First mention of "harari"

[Westcentral99]

Harla mostly spoke Somali and would be considered Somali today, but technically only geeljires and stuff were considered Somali back then. That’s why the Futuh separates Harla and Somali.

Harla mostly spoke Somali and would be considered Somali today, but technically only geeljires and stuff were considered Somali back then. That’s why the Futuh separates Harla and Somali.

You clearly haven’t read the futuh, the futuh describes Harla as a somali clan

 

[Somali_patriotic]

At the time of Ahmad Gurey harark ethnicity didn't exist yet.
Harar was a diverse city of many ethnic groups including Somalis. A centre of Islamic civilization in the region. After Ahmad gurey lost his jihad and Adal was weakened leading to Galla incursions. A Somali Sultan of Harar built a wall to keep out the Oromo tribesmen and told everyone inside to abandoned their tribal affiliations. Eventually though centuries of mixing they all became one ethnic group called harari with genetic links all around the horn. For some reason the Semetic part of the language was stronger which is why it is not Cushitic however the Harari language has strong Somali influence.

Nothing proves that the modern harari was the kost widespread language in the city.
Little ethnicities name their languages after where they reside
This semitic language wasn't widely spoken in harar.

 

[HabarSteven12]

At the time of Ahmad Gurey harark ethnicity didn't exist yet.
Harar was a diverse city of many ethnic groups including Somalis. A centre of Islamic civilization in the region. After Ahmad gurey lost his jihad and Adal was weakened leading to Galla incursions. A Somali Sultan of Harar built a wall to keep out the Oromo tribesmen and told everyone inside to abandoned their tribal affiliations. Eventually though centuries of mixing they all became one ethnic group called harari with genetic links all around the horn. For some reason the Semetic part of the language was stronger which is why it is not Cushitic however the Harari language has strong Somali influence.

Huge walls were constructed to primarily keep out nomads. Nomadic societies are generally anarchic and lawless. Nomads are constantly on the move in search of pasture and water. They are competing over scarce resources in the desert. This often leads to violent and deadly clashes.

There is no proof that a Somali constructed a wall in Harar. Absolute gibberish and nonsense. The walls in Harar and Zeila were primarily built to keep out Somali and oromo nomads. Even during the conquest of Ethiopia, Somali nomads were engaged in banditry, looting and murder. They were often rebuked many times by Imam Ahmed, who was from Harar.

 

[Khaem]

Huge walls were constructed to primarily keep out nomads. Nomadic societies are generally anarchic and lawless. Nomads are constantly on the move in search of pasture and water. They are competing over scarce resources in the desert. This often leads to violent and deadly clashes.

There is no proof that a Somali constructed a wall in Harar. Absolute gibberish and nonsense. The walls in Harar and Zeila were primarily built to keep out Somali and oromo nomads. Even during the conquest of Ethiopia, Somali nomads were engaged in banditry, looting and murder. They were often rebuked many times by Imam Ahmed, who was from Harar.

Then why was there no wall until AFTER the oromo expansion swarmed the countryside? Begore Galla the Somali were the only ones there and there was no wall in Harar or Zaylac.

The sultan who built the walls of Harar is Emir Nur the Somali nephew of Ahmad Gurey and successor.

Cry all you want Xabashi

 

[tyrannicalmanager]

What do you want from these poor people, who Melek killed half of their people in several days
Harar is not a race, but a group of races. They are the people who lived within the walls of Harar to protect against the Nomads around them.

you do know hararis sought refuge to those nomads after Abyssinian conquered.

 

[tyrannicalmanager]

Then why was there no wall until AFTER the oromo expansion swarmed the countryside? Begore Galla the Somali were the only ones there and there was no wall in Harar or Zaylac.

The sultan who built the walls of Harar is Emir Nur the Somali nephew of Ahmad Gurey and successor.

Cry all you want Xabashi

View attachment 304536

What's logic of incorporating a Somali division into your army but also building a wall to keep them out?

 

[Somali_patriotic]

Huge walls were constructed to primarily keep out nomads. Nomadic societies are generally anarchic and lawless. Nomads are constantly on the move in search of pasture and water. They are competing over scarce resources in the desert. This often leads to violent and deadly clashes.

