Economical turmoil in Puntland continues (Protests in Qardho) All shops closed

[DR OSMAN]

But there is an interesting point to note about currency, it doesn't even need a govt. All it needs is the 'honor' system, where everyone accepts this is the legal tender in the market-place. Somalia proved this when the govt collapsed, the currency didn't and the only way it didn't is because of the honor system!!!

But when people say it's fake money they have no understanding of how a currency works. Everything will be fake money the second the people don't honor it anymore, so the point is clear 'its about honor' and you can achieve that by letting the market decide for itself like it did in Somalia when there was no government or you let a govt control it's supply like the major western countries do.

 

[waraabe]

It is a problem everywhere even in Somaliland. The drought + high inflation rates fucked up the Somali economy.

Lol no the problem isn't everywhere, there is a huge issue with fake money in puntland that their government is printing out

 

[Saahid Qamaan]

Dr Osman the printing of new currency by hidden machines in Bosaso under the control of businessmen and knowledge and involvement by the administration is illegal therefore I call it 'fake'. You know that religious leaders put an end to it and which has crippled severerly Puntlands economy under Adde Muuse. The ulama saved Puntland.

The same is happening now, the money printing machines work without oversight hidden from public view in a secret location under no authority.

They can print how much they like it is a public fraud scheme to rob people's wealth. Businessmen are involved. When asked in Parliament Gaas ignored it because he knows what he is doing is not only morally wrong and illegal but decided to print that money to keep the revenues and pay government employees and soldiers with that illegally printed money.

This is causing huge economical turmoil as no one has control how much these businessmen will print as the money-printing machines officially do not exist.

 

[Saahid Qamaan]

UN Monitoring report:

“The total amount of new Somali Shilling currency in circulation is assumed to be relatively low. However, as demonstrated by the demonstrations in May 2016, relatively small quantities of new can still upset the market, causing inflation and commodity price rises hitting the region’s most vulnerable populations the hardest. Unregulated currency printing further threatens to undermine federal level negotiations with the International Monetary Fund (IMF) to implement currency reform in Somalia,” said the UN report dated, October 31, 2016.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Dr Osman the printing of new currency by hidden machines in Bosaso under the control of businessmen and knowledge and involvement by the administration is illegal therefore I call it 'fake'. You know that religious leadere put an end to it and which ha crippled severerly Puntlands economy undet Adde Muuse.

The same is happening now, the money printing machines work without oversight hidden from public view in a secret location under no authority.

They can print hoe much they like it is a public fraud scheme to rob people's wealth. Businessmen are involved. When asked in Parliament Gaas ignored it because he knows what he is doing is not only morally wrong and illegal but decided to print that money to keep the revenues and pay government employeee and soldiers with that money.

This is causing huge economical turmoil as no one has control how juch will ge printed as they officially do not exist.

How can someone be robbed of their wealth if everyone in the market place agrees that this is the legal tender? They just got this agreement from the central regions after having a meeting. The problem is some of the business-men have refused to use the new tender and they did this with adde muse for political purposes(make him lose election). The question u need to really ask is why are they refusing? if the new currency they are given for transaction will be accepted everywhere in the market-place for the same amount of goods in the market-place and everywhere within Puntland, what is their issue where it's printed?

The business community seems like their trying to cripple the economy by breaking the honor based system and rejecting customers notes so they can then cause instability in the land because they can't buy anything. This is political agendas, the question we need to ask is who has this political agenda, where is it coming from, and what is their purpose for it!!!!

I think Farmajo might have a hand in it. Every admin has been suffering some sort of political or economical disaster since he came to office. Galmudug(politically changed presidents), Hirshabelle(politically changed presidents), South-west is having turmoil politically. Jubbaland is the only one that isn't affected for some reason and it appears because they are close to 'farmaajo'. I think Farmaajo is causing instability in the economy of Puntland so GAAS is kicked out or resigns!!! He is probably getting the business community to say we won't accept this legal tender as long as the president is in office, once he leaves, we will accept it!!! I think that's what their trying to do. Use the business community as common denominator to enforce change in PL. That's my far-fetched theories anyways!!!

 

[Saahid Qamaan]

The UN calls it 'unregulated' others counterfeit because they do not come under official authority it is done unofficial.

Gaas opted for it because there were mutinies by soldiers and economic dissatisfaction due to corruption and mismanagement of the econmy. Hence businessmen were instructed to buy printing nachines overseas and help this caused inflation either way tge result is Gaas failed the economy and instead of the soldiers and employees the people suffering are the ordinary men and women who make up the bulk of the country who live on meager income and their licelihoods are threaten by the huge inflation caused by counterfeit or nicer word unregulated printing of new currency.

