Disgusting tradition [Mag]
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The truth seeker
Life , liberty , and the pursuit of happiness
This is what zero accountability looks like this tribal system is killing the country wallahi time to unify like there Europeans did in the 19th century
Tribalism in the 21st century is ridiculous
Tribalism in the 21st century is ridiculous
There is nothing backward about it or tribalistic , paying compensation fees for harm caused is called ''restorative justice''. Context is omitted in that post, its totally optional , for the family or those harmed can call for punitive punishment and not take that route.
It's not one tribe killing another, that list shows it's extended family members chipping in to cover the cost of fines/compensation being payed. The price is hefty because its meant deter people from committing offenses
I covered this kinda in another thread
There are several cases where families even order firing squads for murderers or killers etc in public areas today. In pre-colonial times they used to chop the head off murderers in public market places. But people most of the time preferred the restorative route (fines and confiscations), as it was very effective in deterring people. As a result in many places in Somalia crime and violence was relatively uncommon.
For me i don't really fully support either, i think they need to strike balance between punitive and restorative justice. That's the best method of handing out justice, with the emphasis of your liberties taken away, restitution and rehabilitation.
It's not one tribe killing another, that list shows it's extended family members chipping in to cover the cost of fines/compensation being payed. The price is hefty because its meant deter people from committing offenses
I covered this kinda in another thread
In the major cities and various towns they were trialed and put into a prison either in a garessa or some underground prison cell or dungeon some have called it.
In a lot of cases they would capture people in the countryside and send them in shackles to be imprisoned in the major cities. Burton who trans-versed the lands in mid 1800s would make note of it saying that , ''the word ''prison''(Habsi) gives them the horrors''. So it was the ultimate punishment.
In the general country side they were made to pay a hefty fine, after being trialed and convicted.
For theft it was the same as murder you had to pay a fine. On the Majerteen coast especially you were put on a trial by fire.
Funnily enough you see the the exact same thing mentioned in Futuh as well , putting people on trial by fire. So it might be a some extended ancient costume
Richard Burton also mentions it among Western Somalis in 1850s:
''A man accused of murder or theft walks down a trench full of live charcoal and about a spears length or he draws out of the flames a smith anvil heated to redness''
There are several cases where families even order firing squads for murderers or killers etc in public areas today. In pre-colonial times they used to chop the head off murderers in public market places. But people most of the time preferred the restorative route (fines and confiscations), as it was very effective in deterring people. As a result in many places in Somalia crime and violence was relatively uncommon.
For me i don't really fully support either, i think they need to strike balance between punitive and restorative justice. That's the best method of handing out justice, with the emphasis of your liberties taken away, restitution and rehabilitation.
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for any of this to go away we would need a centralized state that can enforce laws on the general populace, until then it's blood money.
The truth seeker
Life , liberty , and the pursuit of happiness
We need a CCP style rule and until the tribal system has been completely dismantled towns can not have autonomy otherwise we will have a confederacy situation
The country must be united under nationalism like 19th century Germans we will give them Ethiopia as the big bad enemy in order to keep the populace under control
Honestly, it's not for the lack of central government especially in rural areas of Southern Somalia where this is most prevalent.
It's because people don't trust the local government to deal with these matters fairly that they turn to community based methods of tackling it based on tradition. So it really comes from the lack of strong government that answers to the people. When they had local Shariah Courts set up all over they sufficiently dealt with this.
There is nothing inherently tribal about restorative justice and people are held to account. It's collective responsibility and ensures deterrence, making sure individuals think twice before committing crimes. Instead of seeing it as “tribalistic,” it can be seen as an early form of social insurance, where the community shares responsibility for its members’ actions.
This is just blood money, Other muslim communities practice it as well but back then what I was told was they payed in livestock (Camels, Goats etc.) or other items of value like coins,minerals etc. to the grieving family and both parties go about their way after that.
Its a normal practice but it should be better incorporated into the law and regulated/ supervised to ensure the money doesnt fall into the wrong hands through corruption and it reaches who its intended to.
Its a Honourable Practice but I believe it should only be utilised for accidents and for crimes like murder or SA they would still have to pay but they should also gey tried for their crimes.
en.m.wikipedia.org
Its a normal practice but it should be better incorporated into the law and regulated/ supervised to ensure the money doesnt fall into the wrong hands through corruption and it reaches who its intended to.
Its a Honourable Practice but I believe it should only be utilised for accidents and for crimes like murder or SA they would still have to pay but they should also gey tried for their crimes.
Blood money in Islam - Wikipedia
I feel we need a party with many clans to unify Somalia, they'd need an unifying ideology, not clan-based retardation. such a party would probably come from the diaspora because Somali's in Somalia are brainrotted by clanism. They'd need to basically purge the clan elders and their ilk but that will be for the good of everybody involved. centralization and industrialization needed to happen in the 19th century but the second-best time is now. The relative isolationism of America is also currently a beneficial circumstance.
after we have gotten stable and wealthier we can unify all Somali lands, I feel that Siad Barre did it way too soon.
the reason they don't trust the government is because they have basically no say in how the country is run, and have no monopoly on violence, jeopardizing the lives of average Somalis. trust in government doesn't grow out of no-where it is a result of effective institutions.
It's not just Islam but practised long before between neighbouring communities.This is just blood money, Other muslim communities practice it as well but back then what I was told was they payed in livestock (Camels, Goats etc.) or other items of value like coins,minerals etc. to the grieving family and both parties go about their way after that.
Its a normal practice but it should be better incorporated into the law and regulated/ supervised to ensure the money doesnt fall into the wrong hands through corruption and it reaches who its intended to.
Its a Honourable Practice but I believe it should only be utilised for accidents and for crimes like murder or SA they would still have to pay but they should also gey tried for their crimes.
Blood money in Islam - Wikipedia
The government is corrupt because it is funded, supported, protected and imposed from the outside. Unless that changes it, not much will change.
One thing i suggested before is that Somalis in souther can do is recreate the playbook of Islamic Courts Union and create a parellel system or governance outside the FGS etc. ''
Businesses, elders, and community leaders must organize local governance structures.
Refuse to recognize the FGS as legitimate treat it as a foreign installed regime.
Similar stuff was done by Syrians recently and where they built a local government in Alepo before moving in to take damascus and the Afghan Taliban cut off foreign-backed governments by creating parallel governance, making the central government irrelevant.
Somalis should remove clan from politics and place it where it existed and functioned historically . Clans were never political units, they were social and economic networks, not rigid political structures
Somali clans functioned as extended family units, focused on economic cooperation
They provided social organization, ensuring wealth and trade flowed efficiently.
However, they did not function as state governments instead, sultanates, city-states, and councils governed at the political level. They had shariah courts, bureaucracies, taxation systems, and military governance and central treasuries.
Somali clans primarily served as economic structures, not political ones.
Beautiful tradition I’m always happy to pay it if the victims family accepts
clan elders actively benefit of the current state of the country i dont see why they would take action to limit their own political power. and the usaid is coming to an end in somalia thankfully and our idiotic goverment will be starved of funds if it doesnt act quickly.
How much for your head? My clan can pay very well.
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3000 camels but I would prefer for you to be excuted
The car crash one I agree with. If you harm or kill someone with you car you should be helping the family. Too many careless people driving and driving while drunk getting away with it in my province/country. Its so jarring how you can drive under influence and get away with killing someone here.
No one pays mag for first degree murder.
What is wrong about this? Somalia has a low crime rate despite the civil war because everyone’s clansmen and women are on the hook for their fuckups. Mentally colonized diaspora see a different way of doing stuff and assume it’s inferior
