First tanks in africa were used against somalis?

[Somali_patriotic]

Not only RAF were first used against the dervishes
Apparently even the tanks who were first used in 1916 were used against him

Sayidka balaya ka dhacday wallahi

 

[mohammdov]

The first use of aircraft was in 1912 in Libya and tanks Its first use was in September 1916 on the Western Front. So why would you send tanks to an area where primitive people lived who were still fighting with horses and spears?

 

[Three Moons]

The first use of aircraft was in 1912 in Libya and tanks Its first use was in September 1916 on the Western Front. So why would you send tanks to an area where primitive people lived who were still fighting with horses and spears?

That was against the Ottoman Empire, the Dervish still remain the first African power to put up so much resistance to invoke aerial combat. Secondly, those so-called primitive people had tens of thousands of rifles, manufactured their own gunpowder and bullets, and maintained one of the most elaborate fortress systems in Africa with walls nine feet thick, which could not suffer damage without heavy artillery from a tank.

Why is it that individuals with foreign ancestry like yourself always maintain these extreme viewpoints about Somalis?

 

[mohammdov]

That was against the Ottoman Empire, the Dervish still remain the first African power to put up so much resistance to invoke aerial combat. Secondly, those so-called primitive people had tens of thousands of rifles, manufactured their own gunpowder and bullets, and maintained one of the most elaborate fortress systems in Africa with walls nine feet thick, which could not suffer damage without heavy artillery from a tank.

Why is it that individuals with foreign ancestry like yourself always maintain these extreme viewpoints about Somalis?

They did not make anything. The castles were built by Yemenis, and they were built in a Yemeni style. This is the backwardness I am talking about. The world fights with planes and modern weapons, and you were still using castles and horses That's why they sent six planes and destroyed everything easily
It was not the greatest resistance. It was more like a civil war between tribes loyal to Britain and others to Italy and Abyssinia
Just go and read about Mahdist War, Rif War Italian,Senussi war
These are the ones who really fought colonialism, not some Somalis fighting over the qabiil
in the Rif War. It was the numbers of Europeans that the Moroccans faced was 465,000 soldiers
+200 aircraft
While the Dervishes were defeated against 12 aircraft and less than 2,000
I have no foreign origins, I am 100% Somali
Do you know the reason for this? The Somalis were not an extremist people in Islam like the people in North Africa and the Middle East. The Somalis became very religious in the nineties and after But before this, they did not know what jihad was .

 

[tyrannicalmanager]

The first use of aircraft was in 1912 in Libya and tanks Its first use was in September 1916 on the Western Front. So why would you send tanks to an area where primitive people lived who were still fighting with horses and spears?

The first counterinsurgency done by the RAF was done in Somalia

They did not make anything. The castles were built by Yemenis, and they were built in a Yemeni style. This is the backwardness I am talking about. The world fights with planes and modern weapons, and you were still using castles and horses That's why they sent six planes and destroyed everything easily

ok, the castles were contracted by a Yemenis mason, what wrong with that, it was still built by Muslims?

It was not the greatest resistance. It was more like a civil war between tribes loyal to Britain and others to Italy and Abyssinia

Just go and read about Mahdist War, Rif War Italian,Senussi war
These are the ones who really fought colonialism, not some Somalis fighting over the qabiil

the Libyan fighter literally fought against pro-Italian tribes. I don't know why you want to discredit Somali Muslims fighting against colonialists so badly.

in the Rif War. It was the numbers of Europeans that the Moroccans faced was 465,000 soldiers
+200 aircraft
While the Dervishes were defeated against 12 aircraft and less than 2,000

you're comparing conventional warfare to guerilla warfare.

 

[Three Moons]

They did not make anything.

There are literally contemporary accounts of the Dervish manufacturing their own gunpowder and bullets. They even had a German mechanic working for them as an indentured servant.

The castles were built by Yemenis,

No they weren’t, be serious bro! Do you really think thousands of Yemeni workers left their British protectorate, then crossed the Red Sea under the British nose and began working on a massive fortress system in Africa for a Somali power hostile to the British? It was literally three of four Yemeni masons who were EMPLOYED by the Sayyid to help establish his permanent capital.

The funding and manpower came from the Somalis. The Sayyid also had a very detailed plan on how his capital should look like, with specific areas designated for the tombs of his parents, tombs for respected elders and sheikhs, an armoury, a garden, a caravanserai, a granary, etc

and they were built in a Yemeni style.

Then where are the Yemeni versions of Taleh? Their fortresses look nothing like ours.

This is the backwardness I am talking about. The world fights with planes and modern weapons,

Stop lying, most of the world wasn’t, for most of the Dervish Wars the Royal Air Force didn’t even exist yet. In fact it wasn’t founded until 1918, and was the first national air force for a reason.