If you got the slightest knowledge about the matter you would realise that the walls of harar were built to repulse oromo invasions.
Somalis were the majority of the inhabitants until the conquest of harar in 1880s.

There is no proof that a Somali constructed a wall in Harar. Absolute gibberish and nonsense. The walls in Harar and Zeila were primarily built to keep out Somali and oromo nomads.

Why you desperately lying? It's somalis who developed harar and made it a proper city.
Why would they built walls to keep themselves out?

Even during the conquest of Ethiopia, Somali nomads were engaged in banditry, looting and murder. They were often rebuked many times by Imam Ahmed, who was from Harar.

Lol the imam himself used to loot, murder and steal villages, You aren't ready for that type of discussions tho.
Also there was one case where Habr maqdi stole from geri So the imam went solving the problem
Y'all like to take that out of context.

Imam Ahmed, who was from Harar.

The imam was from a place called Za'aka Which's location is unkown according to Arab fiqh.
He wasn't from harar.

 

[Zak12]

Huge walls were constructed to primarily keep out nomads. Nomadic societies are generally anarchic and lawless. Nomads are constantly on the move in search of pasture and water. They are competing over scarce resources in the desert. This often leads to violent and deadly clashes.

There is no proof that a Somali constructed a wall in Harar. Absolute gibberish and nonsense. The walls in Harar and Zeila were primarily built to keep out Somali and oromo nomads. Even during the conquest of Ethiopia, Somali nomads were engaged in banditry, looting and murder. They were often rebuked many times by Imam Ahmed, who was from Harar.

Why treat Somalis as a monolith? While many Somalis were indeed nomadic, plenty also were farmers and lived sedentary lives in towns and cities. Its no different from the walls Arabs built in their towns to keep bedouins out.

 

[Zak12]

If you got the slightest knowledge about the matter you would realise that the walls of harar were built to repulse oromo invasions.
Somalis were the majority of the inhabitants until the conquest of harar in 1880s.

Why you desperately lying? It's somalis who developed harar and made it a proper city.
Why would they built walls to keep themselves out?

Lol the imam himself used to loot, murder and steal villages, You aren't ready for that type of discussions tho.
Also there was one case where Habr maqdi stole from geri So the imam went solving the problem
Y'all like to take that out of context.

The imam was from a place called Za'aka Which's location is unkown according to Arab fiqh.
He wasn't from harar.

I thought the imam was from Hubat?

 

[Somali_patriotic]

I thought the imam was from Hubat?

It never says that in the futuh
The imam village is called زعكة
It never mentions where Za'aka is located

 

[HabarSteven12]

If you got the slightest knowledge about the matter you would realise that the walls of harar were built to repulse oromo invasions.
Somalis were the majority of the inhabitants until the conquest of harar in 1880s.

Why you desperately lying? It's somalis who developed harar and made it a proper city.
Why would they built walls to keep themselves out?

Lol the imam himself used to loot, murder and steal villages, You aren't ready for that type of discussions tho.
Also there was one case where Habr maqdi stole from geri So the imam went solving the problem
Y'all like to take that out of context.

The imam was from a place called Za'aka Which's location is unkown according to Arab fiqh.
He wasn't from harar.

The walls of Harar were built to repulse the nomads of cushitic stock. As I mentioned earlier, nomadic societies are generally anarchic and lawless. The walls were primarily built to keep out the Somali and Oromo nomads. Similar fortified walls were built in Zeila and Mogadishu to avert nomadic Somali incursions. Past civilizations and empires placed heavy restrictions on nomadic movements in their towns.

Somalis didn't develop Harar. What a ridiculous and outrageous statement! You are demonstrating you don't have the intellectual capacity to analyze historical sources with a critical eye. Some Somalis settled in Harar as caravan traders and nomads looking for grazing land. You have to understand that nomadic societies are constantly on the move in search of greener pasture and water. Merely settling in Harar doesn't equate to being the indigenous founders of the historic city.

