How do ppl not believe in Islam???

LDNMALI

LDNMALI

OnlySpeakFacts
wallahi genetically Somali murtads are not somali, they are EX SOMALI MUSLIM, they've got pages dedicated to hating on Islam and spread islamophobic propaganda just because they had shitty parents who forced the deen on them, whitewashed cunts, they are even changing the meaning of waaq. it is our duty as Somalis to outcast these cucks and never welcome them
 
A

Ayubi

rational said:
These are all direct quotes.

Here's your reference on the hadith I quoted. https://sunnah.com/muslim/22/152

Anyways, whether it was for "2 black slaves" or "2 non-black slaves". The point remains, your prophet is knee deep in the purchase and trade of human beings.

On your other rebuttal, it doesn't say anything about raping slaves in the Qu'ran because the people who wrote it don't see it as raping slaves. It's their property. Again, no slave can truly consent to relations with a slavemaster - that's just facts. If you cannot see the power imbalance there you are the one who is truly blind.

"Oh no Mr. slavemaster sir, I don't wish to "marry" you...."

Not to mention the case where Muhammad "married" Safiyya bint Huyayy whose husband he had killed. What mental torture that was on that poor woman...

I don't need a Ph.D to see injustice

@Qali save your blessings dear...
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Not gonna waste time writing a lot to respond to your bs. Slavery in Islam has already been explained, search it up. You don’t have any objective morals, you shouldn’t even talk about Islam or religion.

Secondly you’re using the same refuted bullshit critics use against Islam about Safiyya. Safiyya (ra) was given the choice to go back to her people or accept Islam and marry the Prophet, she choice to marry the Prophet and accept Islam.


Also the Quran text doesn’t say anything about rape, rape is haram in islam.

Imam Malik said:

In our view the man who rapes a woman, regardless of whether she is a virgin or not, if she is a free woman he must pay a "dowry" like that of her peers, and if she is a slave he must pay whatever has been detracted from her value. The punishment is to be carried out on the rapist (Imam Maalik, Al-Muwatta', Volume 2, page 734)

Imam Al Shaafi’i said:

"If a man acquires by force a slave-girl, then has sexual intercourse with her after he acquires her by force, and if he is not excused by ignorance, then the slave-girl will be taken from him, he is required to pay the fine, and he will receive the punishment for illegal sexual intercourse." (Imam Al Shaafi'i, Kitaabul Umm, Volume 3, page 253)

Thirdly you’re ignorant, concubines throughout history consented to have intercourse and this has been confirmed by non Muslim professionals.

John McClintock said:

Women who followed their father and husbands to the war put on their finest dresses and ornaments previous to an engagement, in the hope of finding favor in the eyes of their captors in case of a defeat. (John McClintock, James Strong, "Cyclopædia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature" [Harper & Brothers, 1894], p. 782)

Matthew B. Schwartz said:

The Book of Deuteronomy prescribes its own rules for the treatment of women captured in war [ Deut 21:10-14 ] . Women have always followed armies to do the soldiers' laundry, to nurse the sick and wounded, and to serve as prostitutes

They would often dress in such a way as to attract the soldiers who won the battle. The Bible recognizes the realities of the battle situation in its rules on how to treat female captives, though commentators disagree on some of the details.

The biblical Israelite went to battle as a messenger of God. Yet he could also, of course, be caught up in the raging tide of blood and violence. The Western mind associates prowess, whether military or athletic, with sexual success.


The pretty girls crowd around the hero who scores the winning touchdown, not around the players of the losing team. And it is certainly true in war: the winning hero "attracts" the women.(Matthew B. Schwartz, Kalman J. Kaplan, "The Fruit of Her Hands: The Psychology of Biblical Women" [Wm. B. Eerdmans Publishing, 2007] , pp. 146-147)

Thus we see from two non-Muslim authors that concubines back in the past would consent to having sex with their captors. So if we put aside our 21st century mindset and look at history objectively, there is nothing wrong with saying that concubines back then consented to having sex with their captors.
 
Sheikh Kulkuli

Sheikh Kulkuli

Qali said:
Honestly don’t know how ppl just leave the deen, I came to the conclusion that I can’t.