What matters is that we were still fighting when the rest of the continent had already thrown in the towel.

and you were still using castles and horses

As were the French, the Germans and the British. Spielberg even made a great movie about it called ‘War Horse’.

That's why they sent six planes and destroyed everything easily

That is an example of shock and awe much the same way it only took two nukes for Japan to surrender because it was a completely new weapon like the airplane was in the 1920s for an organised military society in Africa, and they didn’t destroy everything easily at all because there are tons of fortresses scattered across the Somali landscape from that period.

It was not the greatest resistance. It was more like a civil war between tribes loyal to Britain and others to Italy and Abyssinia

Typical qabiil take, let me guess; the Mullah ragdolled your clan and now you want to diminish what is recognised by academics as one of the greatest colonial resistance movements in African history?

My clan got ragdolled too, well boohoo. He ragdolled his own clan too.

Just go and read about Mahdist War, Rif War Italian,Senussi war
These are the ones who really fought colonialism, not some Somalis fighting over the qabiil
in the Rif War. It was the numbers of Europeans that the Moroccans faced was 465,000 soldiers
+200 aircraft

Mahdists had a much larger population than Somalia, and still got smoked in just three years without a major new weapon like the airplane. The Rif and Senussi wars enjoyed Ottoman, German and Soviet support in terms of military hardware and manpower. The Dervish only received diplomatic recognition from them, and still held the imperialists at bay for decades.

While the Dervishes were defeated against 12 aircraft and less than 2,000

That was only one campaign and again you don’t seem to understand the battlefield eraser known as ‘shock and awe’. Twelve airplanes against a military society equipped with only maxim guns and rifles might as well be 200 airplanes because it had the same psychological impact.

Nobody has calculated the total manpower the British dispatched over the span of 20 years, or those of Abyssinia and Italy but it would be in the tens of thousands, including casualties.

The British commanders also commented that the Dervish made a strategic mistake when they abandoned their forts because the bombs from airplanes weren’t strong enough to destroy their fortifications.

If the Sayyid hadn’t died from natural causes, the Dervish wars would have re-ignited and continued well into the 1930s and perhaps WWII. The fact that we don’t speak a European language, practice Christianity or have been culturally changed by the Imperialists is because of the various resistance movements across the Somali peninsula and which involved individuals from EVERY clan.

In fact had the British not ceded away our lands, it would have been as if they had never been there in the first place.

I have no foreign origins, I am 100% Somali

I’m pretty sure you commented once that you have Yemeni heritage.

Do you know the reason for this? The Somalis were not an extremist people in Islam like the people in North Africa and the Middle East. The Somalis became very religious in the nineties and after But before this, they did not know what jihad was .

Mannnnnn the only example of an Islamic empire conquering a Christian empire through jihad in Africa before the 19th century originated from Somalia. What the hell are you talking about?

 

[tyrannicalmanager]

Do you know the reason for this? The Somalis were not an extremist people in Islam like the people in North Africa and the Middle East. The Somalis became very religious in the nineties and after But before this, they did not know what jihad was.

Bait used to be believable.

 

[mohammdov]

There are literally contemporary accounts of the Dervish manufacturing their own gunpowder and bullets. They even had a German mechanic working for them as an indentured servant.



No they weren’t, be serious bro! Do you really think thousands of Yemeni workers left their British protectorate, then crossed the Red Sea under the British nose and began working on a massive fortress system in Africa for a Somali power hostile to the British? It was literally three of four Yemeni masons who were EMPLOYED by the Sayyid to help establish his permanent capital.

The funding and manpower came from the Somalis. The Sayyid also had a very detailed plan on how his capital should look like, with specific areas designated for the tombs of his parents, tombs for respected elders and sheikhs, an armoury, a garden, a caravanserai, a granary, etc



Then where are the Yemeni versions of Taleh? Their fortresses look nothing like ours.



Stop lying, most of the world wasn’t, for most of the Dervish Wars the Royal Air Force didn’t even exist yet. In fact it wasn’t founded until 1918, and was the first national air force for a reason.

What matters is that we were still fighting when the rest of the continent had already thrown in the towel.



As were the French, the Germans and the British. Spielberg even made a great movie about it called ‘War Horse’.



That is an example of shock and awe much the same way it only took two nukes for Japan to surrender because it was a completely new weapon like the airplane was in the 1920s for an organised military society in Africa, and they didn’t destroy everything easily at all because there are tons of fortresses scattered across the Somali landscape from that period.



Typical qabiil take, let me guess; the Mullah ragdolled your clan and now you want to diminish what is recognised by academics as one of the greatest colonial resistance movements in African history?

My clan got ragdolled too, well boohoo. He ragdolled his own clan too.



