somali sword and compares it to the one used by french artillery

The Somali sword is under 20 inches in length, broad, straight, and double-edged, like those used in the French artillery

The Transactions of the Bombay Geographical Society

books.google.it

 

[The alchemist]

I urge you to re-read the first post sxb, i have never claimed arabs teached somalis how to make swords, infact i said that the somali dagger(bilaawo) is very old among somalis is proved by the ancient rock engravings in bur haybe.

The whole name of the thread is "Asiatic influence on somali culture". The first paragraph made a case of how it is likely an introduction.. you know, the nonsense about the "original Cushitic culture", the Habashi iron technology being likely Semitic (it might be, as they source a lot from their South Arabian heritage, or it can be an introduction from further north in Northeast Africa and/or other trade links), and that the interior Ethiopians lacked the knowhow altogether, bringing to light the "Semitic" iron introduced to Somalis and Afar. By the way, the interior Omotic speakers like Aari Blacksmiths are fundamentally stratified for millennia because they took a specialized artisan role in Ethiopia and got marginalized because of this. That tradition goes back very far because there are genetic distinctions along those lines relative to their co-ethnic counterpart that deal with agriculture.

You clearly tackled this topic from a materialistic point of view. This was not a basic semantic issue for you, otherwise, there would be no point in bringing Somali swords to light under "Asiatic influence" including physical illustrations. And the "seyf" response after the logical, clear-cut simple take from Som. I suggest you write with more intention and bring forth your exact point without seeming like you're obscuring, trying to weasel ideas that clearly are out there to undermine the integrity of our culture.

I have no issue with any Asiatic influence, as well. However, then, I would require you to write down your evidence for us readers to respond amply or learn something. Somalis had traded with even Greco-Romans since ancient and antiquity (I might guess that the Buur Heybe inscriptions trace further back in time). I have to emphasize the sources of metallurgy can be, again, not linear, because of the complex trade links that arose ever since the Iron Age. At the end of the day, the smelting techniques are original to us either way, shown by the outcome of distinct sword and spear characteristics.

We cannot rule out an independent or bidirectional diffusion of cultural commodification settling in different trade effect localities, therefore ironwork technology can be of such consequence. Overall, this is not an archeological reality, just speculation that cannot be placed over other hypotheses since the archaeologic groundwork has been a scant process in the Horn altogether. I have no problem in accepting an integrated broader cultural network in ancient times; there just isn’t any conclusive evidence yet for the matter of metallurgy to settle on this explanation, even between Somalis and Ethiopians. We also need to remember that indigenous achievements have been marginalized by researchers in most of history, and to really find more information, people need to look away from urban centers and into peripheral areas to find source material that can cement an evidentiary basis for cultural evolution or relationship between external elements and endemic contributions.

As I mentioned above, there was a commercial revolution that went on during the Iron Age, so it is likely that East Africa, unlike other parts of Africa (central-west parts of Africa and other places of Sub-Saharan Africa developed the technology before the Anatolian diffusion entered North Africa), might have gotten an external influence. Here is the thing though, no one will say that swords in India are Anatolian, despite iron technology ultimately sourced from Anatolia, or any other place that naturally got this diffusion in the whole of Eurasia, for that matter.

 

[The alchemist]

You should also remember that the sword that conquered the world was the Roman gladius, it was a short sword. Basically a big dagger, not much different that the size of mani Qolxad daggers and Billawe
Blade length: 45–68 cm (18–27 in)
Length: 60–85 cm (24–33 in)

https://www.primaryhomeworkhelp.co.uk/romans/images/soldiers/sword1.jpg

That is a fact, Roman swords were not epically large. I can see how that was more resource-effective, and less energy-intensive per person. But those would have been not as powerful in the days when heavy armor was in widespread use like in medieval Europe.

This is a digression (sword topic); the Japanese Katana is made from an inferior technique to what you saw from European long-swords, or what is generally made there in medieval times. Ignoring those shortcomings, you can say the Japanese overcame those quality restrictions through a layered elaborate process. The sword design and resilience potentiality also demand other types of modes of use than other larger durable swords that require their respective mastery of use as well.

 

[Al-Ma'mun]

So the Oromos who fought and raided the Habesha Kingdom prior to their expansion and which the Xabeshi King had to build forts to contain them during the reign of Amda Seyon didn't know Iron tech or swords? Sounds like a load of horse shit to me

Somalis,Oromos and Afars were just as Sophisticated as those Habeshas in terms of weaponry only things like armor in the Islamic Asian style would come from South Asia

 

[Juke]

Of course, somali swords were designed independently by somali blacksmiths. Who suggested otherwise?
But we call them seyf wich is arabic word.
View attachment 224281

1. Somali dagger sword 2. Arab-somali sabre​

The double-edged swords are indigenous

However single-edged, curved swords; like all sabres whether: middle eastern, Indian, European come from the Sinosphere via Turko-Mongols

 

[Helios]

The somali dagger called billao or toorey has a longer version which is still called billao. Sayf would be the term for an Arab type of sword. The billao design looks nothing like the arab sabre

Your and @The alchemist's contributions were good but I wanted to mention that until they encountered Turkic peoples after Islam, Arabs traditionally used straight blades - sabres were adopted later.

 

[Som]

So the Oromos who fought and raided the Habesha Kingdom prior to their expansion and which the Xabeshi King had to build forts to contain them during the reign of Amda Seyon didn't know Iron tech or swords? Sounds like a load of horse shit to me

Somalis,Oromos and Afars were just as Sophisticated as those Habeshas in terms of weaponry only things like armor in the Islamic Asian style would come from South Asia

Yes. I doubt they had no knowledge of swords. We should remember that Oromo aren't the maskiin colonized people they often claim to be. They literally destroyed the Ethiopian monarchy and ruled most of Ethiopia for a century ,between the 1700s and the 1800s many Ethiopian royals were Oromo and the royal court at some point even switched to Amharic/ge'ez to Oromo ad an official language

 

[Hamzza]

3. Musical instruments
Influences of the oriental "Culture" have also reached Somali-land in the field of musical instruments, though it has often been said that the old somali didn't have any musical instruments at all. Paulitschke, having written that "they [Northeast Africans] do not cultivate instrumental music", goes on however to give a short description of flutes, horns, bells, drums, castanets and wooden pipes as belonging to cushitic culture and known to the Somali. A more complete list was given by Puccioni, who added to the previously mentioned Somali instruments also another type of (wooden, cylindrical) trumpet (as distinct from horn-trumpets), Triton shells, and lastly a so-called "clarinet-trumpet".

Triton-shell trumpets: somali and sumatra
These last two items certainly have direct Asiatic connections. Triton shell trumpets are so common, that they deserve no more than a passing reference. Quoting Waitz' opinion, that the similar Hova and Sakalava "shell-horns" should be considered Malayo-polynesian, and von Pappenheim's, that on account of their Madagascar name they should be regarded as South-Arab. Recent classifications, anyhow, include South-East Asia, Indonesia, Madagascar and East Africa in the distribution area of the transverse or side-blown conch trumpet.

All Somali Triton shell trumpets are sideblown, so that this fits in nicely into Hornbostel's "Hova" class. We need to note, however, that the apex-blown, and not the side-blown type, is predominant in Indonesia as well as in India.