Harar was an important trade and religious center that attracted many guests and traders. Somalis were never the majority of the inhabitants of Harar. Let me guess you are going to say Abadir Umar ar-Rida was a Somali who founded Harar. Abadir Umar ar-Rida is an Arab and was born in the Hejaz region of modern-day Saudi Arabia. The Somali clans that Imam Ahmed punished and rebuked were treacherous, murderous, and deceitful.

Harar was the springboard and political capital for Imam Ahmed. Imam Ahmed was born in Hubat, particularly in Zaka, which is 32 kilometers north-east of Harar town. It is located within the geographical parameters of the Harar Plateu.

 

[HabarSteven12]

Arab Faqih states that Ethio-Semitic speakers formed the dominant section of the Adal population. He also makes it clear that the sedentary agriculturalist population of Harar provided both the leadership in the jihadic war and that they were the majority of the fighters, at least during the early days of the jihad. No mention of Somalis being the majority in Harar.

Most of the Muslim rulers in Adal, Ifat, Shawa, and Hadiya seem to have been Semitic speakers who were Muslim in their customs, names, titles, and religion.

 

[Khaem]

The walls of Harar were built to repulse the nomads of cushitic stock. As I mentioned earlier, nomadic societies are generally anarchic and lawless. The walls were primarily built to keep out the Somali and Oromo nomads. Similar fortified walls were built in Zeila and Mogadishu to avert nomadic Somali incursions. Past civilizations and empires placed heavy restrictions on nomadic movements in their towns.

Somalis didn't develop Harar. What a ridiculous and outrageous statement! You are demonstrating you don't have the intellectual capacity to analyze historical sources with a critical eye. Some Somalis settled in Harar as caravan traders and nomads looking for grazing land. You have to understand that nomadic societies are constantly on the move in search of greener pasture and water. Merely settling in Harar doesn't equate to being the indigenous founders of the historic city.

Harar was an important trade and religious center that attracted many guests and traders. Somalis were never the majority of the inhabitants of Harar. Let me guess you are going to say Abadir Umar ar-Rida was a Somali who founded Harar. Abadir Umar ar-Rida is an Arab and was born in the Hejaz region of modern-day Saudi Arabia. The Somali clans that Imam Ahmed punished and rebuked were treacherous, murderous, and deceitful.

Harar was the springboard and political capital for Imam Ahmed. Imam Ahmed was born in Hubat, particularly in Zaka, which is 32 kilometers north-east of Harar town. It is located within the geographical parameters of the Harar Plateu.

Avoiding my reply debunking your idiocy

 

[Zak12]

Arab Faqih states that Ethio-Semitic speakers formed the dominant section of the Adal population. He also makes it clear that the sedentary agriculturalist population of Harar provided both the leadership in the jihadic war and that they were the majority of the fighters, at least during the early days of the jihad. No mention of Somalis being the majority in Harar.

Most of the Muslim rulers in Adal, Ifat, Shawa, and Hadiya seem to have been Semitic speakers who were Muslim in their customs, names, titles, and religion.

Harar was founded long after the Adal-Abyssinia war. It wasn't really a Adalite city since Adal barely existed by that point. Not to mention there is zero proof of Adal's and Ifat's rulers speaking Ethiosemitic languages. All of them had Arabic names but that is all we really know. For Harar's actual demographics, its clear Somalis formed a significant portion of its population in the 19th century. Menelik II's conquest of the city caused the vast majority of Somalis to flee or get killed.

As for the jihad itself, Somalis were literally the first people to answer the imam's call lol. The Futuh mentions Somalis the most out of every Muslim ethnic group and many of the generals such as Matan were Somali. Its pretty much agreed upon by scholars that Somalis were the bulk of the jihad army.

 

[Khaem]

Harar was founded long after the Adal-Abyssinia war. It wasn't really a Adalite city since Adal barely existed by that point. Not to mention there is zero proof of Adal's and Ifat's rulers speaking Ethiosemitic languages. All of them had Arabic names but that is all we really know. For Harar's actual demographics, its clear Somalis formed a significant portion of its population in the 19th century. Menelik II's conquest of the city caused the vast majority of Somalis to flee or get killed.