Whenever I begin doubting the deen, I think about the sixr and that just reaffirms my beliefs.

Also the signs of the day of judgement are way too accurate to be some “estimation”

the sixr is the thing that’s keeping my Iman in check the MOST tbh
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Islam is a gift from Allah to mankind.
Just like not everyone is wealthy,healthy,good looking,Secure etc

Is the same as how someone is a muslim.
The heart of a human being is between the two fingers of Allah he can sway them the way he likes meaning Allah can make you Gaal or Muslim.
It depends upon the mercy of Allah.
The Prophet pbuh used to seek refuge from Allah.
He used to say "OO change of hearts, stabilise my heart with your belief,OO change of hearts stabilise my heart with your obedience."

We are in difficult times where one is a believer in the day and becomes disbelieve in the evening and vise verse.

Allah says in the Quraan if he wished he would have guided all humanity.

So life is like a ball rolling and the 11th hour is the most significant.Which defies your aboard in the hearafter.
So we need to ask Allah for a good ending in every prayer.

Never lose hope with the mercy of Allah.He is oft forgiving most merciful.No sin is greater than the mercy of Allah.Keep seeking forgiveness and have hope.

If everyone on this earth was a worshipper and non sinned then Allah would have gotten rid of them and created new race who sin and seek forgiveness from Allah.Because one of the attributes of Allah is raufu Rahim.ghafuru Rahim tawabu Rahim afuwun ghafur. Oft forgiving most merciful.
 
A

Ayubi

Ayubi said:
Not gonna waste time writing a lot to respond to your bs. Slavery in Islam has already been explained, search it up. You don’t have any objective morals, you shouldn’t even talk about Islam or religion.

Secondly you’re using the same refuted bullshit critics use against Islam about Safiyya. Safiyya (ra) was given the choice to go back to her people or accept Islam and marry the Prophet, she choice to marry the Prophet and accept Islam.


Also the Quran text doesn’t say anything about rape, rape is haram in islam.

Imam Malik said:

In our view the man who rapes a woman, regardless of whether she is a virgin or not, if she is a free woman he must pay a "dowry" like that of her peers, and if she is a slave he must pay whatever has been detracted from her value. The punishment is to be carried out on the rapist (Imam Maalik, Al-Muwatta', Volume 2, page 734)

Imam Al Shaafi’i said:

"If a man acquires by force a slave-girl, then has sexual intercourse with her after he acquires her by force, and if he is not excused by ignorance, then the slave-girl will be taken from him, he is required to pay the fine, and he will receive the punishment for illegal sexual intercourse." (Imam Al Shaafi'i, Kitaabul Umm, Volume 3, page 253)

Thirdly you’re ignorant, concubines throughout history consented to have intercourse and this has been confirmed by non Muslim professionals.

John McClintock said:

Women who followed their father and husbands to the war put on their finest dresses and ornaments previous to an engagement, in the hope of finding favor in the eyes of their captors in case of a defeat. (John McClintock, James Strong, "Cyclopædia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature" [Harper & Brothers, 1894], p. 782)

Matthew B. Schwartz said:

The Book of Deuteronomy prescribes its own rules for the treatment of women captured in war [ Deut 21:10-14 ] . Women have always followed armies to do the soldiers' laundry, to nurse the sick and wounded, and to serve as prostitutes

They would often dress in such a way as to attract the soldiers who won the battle. The Bible recognizes the realities of the battle situation in its rules on how to treat female captives, though commentators disagree on some of the details.

The biblical Israelite went to battle as a messenger of God. Yet he could also, of course, be caught up in the raging tide of blood and violence. The Western mind associates prowess, whether military or athletic, with sexual success.