 

[DR OSMAN]

The UN calls it 'unregulated' others counterfeit because they do not come under official authority it is done unofficial.

Gaas opted for it because there were mutinies by soldiers and economic dissatisfaction due to corruption and mismanagement of the econmy. Hence businessmen were instructed to buy printing nachines overseas and help this caused inflation either way tge result is Gaas failed the economy and instead of the soldiers and employees the people suffering are the ordinary men and women who make up the bulk of the country who live on meager income and their licelihoods are threaten by the huge inflation caused by counterfeit or nicer word unregulated printing of new currency.

I didn't ask you about the UN. Somali currency has always been unregulated through-out the civil war, never saw these sort of economic disasters. The market adjusted rates based on what people could afford with a bit of profit on-top for business-men. These economic disasters that is occurring now is unheard of and is due to the business-men breaking the time honored agreements in the market-place and you didn't answer why the business-men are playing this game and if there is a political agenda behind it!!!

 

[Saahid Qamaan]

Dr Osman they are refusing old bills! They want the newly printed unregulated counterfeit money. This is because the counterfeit money of Gaas administration has been refused in other parts of Somalia so in retaliation Gaas administration refused the old Shilling to be used by businessmen by not taking the old shilling for revenue collection and tax, the business people followed suit after initially refusing the new counterfeit shilling somali. This on the hand had a consequence on the ordinary people whose old shilling somali were refused,

 

[Saahid Qamaan]

Dr Osman the point is that Gaas mismanaged the state's revenues and international funds received from the international community, so he started printing illegal money to pay salaries in 2015. Before it was soldiers and government employees protesting so Gaas opted to print illegal money but the problem only shifted and now the people are on the streets.

 

[Saahid Qamaan]

Somalia: Puntland Stands Accused of Importing/Printing Counterfeit Money
September 6, 2015

The Chairman of the central Bank of Somalia Mr. Bashiir Isse Ali has on Saturday held a press conference in Mogadishu and accused the semiautonomous States of Puntland of being behind of the flow of phony money into the country wide.

“We made thorough investigation to know where the recent counterfeit money which we have recently seen causing fluctuation on the trade in the city is coming from, and the bottom-line of the investigation is that the money is coming from the semiautonomous states of Puntland in Eastern Somalia, it is very unfortunate to know that Puntland which one of the strong pillars of the nation is behind this illegal monetary” said Bashir the chairman of Somalia’s central Bank in a press conference.

On the other hand the chairman has added that Somalia is on negotiation with international countries and the IMF on how Somalia can have a single monetary unit.

The administration of Puntland has not yet given back reaction to the chairman’s comments.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Dr Osman they are refusing old bills! They want the newly printed unregulated counterfeit money. This is because the counterfeit money of Gaas administration has been refused in other parts of Somalia so in retaliation Gaas administration refused the old Shilling to be used by businessmen by not taking the old shilling for revenue collection and tax, the business people followed suit after initially refusing the new counterfeit shilling somali. This on the hand had a consequence on the ordinary people whose old shilling somali were refused,

Your failing to grasp what I am saying bro. This is a problem of having a unified currency with the rest of the country, because the chain of honor goes well beyond your border into other territories you have no control over, if one person breaks the honor agreement in the chain in some other region, it will be immediately felt by us. This can be eliminated by 1. Going SL way and having your own currency as you can enforce the honor agreement within your borders a-lot easier then somewhere else outside of your control. 2. Having a strong central bank that enforces the legal tender and rates. This helps because if they stuff up the currency and rates at the central bank, the impact will not be felt just by PL but by all somalia because they all use the same currency and have the same set of goods and services which will be impacted.

U have to really understand currency and don't go stupid on me like inquisitive about his 'fiat' currency nonsense. Money loses value the second people refuse to trade in it. I can have 1 billion in us dollars but if somalia market ban it, my money is useless there. Notice it's all centered around people that is the most important factor of a currency!!! You can let the market adjust the rate by competition through-out the market-place or you can enforce it by controlling the supply and lowering or increasing it depending on what you want from your economy. Our economy isn't at that stage yet where we control through the supply/demand mechanism as the government is weak and hasn't got that enforcement level, they let the market adjust accordingly in Somalia so you can't bring western economics to a 3rd world country economy, it's different due to the level of governance!!!

 

[Deactivated]

Everything will be electronic in 10 years anyway.

Until then every gobol will hold millions of dollars in USD.

There's no way a state can have it's own currency.