As for the jihad itself, Somalis were literally the first people to answer the imam's call lol. The Futuh mentions Somalis the most out of every Muslim ethnic group and many of the generals such as Matan were Somali. Its pretty much agreed upon by scholars that Somalis were the bulk of the jihad army.

Majority of the empire was in somali lands. The majority of people were in somali lands. The explicitly stated ethnicity of the important figures in the Jihad such as the general Matan, the successor and nephew of Gurey, Nur ect.

Were all Somali. This was a Somali state through and through. But these people can cope all they want.

These xoolo cope by saying things like "Well look at this page, imam attacked a somali clan so he's not somali" dumbass nigga, literally every somali leader up to the Sayyid and Barre attacked other somali clans.

 

[Somali_patriotic]

The walls of Harar were built to repulse the nomads of cushitic stock.

The walls were built to repulse oromos only
Before the walla were built somalis were always around there, why didn't they built walls? Lol
It was somalis who built it to protect their city.

As I mentioned earlier, nomadic societies are generally anarchic and lawless. The walls were primarily built to keep out the Somali and Oromo nomads.

Source for somali nomads? Also allow that nonsense you spread all the time. NOMADIC shieet
Not all somalis were strict pastoralists, nor were pastoralists moving around with no goal. Thousands of Mosques and stone structures built by pastoralists according to archeologicalists are all over somaliweyn, you don't like that fact tho.

Similar fortified walls were built in Zeila and Mogadishu to avert nomadic Somali incursions.

In 14th century the civilization of mogadishu was described as a nomadic?

Al umari spoke about the language spoken in zaylac which was somali. Lol allow the cope.

Somalis didn't develop Harar. What a ridiculous and outrageous statement!

Yes they did, prior to the walashama (a somali dynasty) harar was literally nothing it became a proper city with our arrival in late 15th century and early 16th century.

You are demonstrating you don't have the intellectual capacity to analyze historical sources with a critical eye.

"B-but critical analysis and shieet"

Harar was an important trade and religious center that attracted many guests and traders. Somalis were never the majority of the inhabitants of Harar

Oldest description of the inhabitants of harar 1814:

Is there an older census? 1841

Harar was an Islamic center aswell a somali center before menelik conquest of harar

Also there's no relations between the current inhabitants of the city "Hararis" and the people who lived there in 16th century.

Let me guess you are going to say Abadir Umar ar-Rida was a Somali who founded Harar. Abadir Umar ar-Rida is an Arab and was born in the Hejaz region of modern-day Saudi Arabia.

Why would i claim that mythical abadir umar al rida? He's only mentioned in one "Medieval" book called futuh madinat harar.
Lol even that book got exposed it's a manuscript written in 19th century and labelled as a medieval manuscripts.
It talks about events that happened in 19th century, was the writer a time traveller?!

The Somali clans that Imam Ahmed punished and rebuked were treacherous, murderous, and deceitful.

Nice cope lol, you talking about habar maqdi case which was literally a problem between them and geri
Geri told the imam and the imam solved it?
Yuk bro stop coping so hard this is embarrassing.
The imam himself used to burn villages, enslave it's inhabitants and loot them all?!
Yeah you're not going to talk about that

Harar was the springboard and political capital for Imam Ahmed. Imam Ahmed was born in Hubat, particularly in Zaka, which is 32 kilometers north-east of Harar town. It is located within the geographical parameters of the Harar Plateu.

The futuh distinguished hubat from Zaka lol
Now they're the same place according to you?!
You first claimed he was from harar, got debunked
Now this? Calm down brother, it's not hard to accept the reality.

 

[Somali_patriotic]

Arab Faqih states that Ethio-Semitic speakers formed the dominant section of the Adal population. He also makes it clear that the sedentary agriculturalist population of Harar provided both the leadership in the jihadic war and that they were the majority of the fighters, at least during the early days of the jihad.

Quote where in the futuh does it even mention "ethio-semitic"? Keep quoting the Ethiopianist Richard pankhurst lol
You're quoting this man and want me to take you seriously?

Most of the Muslim rulers in Adal, Ifat, Shawa, and Hadiya seem to have been Semitic speakers who were Muslim in their customs, names, titles, and religion.

