Somalia’s New President Had a Tangible Role In Somaliland’s Genocide says Muse Bihi Abdi

[SOMALI GENERAL]

Reich? Does that mean blond eyed regime?

Come get me and bring to this blond-eyed, reich. I'll be serving like you've never seen

A state that is primarily for Cushitic Somalis.

 

[Steamdevolopment]

A state that is primarily for Cushitic Somalis.

I ain't serving anything darker than a tan

Spoiler: JK

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[jugjugwacwac]

You didn't answer Come one, I don't have all day

Are you Somali hating guy, calling us s?

I believe we are a homogeneous ethnic group artificially divided along clan lines, so to answer ur question of course I don't think Somalilanders are a distinct people. In fact no sane Somalilander believes that. I'm a Somali nationalist/unionist so I feel offended even being asked such a question.

 

[Steamdevolopment]

I believe we are a homogeneous ethnic group artificially divided along clan lines, so to answer ur question of course I don't think Somalilanders are a distinct people. In fact no sane Somalilander believes that. I'm a Somali nationalist/unionist so I feel offended even being asked such a question.

Have you ever been to Somnet or the dark parts of Somali youtube? Some landers really do believe that they are very distinct from other Somalis

So you think SL independence is going no-where? I see their quest for independence as very serious but also dominated by the elites. Do you think the average folks care?

 

[Prince of Lasanod]

U think I'm saying ur clan was at the mercy of the SNM because I want to feel all big and bad as an Isaaq, but personally I don't seek pride from qabiil. Any observation I make about qabiils is just my objective reading of the situation and of history. Based on what I know it's a fact that in 1991 after the SNm and USC toppled Siyaad Barres government that the Dhulbahante were in a significantly weaker position than the SNM.

If u think I'm biased or that I give a shit about qabiil, well i'll be the first one to tell u Somaliland is Ethiopia's . Sxb I don't care for qabiil, if I did we both know I wouldn't be able to admit that. I'm Ciidagale and wallahi a Ciidagale man and a Dhulbahante r the same to me, I don't feel any closer to the Ciidagale at all.

I am just correcting a mistake you made. The largest military bases of the old Somali government were in Sool and Buuhoodle which were both inherited by the Dhulbahante, it was so much weapons, tanks and ammunition that Abdullahi Yusuf even burned some of them down. SNM were only able to attack civilians, children and unarmed men.

Qabiil will never go away, it's here to stay. Neighborhoods are divided along the sub sub sub sub clan level. It's a fantasy to believe it will. Better just to acknowledge that it's here to stay for a long time, than advocate for unrealistic things (i.e a government based on meritocracy). How can you advocate for such things when for example the HG who are foreigners in Lower Shabelle(came in the 90s) are now stealing Biimaal lands with the help of the SNA?

 

[Steamdevolopment]

I am just correcting a mistake you made. The largest military bases of the old Somali government were in Sool and Buuhodle which were both inherited by the Dhulbahante, it was so much weapons, tanks and ammunition that Abdullahi Yusuf even burned some of them down. SNM were only able to attack civilians, children and unarmed men.

Qabiil will never go away, it's here to stay. Neighborhoods are divided along the sub sub sub sub clan level. It's a fantasy to believe it will. Better just to acknoledge that it's here to stay for a long time, than advocate for unrealistic things (i.e a government based on meritocracy).

For a grace period we need to ask each clan to bring their most elequent and educated to be a part of future government until such a time that people don't have to rely on qabil.

 

[jugjugwacwac]

Have you ever been to Somnet or the dark parts of Somali youtube? Some landers really do believe that they are very distinct from other Somalis

So you think SL independence is going no-where? I see their quest for independence as very serious but also dominated by the elites. Do you think the average folks care?

Yeah I've been all over the net so I've seen what they say, but it's just posturing nothing more. And now that Xamar and the south has had some life breathed into it in the last couple of years the posturing has increased in proportion to the threat they perceive Xamar to pose.

As for Somaliland getting recognized that's a pipe-dream only the fools believe in. But unfortunately we as Somalis have a large percentage of fools, so we take whatever our clan politicians and elders tell us as an article of faith. So yes, the average folks do care only because they have been hoodwinked and bamboozled by the Isaaq elites to buy into this secessionist delusion. It's a project by the elites for the elites, since they get to maintain a monopoly on power and resources which isn't possible in a union. They sell Somaliland as an entity for the common man, the average Isaaq, but nothing could be further from the truth.

 

[Boqor Geeljire252]

Its True that cant deny it was harsh response But the question is was it genocide?? I say No and i want to be convinced otherwise

Whether you call it genocide or not, this doesn’t change the fact MSB's regime committed grave human rights violations and the worst form of crimes against humanity against specific groups for no other reason except their clan backgrounds.

