Was Somaliland a part of Somalia?

[merka]

Some people think that the country from 1960-1991 was called Somalia. Somalia was actually the name of the former Italian colony called the "State of Somalia" while Somaliland was the name of the former British protectorate called "State of Somaliland". In 1960 both states united to form the "Somali Republic" which lasted until the end of the Barre Regime in 1991.

Here is an excerpt of the 1960 Act of Union.

LAW OF UNION BETWEEN SOMALILAND AND SOMALIA: Law No: 1 of 1960 - Passed by the Independent State of Somaliland Legislature on 27 JUNE 1960


1. (a) The State of Somaliland and the State of Somalia do hereby unite and shall forever remain united in a new, independent, democratic, unitary republic the name whereof shall be the Somali Republic.
http://www.somalilandlaw.com/Somaliland_Act_of_Union.htm

http://www.somalilandlaw.com/Act_of_Union_Law_No._5_of_31__January_1961.pdf

The country now known as the Federal Republic of Somalia does not have jurisdiction over the present Republic of Somaliland since by it's name it only represents the former State of Somalia. When Somaliland left the union the Somali Republic died with it.

 

[OmarLittle]

Interesting. But, before the British controlled Somaliland and the Italians controlled Somalia, Somalis pretty much lived in their own territories by clans/sub-clans, correct?

To those who know more about Somalis history, were Somalis ever united as ONE before 1961? I mean by one state/empire? I read the Dervish State, but that was to fight the Europeans. Did Somalis ever united other than fighting their common enemy?

 

[merka]

Interesting. But, before the British controlled Somaliland and the Italians controlled Somalia, Somalis pretty much lived in their own territories by clans/sub-clans, correct?

To those who know more about Somalis history, were Somalis ever united as ONE before 1961? I mean by one state/empire? I read the Dervish State, but that was to fight the Europeans. Did Somalis ever united other than fighting their common enemy?

Nope. Even the Adal Empire just covered the north, while the Ajuuran empire only controlled the south.

There's never been a ruler that controlled the entirety of Somali territory.

 

[Mudug-Madman]

Some people think that the country from 1960-1991 was called Somalia. Somalia was actually the name of the former Italian colony called the "State of Somalia" while Somaliland was the name of the former British protectorate called "State of Somaliland". In 1960 both states united to form the "Somali Republic" which lasted until the end of the Barre Regime in 1991.

Here is an excerpt of the 1960 Act of Union.

http://www.somalilandlaw.com/Act_of_Union_Law_No._5_of_31__January_1961.pdf

The country now known as the Federal Republic of Somalia does not have jurisdiction over the present Republic of Somaliland since by it's name it only represents the former State of Somalia. When Somaliland left the union the Somali Republic died with it.

I'm fairly certain it was called Italian Somaliland. I'm pretty sure that wording "State of Somalia" and "State of Somaliland" is there only to differentiate between the two entities without using the Colonial names. For their entire history before the union they were known as Italian Somaliland and British Somaliland.

 

[merka]

I'm fairly certain it was called Italian Somaliland. I'm pretty sure that wording "State of Somalia" and "State of Somaliland" is there only to differentiate between the two entities without using the Colonial names. For their entire history before the union they were known as Italian Somaliland and British Somaliland.

I don't see any "Italian Somaliland". I can see Somalia though.

 

[OmarLittle]

Nope. Even the Adal Empire just covered the north, while the Ajuuran empire only controlled the south.

There's never been a ruler that controlled the entirety of Somali territory.

Interesting man. My Somali history knowledge is weak and I have trust issues, some sometimes I don't even bother try reading it without my skepticism going crazy.

So, if this was objective, then that means the concept of a Somali state is new and the only one that ever happened(possibly) failed and then people went back to tribalism by having a in-group preference because they only trust their own kind.

 

[TheLibertarianQuiche]

I don't see any "Italian Somaliland". I can see Somalia though.

Search up Somaliland in Italian. You get the answer you were looking for.

 

[merka]

Interesting man. My Somali history knowledge is weak and I have trust issues, some sometimes I don't even bother try reading it without my skepticism going crazy.

So, if this was objective, then that means the concept of a Somali state is new and the only one that ever happened(possibly) failed and then people went back to tribalism by having a in-group because they only trust their own kind.

It was an idea during the run up to independence that all Somali territories would be unified in one state. Part of the reason Somaliland and Somalia united was that they assumed the other territories would follow.

 

[Rooble]

Colony name: Cote Française Des Somalis
Colony of France
Literal translation in English : The French Somali Coast. In English known as "French Somaliland".

Protectorate name:British Somaliland.
Protectorate of Britain.
Literal translation in Italian and known as "Somalia Britanicca".

Colony name: Somalia Italiana,
Colony of Italiy
Literal translation and by Britain known as: Italian Somaliland.

So we can see

Somalia literally means and is the Italian equivalent of the English :Somaliland.

For example. Italia. Land of the Italic people.

 

[TheLibertarianQuiche]

Colony name: Cote Française Des Somalis
Colony of France
Literal translation in English : The French Somali Coast. In English known as "French Somaliland".

Protectorate name:British Somaliland.
Protectorate of Britain.
Literal translation in Italian and known as "Somalia Britanicca".

Colony name: Somalia Italiana,
Colony of Italiy
Literal translation and by Britain known as: Italian Somaliland.

So we can see

Somalia literally means and is the Italian equivalent of the English :Somaliland.

For example. Italia. Land of the Italic people.

Thats what I said sxb!!!

Someone understands me.

 

[merka]

Search up Somaliland in Italian. You get the answer you were looking for.

Colony name: Cote Française Des Somalis
Colony of France
Literal translation in English : The French Somali Coast. In English known as "French Somaliland".