The pretty girls crowd around the hero who scores the winning touchdown, not around the players of the losing team. And it is certainly true in war: the winning hero "attracts" the women.(Matthew B. Schwartz, Kalman J. Kaplan, "The Fruit of Her Hands: The Psychology of Biblical Women" [Wm. B. Eerdmans Publishing, 2007] , pp. 146-147)

Thus we see from two non-Muslim authors that concubines back in the past would consent to having sex with their captors. So if we put aside our 21st century mindset and look at history objectively, there is nothing wrong with saying that concubines back then consented to having sex with their captors.
Click to expand...
Already explained it
 
M

Marsh

Ayubi said:
Not gonna waste time writing a lot to respond to your bs. Slavery in Islam has already been explained, search it up. You don’t have any objective morals, you shouldn’t even talk about Islam or religion.

Secondly you’re using the same refuted bullshit critics use against Islam about Safiyya. Safiyya (ra) was given the choice to go back to her people or accept Islam and marry the Prophet, she choice to marry the Prophet and accept Islam.


Also the Quran text doesn’t say anything about rape, rape is haram in islam.

Imam Malik said:

In our view the man who rapes a woman, regardless of whether she is a virgin or not, if she is a free woman he must pay a "dowry" like that of her peers, and if she is a slave he must pay whatever has been detracted from her value. The punishment is to be carried out on the rapist (Imam Maalik, Al-Muwatta', Volume 2, page 734)

Imam Al Shaafi’i said:

"If a man acquires by force a slave-girl, then has sexual intercourse with her after he acquires her by force, and if he is not excused by ignorance, then the slave-girl will be taken from him, he is required to pay the fine, and he will receive the punishment for illegal sexual intercourse." (Imam Al Shaafi'i, Kitaabul Umm, Volume 3, page 253)

Thirdly you’re ignorant, concubines throughout history consented to have intercourse and this has been confirmed by non Muslim professionals.

John McClintock said:

Women who followed their father and husbands to the war put on their finest dresses and ornaments previous to an engagement, in the hope of finding favor in the eyes of their captors in case of a defeat. (John McClintock, James Strong, "Cyclopædia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature" [Harper & Brothers, 1894], p. 782)

Matthew B. Schwartz said:

The Book of Deuteronomy prescribes its own rules for the treatment of women captured in war [ Deut 21:10-14 ] . Women have always followed armies to do the soldiers' laundry, to nurse the sick and wounded, and to serve as prostitutes

They would often dress in such a way as to attract the soldiers who won the battle. The Bible recognizes the realities of the battle situation in its rules on how to treat female captives, though commentators disagree on some of the details.

The biblical Israelite went to battle as a messenger of God. Yet he could also, of course, be caught up in the raging tide of blood and violence. The Western mind associates prowess, whether military or athletic, with sexual success.


The pretty girls crowd around the hero who scores the winning touchdown, not around the players of the losing team. And it is certainly true in war: the winning hero "attracts" the women.(Matthew B. Schwartz, Kalman J. Kaplan, "The Fruit of Her Hands: The Psychology of Biblical Women" [Wm. B. Eerdmans Publishing, 2007] , pp. 146-147)

Thus we see from two non-Muslim authors that concubines back in the past would consent to having sex with their captors. So if we put aside our 21st century mindset and look at history objectively, there is nothing wrong with saying that concubines back then consented to having sex with their captors.
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Do you truly believe that a slave could refuse the person that owns her sex without repercussions :childplease: @Qali you have not been saved yet
 
Sheikh Kulkuli

Sheikh Kulkuli

Somalis need to learn how to act mature.

Iyaka dada diinta nacsiyo oo kasaara.

There is this guy on tiki tok wariyaha_tiktok
He might be Djibouti an or Landeer.
So he seems to be lost and is preaching the gospel.

The comments on tiktok are ruthless.

Non is praying for Allah to guide him.
Everyone is cursing him.


Good news is he has reverted back to Islam and he is taking shahada.
 
Mehdi Hassan

Mehdi Hassan

rational said:
I will tell you this, when Islam legislates on things like alcohol/pork consumption and what limb to cut off for stealing, but does not explicitly abolish the ownership of HUMANS, it is an oversight so immense that I can dismiss this supposedly "Most-Merciful" deity outright.