“The dictator unleashed the military against the Isaac population with quasi-genocidal results. Isaacs were potential suspects everywhere, in the south they lost their jobs, they were detained, some executed, and subsequently their main cities fell pray to bloody destruction. Hargeisa, capital of the North (Somaliland), was bombed and destroyed in 1988. These atrocities are being labeled ‘quasi-genocide’, since Isaac was systematically exterminated. This is different to the Rwanda, where even, ‘half –blood’ was potentially targets for extermination. Until the end there were Isaacs in the cabinet, something would not have been thinkable in Rwanda.”

http://www.cja.org/downloads/Hersi_int_crim_pros_for_Somali_officials_dissertation.pdf


"Siad Barre's exterminating campaigns normal, even when that was directed at their clan, such as the case of the Hawiye, who underwent one of the most vicious atrocities during his reign"

The Suicidal State in Somalia: The Rise and Fall of the Siad Barre Regime

 

[XamarCade]

But I told u it happened to my own family. My aunt witnessed it with her own eyes. Anyway, there's no reasoning with u, ur like XamarCade, just another one of those sociopathic Somalis who would kill, rape and loot with no remorse if rule of law broke down, I'm sure of it.

You don't know me sxb stop assuming things about ppl u don't know. I'm sick of seeing man made famine striking our ppl every time there's a drought I only want the best for whole of Somalia and Somalis. I see a lot of landers online and in real life talking shit about rest of Somalia and naming anyone they don't agree with "faqash", they even go as far as calling Ethiopians there brother, and let's not even discuss who funds alkebaab, they're trying to justify all this crap now with an alleged "genocide " so they can further destroy Somalia and push there ictiraaf bullshit? f*ck that

 

[Steamdevolopment]

Yeah I've been all over the net so I've seen what they say, but it's just posturing nothing more. And now that Xamar and the south has had some life breathed into it in the last couple of years the posturing has increased in proportion to the threat they perceive Xamar to pose.

As for Somaliland getting recognized that's a pipe-dream only the fools believe in. But unfortunately we as Somalis have a large percentage of fools, so we take whatever our clan politicians and elders tell us as an article of faith. So yes, the average folks do care only because they have been hoodwinked and bamboozled by the Isaaq elites to buy into this secessionist delusion. It's a project by the elites for the elites, since they get to maintain a monopoly on power and resources which isn't possible in a union. They sell Somaliland as an entity for the common man, the average Isaaq, but nothing could be further from the truth.

I guess so, but it looks increasingly unlikely. They've had 26 years without a functioning central government and not even then been able to make an argument for statehood convincing enough.

Once Somali central government regains power it will challenge the statehood and as late as 2002 Germany and other heave-weight nations reitrated their commitment to Somali sovereignty, and international law is not on their side either as their is a presumption against statehood and criteria's that aren't fulfilled.

That said, I do think a new constitutional make up has to made, maybe a Belgium route, with a co-equal union.

 

[TheMadMullah]

Whether you call it genocide or not, this doesn’t change the fact MSB's regime committed grave human rights violations and the worst form of crimes against humanity against specific groups for no other reason except their clan backgrounds.


http://www.cja.org/downloads/Hersi_int_crim_pros_for_Somali_officials_dissertation.pdf


"Siad Barre's exterminating campaigns normal, even when that was directed at their clan, such as the case of the Hawiye, who underwent one of the most vicious atrocities during his reign"

The Suicidal State in Somalia: The Rise and Fall of the Siad Barre Regime

Lol hawiyes were the least affected people since most were loyal to the regime atleast mj's and isaaq can have an argument though it won't have any value as they were both power hungry and the regime acted accordingly.

 

[dhegdheer]

loool. Posts like these make me understand why a lot of Isaaqs can't even fathom sharing a country with ppl like u. The dictionary definition of genocide is "the deliberate killing of a large group of people, especially those of a particular ethnic group or nation." So r u saying that Isaaq civilians weren't targeted and killed in large numbers? Do u think they died as collateral in the battle between the SNM and the government and weren't specifically hunted down and killed?

Nnnnnn I'd at least understand the denial if they didn't have the gal to then turn around and act victims again like

Our genocide was real but urs was collateral damage miiya

 

[gurey]

Wallahi I find it distrubing that @TheMadMullah and @Steamdevolopment can talk about nationalism when they deny that Isaaqs were singled out for genocide by the regime. Is it possible that u guys r just ignorant and really do believe that the civilians died in the crossfire between the rebels and government? I hope that's the case or else u guys shouldn't even call urselfs Somalis, cuz a true Somali could never deny the pain and suffering of his fellow brothers and sisters.

