DEBATE: Muhammad (SAW) Marriage to Aisha || Is Minor Marriage Acceptable?

[El Nino]

Muslims especially scholars should clarify Aishas real age because this is one of the biggest if not the biggest thing deterring people from accepting Islam.

Wadaads of sspot, give us your sources for what you think her age was.

 

[El Nino]

the thing I want to mention is that it is very important that this line is rejected... this line of thought that says "no, Aisha was 18" or "Aisha was 19"....

a very serious problem is- this casts aspersion on Saheeh Al-Bukhari.... Saheeh Al-Bukhari is the most authentic book after the Quran itself.... I understand a lot of people today will try to go for the "Aisha was 18" type explanations... but the issue is this argument comes at the cost of undermining Saheeh Al-Bukhari.... Saheeh Al-Bukhari is probably the most important hadith book there is... as well as the most authentic.... so we should defend Saheeh Al-Bukhari and we should have confidence in Saheeh Al-Bukhari... the reality is there was nothing wrong with the marriage to Aisha... it is only recent modern false understanding that makes people think there was something wrong with it, throughout most of history it was perfectly normal to people to marry at a younger age

What if there are hadiths in Bukhari itself that possibly contradict that Aisha was 6 years old?

Humans make mistakes, it happens.

 

[GemState]

The purported child marriage between the Prophet and Aisha need not be stigmatized or sacralized. It should simply be taken as reflecting the norms of the 7th century Hijaz along with other anachronisms that all societies had at one point and eventually developed away from.

 

[Garaad diinle]

Here is a good video that explains and clarifies the topic.

I don't think there was anything wrong with the prophet's marriage to aisha. And yes divorce itself isn't something that should be encouraged but islamically the man is the one who gives the divorce. Under normal circumstances a woman can't just give talalak so them being divorcees for the most part isn't even there fault so they shouldn't be blamed. The whole point of the talking stage is getting to find out if they were problematic or not so there is no point stigmatising divorced individuals.

 

[Omar del Sur]

What if there are hadiths in Bukhari itself that possibly contradict that Aisha was 6 years old?

Humans make mistakes, it happens.

Well are there any such hadith in Bukhari?

 

[Aurelian]

Yes but I’ve also heard the was some weak/wrong Hadiths saheeh al Bukhai am I wrong ? Or it’s false ?

no you aren't, he had many weak hadiths, as well as strong ones, he actually reduced the hadiths he collected from 99 000 to 40 000 hadiths.

 

[Farax bin Cabdi bin Bakri]

Its amazing how this hasn't really been a topic of debate until recently, this is the result when they try and push the liberal dogma onto Islam. Even in USA in the 1900s people at age 12 could get married, it is only when they seek to shift the moral lenses that all the sudden we have to capitulate to what they deem to be "correct". Sahih Bukhari (and others) relay a hadith which states her age plainly, and there is nothing so severely contradictory to state she was a different age (apart from the small range given by the narrators inherently). I'm not sure why people have such a issue with this considered Muslims themselves for 1300 years didn't bring any attention to it either like people do now.

 

[Farax bin Cabdi bin Bakri]

no you aren't, he had many weak hadiths, as well as strong ones, he actually reduced the hadiths he collected from 99 000 to 40 000 hadiths.

In the collection of Sahih Bukhari we have today all hadiths inside are considered Sahih, and a minority of them are considered Hasan, there are none which are considered Daif.

 

[Aurelian]

In the collection of Sahih Bukhari we have today all hadiths inside are considered Sahih, and a minority of them are considered Hasan, there are none which are considered Daif.

Al-Albani classified around 13 hadiths as weak. In addition to that, he classified any collection of hadiths by Abu Al-Zubeir Al-Makki which are around 35 collection.

 

[Farax bin Cabdi bin Bakri]

Al-Albani classified around 13 hadiths as weak. In addition to that, he classified any collection of hadiths by Abu Al-Zubeir Al-Makki which are around 35 collection.

He’s looked into the collection and found some to be weaker than previously noted (which is a valid position) but how many of these hadith were (1) issues with the isnad itself as oppose to (2) wording in the matn
And by daif what kind of daif was he talking about (semi related to the first point).

In any case this is a small number of hadith in which he was stringent on, less than 0.001% compared to the size of the collection we have, and on top of that not necessarily agree upon by everyone (that they're daif). I just had issue with the wording that many are weak stated earlier as there aren't books of hadith considered more sound (considering its size) than the sahihayn.