 

[DR OSMAN]

That's why PL I suspect allowed the Federal govt to manage the currency, because they know they won't be affected alone and all somalis will be affected if the central govt gets it wrong!!! So they have an incentive to do good governance on finance supply because the impact will be felt by all people who are using the currency, not just specific regions. It also helps us in a way to share our currency with others because it limits currency manipulation occurring because like I said the impact will be felt by all those using that currency.

I agree we unified our currency with Somalia, it will shield us from manipulation in the central govt who will need to stuff up everyone's economy if they played currency wars!!! GOOD MOVE PUNTLAND.

Somaliland is stuffed though!!! you can see what can happen there. Somalis will say lets 'f*ck' up their economy knowing they won't impacted because they don't share that currency!!!

 

[Saahid Qamaan]

Dr Osman you are not grasping, the head of the central bank is from Puntland. If you want to know politially Gaas was closely aligned with the central govetnment under Hassan Sheekh.

What you fail is that businesses are refusing the old bill and not Gaas counterfeit money because Gaas administration forced the businesses to accept the money they pay soldiers and government employees in.

Gaas printed money was refused in other parts and they tried to do the same by not accepting the old bills.

Now they are in a catch 22 as people are impacted by the daft economical decision by the Gaas adminisgration and to calm diwn thwpe protesters they are saying old bills are accepted where before pressured businesses not to take the old bills.

 

[Agent 47]

gaas should stop printing the fake lacag

 

[DR OSMAN]

I think my point has been validated. This is political agenda!!! Getting GAAS to look bad for the elections and push elders to elect someone else. Same game happened to Adde Muuse AUN!!! Plus looks like farmaajo had a hand in it also, their condemning PL for supporting saudi/qatar? I guess that was farmaajo agenda for this instability purpose!!!

I really feel sorry for Somalis who keep falling for these hidden political agendas and swallowing up everything at face value. I have a fine eye when I see a political agenda at hand, I am suprised it was verified so quickly by garowe online!!!

http://www.garoweonline.com/en/news...under-fire-for-security-and-economic-failures

 

[Abdalla]

I actually like PL printing its own money. Few weeks ago people in Bosaso were refusing it until PL forced the business owners to accept both bills. Now they are not closing their shops and nonsense like that and have been forced to accept it. People are slowly accepting it. Qardho business owners will be forced too.

I think this administration introduced these bills too soon on a large scale. It should've been a gradual process. They should've started with only the government using that money and slowly introduce it to the public.

Dr Osman you are not grasping, the head of the central bank is from Puntland. If you want to know politially Gaas was closely aligned with the central govetnment under Hassan Sheekh.

What you fail is that businesses are refusing the old bill and not Gaas counterfeit money because Gaas administration forced the businesses to accept the money they pay soldiers and government employees in.

Gaas printed money was refused in other parts and they tried to do the same by not accepting the old bills.

Now they are in a catch 22 as people are impacted by the daft economical decision by the Gaas adminisgration and to calm diwn thwpe protesters they are saying old bills are accepted where before pressured businesses not to take the old bills.

You're all over the place. Stick to one narration. They are either refusing the old bills or the new bills? I know you came here for propaganda purposes, but stick to one narration. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[Saahid Qamaan]

Abdalla you have comprehension issues? Dr Osman falsely claimed they refused the new bills which is counterfeit and jointly done by rogue businessmen and politicians who are close friends of Gaas!

I said the protests are because businesses refuse the old shilling Somali.

Why are they refusing it?

Gaas administration forced them to refuse and instead to take the newly printed money through force. The counterfeit was refused in other regions. Gaas local governments then refused to take the old bills from southern Somalia by not accepting payment of taxes and services with the old bill as direct retaliation.

This resulted in businesses only taking the counterfeits. This hit the low income households and majority of the people who have the old bills resulting in them having legal tender but not able to buy goods from businesses who have been pressured to only take the counterfeit.

This was done to keep the counterfeit aflot.

Now they try to reverse it because of the civil unrests by saying all the money including the old cannot be rejected because they are Shilling Somali.

The problem was first created by administration by printing counterfeits and forcing them on businessmen who were forcing it on the people on the streets by refusing their normal legal old bill notes which ate accepted in southern Somalia.

Why did they start printing counterfeit in the first place?

Due to mismanagement of funds and revenues which resulted in non payment of govetnment employees and soldiers. They tried to blame differerent parties from the old government to the Vice President but the truth is Gaas is very corrupt and therefore took all the revenue and as he was stuck a solution was needed. Countetfeit money was the result and this caused inflatiohn because it is unregulated and not monitored.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Abdalla you have comprehension issues? Dr Osman falsely claimed they refused the new bills which is counterfeit and jointly done by rogue businessmen and politicians who are close friends of Gaas!