I myself narrowly escaped with my life as my mother and I walked to the Ethiopian border along with countless other fleeing Isaaqs while being hunted down and bombed from the air by fighter jets. I assure you there was not a single SNM rebel amongst us. I have had my aunt and her friend captured and taken to be killed by a firing squad. Luckily my aunt had some money on her so she gave the soldiers the money and begged for her and her friends life. They reluctantly let her go, but while she was there a truck load of women and young men were brought and all of them were killed in front of her and her friend. After witnessing that my aunts friend, who passed away recently, was never the same again and suffered from mental health issues. Was my aunt, her friend and those truck loads of women also SNM rebels? Wallahi there were Isaaq families of 10, none of whom were SNM, who had only 2 or 3 people remaining.

It upsets me that I even have to explain this to you guys. Honestly did u guys not know this happened in the north?

Look I am from South somalia a few miles away from kenya. I have no isaaqs in my family. The isaaqs I knew on a personal level were kids who left too young or born in europe. Where i will then get a real account of atrocities that happened to the average man in hargeisa or burco? What you wrote above was harrowing.

The reality is I would have been susceptible to the counter propaganda that says siad was chasing rebels who were hiding amongst civilians. Try to look at it from that perspective. Most people your arguing with on here have a similar upbringing.

There is simply not enough communication in regards to real personal accounts of atrocity out there. Collective punishment lead to the genocide is stance on this issue.

Aun to the innocent.

One thing I have learnt fron siad barre and bashar al assad is. Never take up arms against an oppressive dictatorship. They will kill a 1000 times more people and leave the country in absolutely devastation. Its the islamic position aswell.

 

[Steamdevolopment]

Look I am from South somalia a few miles away from kenya. I have no isaaqs in my family. The isaaqs I knew on a personal level were kids who left too young or born in europe. Where i will then get a real account of atrocities that happened to the average man in hargeisa or burco? What you wrote above was harrowing.

The reality is I would have been susceptible to the counter propaganda that says siad was chasing rebels who were hiding amongst civilians. Try to look at it from that perspective. Most people your arguing with on here have a similar upbringing.

There is simply not enough communication in regards to real personal accounts of atrocity out there. Collective punishment lead to the genocide is stance on this issue.

Aun to the innocent.

One thing I have learnt fron siad barre and bashar al assad is. Never take up arms against an oppressive dictatorship. They will kill a 1000 times more people and leave the country in absolutely devastation. Its the islamic position aswell.

The islamic position?

 

[jugjugwacwac]

The islamic position?

Yeah, according to some of the salafis.

 

[Steamdevolopment]

Yeah, according to some of the salafis.

You mean the same people that let children blow themselves up?

There is nothing some religious won't justify

 

[jugjugwacwac]

Look I am from South somalia a few miles away from kenya. I have no isaaqs in my family. The isaaqs I knew on a personal level were kids who left too young or born in europe. Where i will then get a real account of atrocities that happened to the average man in hargeisa or burco? What you wrote above was harrowing.

The reality is I would have been susceptible to the counter propaganda that says siad was chasing rebels who were hiding amongst civilians. Try to look at it from that perspective. Most people your arguing with on here have a similar upbringing.

There is simply not enough communication in regards to real personal accounts of atrocity out there. Collective punishment lead to the genocide is stance on this issue.

Aun to the innocent.

One thing I have learnt fron siad barre and bashar al assad is. Never take up arms against an oppressive dictatorship. They will kill a 1000 times more people and leave the country in absolutely devastation. Its the islamic position aswell.

Yeah I agree communication is key. I can't get upset at someone for not knowing, but we have people like @TheMadMullah and @XamarCade claiming that the genocide didn't even happen, and that the personal account from my own family are all made up lol.

 

[gurey]

The islamic position?

Yes you not allowed.

http://islamicsupremecouncil.org/un...misunderstood-concept-from-islam.html?start=8

 

[gurey]

Yeah, according to some of the salafis.

Bro would you rather Siad barre the rebellion or after the rebellion?

bashar al assad before the rebellion or after the rebellion?

 

[jugjugwacwac]

You mean the same people that let children blow themselves up?

There is nothing some religious won't justify

The Salafis im talking are Saudi state sponsored clerics and their followers. They hold the view that rebelling against the ruler, even if he is a tyrant, is haram, and also that suicide bombings are haram. The Salafis who blow themselves up are the Salafi-Jihadis and are looked upon by the state sponsored Salafis as rogue groups that are a threat to their beloved rulers lol.