 

[Internet Nomad]

Minor marriage is no longer acceptable in modern times as we live in a time of luxury meaning people mature at a slower rate. However if we lived in apocalyptic times then our standards would need to be lower. As civilisation would need as much births as possible as population was so low.

Do i sound derange saying this? You would think its common sense? Do people really think everybody in the past were p3dos or p3do sympathisers when people married young and they tolerated it. To except that would be absurd.

 

[Aurelian]

He’s looked into the collection and found some to be weaker than previously noted (which is a valid position) but how many of these hadith were (1) issues with the isnad itself as oppose to (2) wording in the matn
And by daif what kind of daif was he talking about (semi related to the first point).

In any case this is a small number of hadith in which he was stringent on, less than 0.001% compared to the size of the collection we have, and on top of that not necessarily agree upon by everyone (that they're daif). I just had issue with the wording that many are weak stated earlier as there aren't books of hadith considered more sound (considering its size) than the sahihayn.

The point is, there is only one book that is undoubtedly authentic; the Quran

 

[Farax bin Cabdi bin Bakri]

The point is, there is only one book that is undoubtedly authentic; the Quran

Lol brother I'm not sure what you are trying to suggest, pretty much your entire understanding of Islam from the perspective of its history; who was the Prophet (ﷺ), who were his companions, how did the Quran come down to us, who relayed it, what were the actions of people at the time, what significant events occurred. On top of the specific actions of prayer, wudu, the commentary of verses from the Quran, etc. This is all been given to you from Hadith and Allah revealed this to us.

 

[Omar del Sur]

The point is, there is only one book that is undoubtedly authentic; the Quran

it's crazy to me how you're willing to undermine the entire dīn just to uphold liberalism. I wish you showed the same zeal to defend Islam.

 

[Aurelian]

it's crazy to me how you're willing to undermine the entire dīn just to uphold liberalism. I wish you showed the same zeal to defend Islam.

Not upholding Liberalism, or making counter argument for this particular hadith, but there are/were many hadiths inserted for political reasons, by many, especially Hadiths about Al-albeit and who has the right to rule the Ummah, mostly came from the fitna Ali, Hussein, Hassan Vs Mu'aawiya, Aisha and other. The Shia made, or tried to make another version of Islam that saddely many Sunnis have fallen to. I'm against that, against Shiaism, Deifying of Ali, and anything that may make his lineage somewhat especial.

 

[Omar del Sur]

Not upholding Liberalism, or making counter argument for this particular hadith, but there are/were many hadiths inserted for political reasons, by many, especially Hadiths about Al-albeit and who has the right to rule the Ummah, mostly came from the fitna Ali, Hussein, Hassan Vs Mu'aawiya, Aisha and other. The Shia made, or tried to make another version of Islam that saddely many Sunnis have fallen to. I'm against that, against Shiaism, Deifying of Ali, and his lineage.

you have a forked tongue. an aspect of Islam is mentioned that contradicts liberal values and you respond by casting aspersion on the hadith. I don't think you care about Islam, I think you care about liberalism. you're ok with people losing their trust in the hadith without which we can't even pray salaat but you're not ok with them contradicting liberalism.

the whole din would fall apart if we threw out the hadith but you don't care about that, upholding liberalism is more important to you.

 

[Aurelian]

you have a forked tongue. an aspect of Islam is mentioned that contradicts liberal values and you respond by casting aspersion on the hadith. I don't think you care about Islam, I think you care about liberalism. you're ok with people losing their trust in the hadith without which we can't even pray salaat but you're not ok with them contradicting liberalism.

Fiiri waryaa, the point is, Hadiths of Al-Bukhari and Muslim aren't as authentic as the Quran, since they have and had weak questionable hadiths, as well as political made up hadiths inserted by Shia and Ali lovers faction of the fitna, the Quran is the only undoubtedly authentic Book in Islam.

 

[Omar del Sur]

Fiiri waryaa, the point is, Hadiths of Al-Bukhari and Muslim aren't as authentic as the Quran, since they have and had weak questionable hadiths, as well as political made up hadiths inserted by Shia and Ali lovers faction of the fitna, the Quran is the only undoubtedly authentic Book in Islam.

I wouldn't be surprised if you're an atheist.

 

[Omar del Sur]

btw as far as so called "Quranism"

 

[Aurelian]

I wouldn't be surprised if you're an atheist.

Istaghfurullah, why you ppl always go to the " you are kafiir" route, can't you have simple discussion with logic and debate?