I said the protests are because businesses refuse the old shilling Somali.

Why are they refusing it?

Gaas administration forced them to refuse and instead to take the newly printed money through force. The counterfeit was refused in other regions. Gaas local governments then refused to take the old bills from southern Somalia by not accepting payment of taxes and services with the old bill as direct retaliation.

This resulted in businesses only taking the counterfeits. This hit the low income households and majority of the people who have the old bills resulting in them having legal tender but not able to buy goods from businesses who have been pressured to only take the counterfeit.

This was done to keep the counterfeit aflot.

Now they try to reverse it because of the civil unrests by saying all the money including the old cannot be rejected because they are Shilling Somali.

The problem was first created by administration by printing counterfeits and forcing them on businessmen who were forcing it on the people on the streets by refusing their normal legal old bill notes which ate accepted in southern Somalia.

Why did they start printing counterfeit in the first place?

Due to mismanagement of funds and revenues which resulted in non payment of govetnment employees and soldiers. They tried to blame differerent parties from the old government to the Vice President but the truth is Gaas is very corrupt and therefore took all the revenue and as he was stuck a solution was needed. Countetfeit money was the result and this caused inflatiohn because it is unregulated and not monitored.

Unregulated? unmonitored? can you explain why the somali currency never felt this sort of economic problem without any govt during the 90s? the currency was always stable with no govt and your saying reulation and monitoring is needed? you don't understand the difference of 3rd world economy and 1st world economy hence your applying first world economic approaches to a 3rd world economy!!! It's got nothing to do with regulation or monitoring but if you fail to see that, it's up to you and your ignorance!!! It's about the honor system not being accepted by business people and nothing else!!!

 

[DR OSMAN]

The way somali currency stayed afloat is quite simple and this is my take on it. The business-men analyzed carefully what the purchasing power of each somali was and this was mainly done in 'dollar' because most remittance come in dollar. The average Somali gets maybe $200 a month. That's their purchasing power. The currency traders then figured out a reasonable rate for 1 dollar against the shilling using that figure or what-ever figure they agreed was the average income of the consumer because after-all they are the ones coming to the market place and buying most of the things being sold.

Once they figured out the currency rate between the dollar and shilling using that method say $200 a month. They had to price all the goods in the market-place to reflect the purchasing power of the consumer. You will need to figure out what $1 can buy you, what $2 dollar can get you and so forth. They couldn't charge for example a loaf of bread or a meal at a restaurant at $5 dollars because that's going to take out a big chunk away from the persons $200 a month purchasing power, because they have like $5 per day with that sort of income, they can't spend it all in 1 meal or loaf of bread. People would be rioting about starvation and not able to live.

The business-men for example can't base prices at western levels or who will come and shop there? they will have no customers and their goods will either rott away or turn to dust. It's in their interest to sell it at local prices. The key is they don't want to sell goods to cheap and customers don't need to keep coming back to buy more or to expensive where no customers comes at all. They want that middle-ground where they empty out the person as much as possible within their means. So if a person has $5 to spend a day, he will charge them $1 for a meal at a restaurant, 20 cents for tea, and so forth. You want them to lose that $5 spending money and come back the next day and spend again until their purchasing power for the month is reached. The business-man has no control over people's pocket, he has to work with what they have. He can't change the purchasing power of customers, he has no choice but to work with they have in their wallets. All a Business person can change is making sure where he is getting those supplies is as 'low' as possible which can mean 'bad' products in the country because they will use black market and dodgy back-lane stores in Dubai selling un-sell-able products in their country to you or basically the left overs or Chinese knock-offs. Luckily PL addressed this with the food/drinks quality labatory in Bosaso and Garowe, which is one of the reasons I think the business community is mad to be quite honest!!!

But honestly the business community only hope for success is to get the cheapest prices possible on their goods in Dubai, which means going to the black market. That's why we need a strong government to ensure quality standards because the business people have no incentive to do quality control on their products, it's a business and businesses is about lowering their out-going costs(dubai) and maximising their selling costs(somalia), that's where their profit is made.

I always wondered how they can sell so cheap in Somalia even if they buy it expensive overseas and I realized it's the cost of living is far cheaper. So if they make $100 a day in sales, that's pretty much their living costs covered for the month. Economics and currency isn't as simple as supply/demand with notes, that's western economies because their governments are strong, they have banking sector who they provide those funds too which means they tell them the rules like what sort of interest rates they can sell/loan that out to people in the market place.