Mahdists had a much larger population than Somalia, and still got smoked in just three years without a major new weapon like the airplane. The Rif and Senussi wars enjoyed Ottoman, German and Soviet support in terms of military hardware and manpower. The Dervish only received diplomatic recognition from them, and still held the imperialists at bay for decades.




That was only one campaign and again you don’t seem to understand the battlefield eraser known as ‘shock and awe’. Twelve airplanes against a military society equipped with only maxim guns and rifles might as well be 200 airplanes because it had the same psychological impact.

Nobody has calculated the total manpower the British dispatched over the span of 20 years, or those of Abyssinia and Italy but it would be in the tens of thousands, including casualties.

The British commanders also commented that the Dervish made a strategic mistake when they abandoned their forts because the bombs from airplanes weren’t strong enough to destroy their fortifications.

If the Sayyid hadn’t died from natural causes, the Dervish wars would have re-ignited and continued well into the 1930s and perhaps WWII. The fact that we don’t speak a European language, practice Christianity or have been culturally changed by the Imperialists is because of the various resistance movements across the Somali peninsula and which involved individuals from EVERY clan.

In fact had the British not ceded away our lands, it would have been as if they had never been there in the first place.



I’m pretty sure you commented once that you have Yemeni heritage.



Mannnnnn the only example of an Islamic empire conquering a Christian empire through jihad in Africa before the 19th century originated from Somalia. What the hell are you talking about?

The forts were built by Yemenis. Why do you think it was difficult for 200 Yemeni workers to reach the Somali coast? Do you think there were heavy guards on the coast? No, it was not. The rifles also came from Yemen and sometimes from Djibouti
They resemble Yemeni forts. If these forts were built by Somalis, give me other forts built by Somalis ??

Most of the African continent did not surrender during that period. The Libyans were defeated in the 1930s and the Moroccans in 1927
These revolutionaries, Abdul Karim Al-Khattabi and Omar Al-Mukhtar, built their armies by uniting their people without any division between them, but you made the leaders of your army from one tribe and launched devastating raids on the Nomads.
Do you expect anyone to stand with you?

And no one was going to make you a Christian. The Christian mission was expelled from the local population. It's not dervishes. You're repeating the things you learned from your tribe.
The Somalis were the reason that part of their lands became under the control of Abyssinia, and they were the ones who brought them there

I haven't talked to you all day and I'm trying to convince you, but each of us sees the matter from his own perspective. Your tribe sees them as heroes. I have no problem. My tribe sees them as thieves who killed women and children and stole livestock. This is how it is.

 

[Somali_patriotic]

Why do you think it was difficult for 200 Yemeni workers to reach the Somali coast? Do you think there were heavy guards on the coast?

Because there were no "200" yemeni workers
They were like 4 and only built the fort in eyl and contributed to that in taleex, the rest were built by somalis.
And also yes there was heavy guard on the coast lol.

The rifles also came from Yemen and sometimes from Djibouti

Majority of the time the Rifles came from dijibouti and little from yemen, those who were brought from yemen were actually mainly imported by boqorka meaning it's somalis who brought the rifles from yemen not yemenis,
They were a major arm traffickers.

Most of the African continent did not surrender during that period. The Libyans were defeated in the 1930s and the Moroccans in 1927

Nuh uh dervishes were the only islamic state to survive the scramble of africa.

These revolutionaries, Abdul Karim Al-Khattabi and Omar Al-Mukhtar, built their armies by uniting their people without any division between them, but you made the leaders of your army from one tribe and launched devastating raids on the Nomads.

This is a pure cope lol, who do you think was hunting al khattabi and put 20,000$ on his head? The Moroccan sultan, He was leading his tribe and wasn't even a liberator lol, an equalivent to him isn't Muhammad abdullah hassan.
Omar al Mukhtar was fighting for the Ottoman empire tho? I still like assad al sahara.
while Al mahdi of sudan The brits themselves said Muhammad abdullah hassan was like him or even a big threat for them.
Praising the other while insulting the latter

And no one was going to make you a Christian. The Christian mission was expelled from the local population. It's not dervishes. You're repeating the things you learned from your tribe.

Muhammad abdullah hassan started his jihad because he saw a group of young somalis called james and john stuff, when he asked about their religion they said "we're Christians".
They were expelled by the local population? You sure about that?

The Somalis were the reason that part of their lands became under the control of Abyssinia, and they were the ones who brought them there

Why are you lying? It was a gift for menelik by British and the italians in Brussels act 1890s.

Your tribe sees them as heroes. I have no problem. My tribe sees them as thieves who killed women and children and stole livestock. This is how it is.

Everyone should see them as heroes
Al mahdi killed 3million sudanis yet they praise him.
Victim mentality should disappear in somalis.