Protectorate name:British Somaliland.
Protectorate of Britain.
Literal translation in Italian and known as "Somalia Britanicca".

Colony name: Somalia Italiana,
Colony of Italiy
Literal translation and by Britain known as: Italian Somaliland.

So we can see

Somalia literally means and is the Italian equivalent of the English :Somaliland.

For example. Italia. Land of the Italic people.

Why does the Act of Union say Somaliland and Somalia if their names were actually British Somaliland and Italian Somaliland?


Anyways you guys are going off topic. Whether the name is Somalia or Italian Somaliland the country that Somaliland was a part of was called the SOMALI REPUBLIC. That doesn't exist anymore.

 

[Rooble]

@merka It's pretty simple. You have to understand this, Somaliland and Somalia formed the Somali Republic.

I just want you to understand this.

Somalia is Italian for "Somaliland", colony name: Somalia Italiana and
Somaliland because it was the British Somaliland protectorate.

So the document reads, Somaliland and Somalia, which is what it was basically if you remove, colonial pre-fix. Somalia Italiana and British Somaliland.

I do not wish to derail. I just want you to understand this.

I'm not saying the name was Italian Somaliland. You have to understand what the colonials called these territories.

Once they united they adopted the name: The Somali Republic, then Somali Democratic Republic, then Somalia

Which I agree with you means the boundaries of the former Somalia Italiana, so Somalia is the incorrect name to use.

 

[merka]

The names don't matter, what was British Somaliland was entirely subsumed by Somalia Italiana or Italian Somaliland. Nothing remained of the former as the latter's sovereignty was extended over it. You can even see it happen as the Somali Republic gradually became Somalia. There was no Somaliland to bring back in 1991 because it no longer had any legitimate claim on being a separate entity. This is why Somaliland is called a secessionist region, the border of Italian Somaliland and British Somaliland became an internal border. Semantics do not matter much in this area, present day Somaliland has nothing to do with British Somaliland as there is NO legal continuity.

Somalia didn't annex Somaliland. The 2 states formed a union called the Somali Republic. The Somali Republic dissolved in 1991 so Somaliland was able to re-claim its former independent status. This isn't new, many countries have done this before.

 

[TheLibertarianQuiche]

This goes to show how retarded seperationists were back then and still are today.

I respect @merka but laakin I don't respect sheep. You know who you are.

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

Somalia didn't annex Somaliland. The 2 states formed a union called the Somali Republic. The Somali Republic dissolved in 1991 so Somaliland was able to re-claim its former independent status. This isn't new, many countries have done this before.

It was a union, albeit an unequal one, I will grant you that. You said it was dissolved in 1991, the question is by whom? I don't remember the act of parliament that dissolved the union.

 

[The_Cosmos]

I don't see any "Italian Somaliland". I can see Somalia though.

Well of course it doesn't say 'Italian somaliland' as that's the English translation of Somalia Italiana.

 

[TheLibertarianQuiche]

The legal precedent for a union being dissolved is that between Singapore and Malaysia. That was done in the parliament of the people.

 

[merka]

It was a union, albeit an unequal one, I will grant you that. You said it was dissolved in 1991, the question is by whom? I don't remember the act of parliament that dissolved the union.

The government collapsed so Somaliland unilaterally declared independence. Also Somalia was under a dictatorship, there was no parliament after 1969.

The legal precedent for a union being dissolved is that between Singapore and Malaysia. That was done in the parliament of the people.

Malaysia actually kicked Singapore out of the union, it's not really the same case.

 

[TheLibertarianQuiche]

The government collapsed so Somaliland unilaterally declared independence. Also Somalia was under a dictatorship, there was no parliament after 1969.


Malaysia actually kicked Singapore out of the union, it's not really the same case.

1. UDI's are what get you unrecognised, obviously you haven't heard of Rhodesia.
2. Singapore wanted to leave and the Malaysian parliament (which included Singapore) voted to end the union.

 

[merka]

1. UDI's are what get you unrecognised, obviously you haven't heard of Rhodesia.

Unilateral Declarations of Independence are allowed under International law.

No prohibition of declarations of independence according to State practice⎯ Contention that prohibition of unilateral declarations of independence is implicit in the principle of territorial integrity ⎯ Scope of the principle of territorial integrity is confined to the sphere of relations between States⎯ No general prohibition may be inferred from the practice of the Security Council with regard to declarations of independence ⎯ Issues relating to the extent of the right of self-determination and the existence of any right of “remedial secession” are beyond the scope of the question posed by the General Assembly.
General international law contains no applicable prohibition of declarations of independence.
http://www.webcitation.org/5rRB9e3bz?url=http://www.icj-cij.org/docket/files/141/15987.pdf

2. Singapore wanted to leave and the Malaysian parliament (which included Singapore) voted to end the union.

Actually Singapore wanted to remain part of Malaysia but Malaysia wanted to kick them out since Singapore had a large Chinese population.

On 7 August 1965, Prime Minister Tunku Abdul Rahman, seeing no alternative to avoid further bloodshed, advised the Parliament of Malaysia that it should vote to expel Singapore from Malaysia.[2] Despite last-ditch attempts by PAP leaders, including Lee Kuan Yew, to keep Singapore as a state in the union, the Parliament on 9 August 1965 voted 126–0 in favor of the expulsion of Singapore, with Members of Parliament from Singapore not present. On that day, a tearful Lee announced that Singapore was a sovereign, independent nation and assumed the role of Prime Minister of the new nation. His speech included this quote: "For me it is a moment of anguish because all my life….you see the whole of my adult life…. I have believed in merger and the unity of these two territories. You know it's a people connected by geography, economics, and ties of kinship... ."[6]