Shewa never existed lol and all the other
Ifat and adal were ruled by somalis, don't care about hadiya or whatever that is.
You might find this video interesting!
A madow walal dunked on all your nonsense so hard

 

[Zak12]

Quote where in the futuh does it even mention "ethio-semitic"? Keep quoting the Ethiopianist Richard pankhurst lol
You're quoting this man and want me to take you seriously?
View attachment 304847


Shewa never existed lol and all the other
Ifat and adal were ruled by somalis, don't care about hadiya or whatever that is.
You might find this video interesting!
A madow walal dunked on all your nonsense so hard

I really have no idea why people shill the Muslim Ethiosemites like this. The Futuh doesn't even mention the supposedly important Argobba once lol

 

[Step a side]

Imams father was from Hubat and ruled there. So its safe to say thats where imam is from like ethiopians say. Za'kah is just Daakhate which is in the same zone as Hubat.

 

[HabarSteven12]

The walls were built to repulse oromos only
Before the walla were built somalis were always around there, why didn't they built walls? Lol
It was somalis who built it to protect their city.

Source for somali nomads? Also allow that nonsense you spread all the time. NOMADIC shieet
Not all somalis were strict pastoralists, nor were pastoralists moving around with no goal. Thousands of Mosques and stone structures built by pastoralists according to archeologicalists are all over somaliweyn, you don't like that fact tho.

In 14th century the civilization of mogadishu was described as a nomadic?
View attachment 304832
Al umari spoke about the language spoken in zaylac which was somali. Lol allow the cope.

Yes they did, prior to the walashama (a somali dynasty) harar was literally nothing it became a proper city with our arrival in late 15th century and early 16th century.

"B-but critical analysis and shieet"
View attachment 304837

Oldest description of the inhabitants of harar 1814:
View attachment 304840
Is there an older census? 1841
View attachment 304841
Harar was an Islamic center aswell a somali center before menelik conquest of harar
View attachment 304842
Also there's no relations between the current inhabitants of the city "Hararis" and the people who lived there in 16th century.View attachment 304843


Why would i claim that mythical abadir umar al rida? He's only mentioned in one "Medieval" book called futuh madinat harar.
Lol even that book got exposed it's a manuscript written in 19th century and labelled as a medieval manuscripts.
It talks about events that happened in 19th century, was the writer a time traveller?! View attachment 304846

Nice cope lol, you talking about habar maqdi case which was literally a problem between them and geri
Geri told the imam and the imam solved it?
Yuk bro stop coping so hard this is embarrassing.
The imam himself used to burn villages, enslave it's inhabitants and loot them all?!
Yeah you're not going to talk about that

The futuh distinguished hubat from Zaka lol
Now they're the same place according to you?!
You first claimed he was from harar, got debunked
Now this? Calm down brother, it's not hard to accept the reality.

It's futile and worthless to argue with you. The fact that you don't know Hubat is in the same zone as Zaka shows you don't have the intellectual capacity to effectively engage in this topic. It seems you don't understand what the Harar Plateu is.

You are cherry-picking and selectively choosing passages while disregarding their context to further advance your outrageous claims. Why are you quoting random passages in French? Why don't you quote the sources in English?

You are always disregarding academic sources and claiming that the statements of intellectual scholars are historical revisionism. By using your own logic, I could simply disregard all your sources. Your thinking processes and cognitive reflection are extremely strange and bizarre.

Emir Nur Mujahid built a wall around Harar as a protective barrier and to keep the town safe. The walls of Harar Jugol were built between the 13th and 16th centuries. The name of the wall isn't of Somali origin. Jugol is a synonym for the land of the indigenous Harari people. Somali hoteps claim Emir Nur was Marehan and built the wall. . The presence of Somali caravan traders in Harar implies that Somalis built and founded the historic city. Beautiful logic.

Semetic-speaking groups founded and built the Adal and Ifat kingdoms. The Walashma rulers were Arabs. I am arguing with the same fool who couldn't even tell me what the word Malasay means in the Somali language, but apparently Malasay were all Somalis.