 

[Zak12]

Most of the African continent did not surrender during that period

Nigga what on earth are you talking about? Nearly the entire continent was colonized by 1900 with the exception of Ethiopia and Morocco. As for the Libyans, well they were under Ottoman rule lol. Somalis resisted the likes of the Abysinnians, Portuguese and put up a good fight against the Italians and British. The North Africans were being cucked hard by the Turks for centuries prior to the 1800s. I respect the Moroccans however.

 

[Emir of Zayla]

The first use of aircraft was in 1912 in Libya and tanks Its first use was in September 1916 on the Western Front. So why would you send tanks to an area where primitive people lived who were still fighting with horses and spears?

Who didn’t fight with horses during those times dumbass? And we had guns obv. You had whole European powers using cavalry horses

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horses_in_World_War_I

 

[Cartan Boos]

The first use of aircraft was in 1912 in Libya and tanks Its first use was in September 1916 on the Western Front. So why would you send tanks to an area where primitive people lived who were still fighting with horses and spears?

They were fighting with guns, kkkk

 

[Three Moons]

The forts were built by Yemenis. Why do you think it was difficult for 200 Yemeni workers to reach the Somali coast?

The fact that you actually think a massive fortress like Taleh was built by only ‘200 workers’ says enough about your knowledge with regards to its construction.

There were only a few supervising masons from Yemen part of the construction, possibly led by an Ottoman;

“The Mullah commenced the construction of Taleh about 1913; prior to this there were no buildings there. It was built under the supervision of Yemeni Arab masons engaged for the purpose, possibly with a Turk as architect though on this point I have found no good information.” - The Geographical Journal - Volume 78 - Page 127

This is no different from medieval Italian engineers and masons being commissioned by the French, British, Spanish and Dutch militaries to construct the Bastion Fort in their countries. The manpower and funding to construct those star forts however were locally derived.

Similarly, besides the Somalis funding the fortress’ construction, it would have taken thousands of Somalis in terms of manpower to built not only Taleh but all of the other fortresses in the span of a decade. In what imaginary reality do you think ‘200 Yemeni workers’ could achieve that and remain in the country for so long?

When in the 1960, parts of Taleh, that were damaged in the 1920s, were being restored by the Somali Police Force they literally needed 150 people just to reconstruct some of the walls, but you want us to believe that a similar number of people could construct the ENTIRE fortress complex on their own along with a dozen other ones at the same time?

Do you think there were heavy guards on the coast? No, it was not.

The British literally had a chokehold in Yemen and patrolled the Red Sea.

The rifles also came from Yemen and sometimes from Djibouti

Hiding arm shipments in boats under the guise of goods is not the same as several dozen boats filled with Yemenis heading for the Somali coast, there is no record of this, and the British kept track of all activities for a good reason.

Majority of weapon shipments came through Djibouti and the Northern Sultanates where the British had no influence or sway.

They resemble Yemeni forts.

No they don’t, show us examples?

If these forts were built by Somalis, give me other forts built by Somalis ??

The Dervish fortresses don’t resemble ANY other fortress design. That is the point you keep missing. Their military architecture was unique to them, there is nothing like it on that scale in other parts of Africa or the Middle East that resembles their elaborate conical and cylindrical design.

Most of the African continent did not surrender during that period. The Libyans were defeated in the 1930s and the Moroccans in 1927

Don’t spread disinformation. I’m well aware of their histories and what you are describing are uprisings that happened long after the Dervish defeat, and occurred in the mid-1920s. However when the Dervish were at their peak in the 1910s both the Moroccans and the Libyans were under the Imperial yoke.

Besides the Campaign against the Somali Sultanates by Italy also raged on until 1927.

These revolutionaries, Abdul Karim Al-Khattabi and Omar Al-Mukhtar, built their armies by uniting their people without any division between them, but you made the leaders of your army from one tribe and launched devastating raids on the Nomads.
Do you expect anyone to stand with you?

They were all clan leaders, and even today those leaders you are praising, are vilified by certain sections of Moroccan and Libyan societies, because the clan-disease is strong and ruins many minds.

And no one was going to make you a Christian. The Christian mission was expelled from the local population.

Its difficult to take your post serious. Prior to colonization, the only Christian country in sub-Saharan Africa was Abyssinia, today more than 50% of Africa is Christian.

It's not dervishes. You're repeating the things you learned from your tribe.
The Somalis were the reason that part of their lands became under the control of Abyssinia, and they were the ones who brought them there

Somalis funded and equipped Menelik’s expeditions right? You are not serious.

I haven't talked to you all day and I'm trying to convince you, but each of us sees the matter from his own perspective. Your tribe sees them as heroes. I have no problem. My tribe sees them as thieves who killed women and children and stole livestock. This is how it is.

My clan sees them in a negative light too, but I don’t care about my clan. I have a mind of my own, I’m not a slave to a hive-mind. I can analyse texts and come to my own conclusion with regards to a historic subject. I don’t need to be spoonfed propaganda.

I suggest you did the same.