"O you who have believed, prescribed for you is legal retribution for those murdered - the free for the free, the slave for the slave, and the female for the female..." Quran (2:178)

Here is Muhammad (a.k.a Allah) using the practice of slavery as a metaphor to differentiate monotheism from polytheism:

"Allah presents an example: a slave owned by quarreling partners and another belonging exclusively to one man - are they equal in comparison? Praise be to Allah ! But most of them do not know." Quran (39:29)

An example showing how "Allah" has blessed the free man over slaves:

"Allah presents an example: a slave [who is] owned and unable to do a thing and he to whom We have provided from Us good provision, so he spends from it secretly and publicly. Can they be equal? Praise to Allah ! But most of them do not know." Quran (16:75)

Enabling the rape of slaves referred to here as "their right hands possess". FYI, a slave can never consent to relations with a slavemaster.

"Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed" Quran (23:6)

Hadith where Muhammad traded 1 slave for 2 black slaves:

"There came a slave and pledged allegiance to Allah's Apostle on migration; he (the Holy Prophet) did not know that he was a slave. Then there came his master and demanded him back, whereupon Allah's Apostle said: Sell him to me. And he bought him for two black slaves, and he did not afterwards take allegiance from anyone until he had asked him whether he was a slave (or a free man)" [Sahih Muslim 1602)

The above hadith was taken from a chapter titled "Chapter: The permissibility of selling animals for animals of the same kind and of different quality" - I will let you come to a conclusion on that.

A hadith where Muhammad admonished a woman for freeing a slave:

"Maimuna bint Al-Harith told him that she manumitted a slave-girl without taking the permission of the Prophet. On the day when it was her turn to be with the Prophet, she said, "Do you know, O Allah's Messenger, that I have manumitted my slave-girl?" He said, "Have you really?" She replied in the affirmative. He said, "You would have got more reward if you had given her (i.e. the slave-girl) to one of your maternal uncles." [Sahih al-Bukhari 2592]

A hadith where Muhammad undid the freeing of a slave because the slavemaster owed a debt:

"A man manumitted a slave and he had no other property than that, so the Prophet canceled the manumission (and sold the slave for him). Nu'aim bin Al-Nahham bought the slave from him." [Sahih al-Bukhari 2415]

---------

Organized religion is the equivalent of fast food, y'all are being feed "100% beef" and surprise surprise, it's not beef.

Never outsource your moral compass,
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Although we cannot say for certain the reasoning behind prohibitions, alcohol is likely prohibited due to its vast and far-reaching harmful effects on the individual and society as a whole. And as for pork, it's the same - we just don't know for sure why it isn't allowed but it is most likely simply a test of our conviction, after all it is apparently quite delicious. But anyways they often are forced to eat their own feces on farms and bacon (which is quite popular) is unhealthy, so I believe it's safe to assume the harm outweighs the few benefits (not exclusive to it either). However, I must correct you in saying that Islam does not in fact explicitly abolish slavery, it actually has. Let me explain this to you though, this is very important in understanding this. At the advent of Islam, slavery was institutionalized and widespread in all four corners of the world. To completely abolish slavery immediately would have an unnecessary impact on the global economy, at a time where slavery was practically a necessity. Instead, what Islam did, was limit slavery in its various forms. It prohibited the enslavement of non-Muslims outside of prisoners of war, and made mandatory good treatment of slaves. Slavery ended worldwide after the international treaty was signed in Berlin in 1860 AD. Based on the aforementioned, slavery is impermissible in the Shari'ah. Rape is also haram. There are also no chapters entitled an entire sentence, regardless of the language they are translated to. Muhammad PBUH was the first person in recorded history to proclaim that no person was superior to another by the virtue of his race, but by his tawa (piety). I'll allow you to come to a conclusion as to his stance on racism (which he also described as a remnant of ignorance in one of his companions). And that perfectly leads into a little story, one day Bilal RA was called by another of the Prophet SAW's companions, "Oh son of a black woman (in Sawda)" In response, the Messenger SAW ordered him to kneel down and kiss his feet as a gesture to beg for forgiveness from Bilal RA. What does that say about him? I'll leave you to decide that as well. Maimuna also was never a slave, she was a free woman whom was given a merciful proposition by Rasullulah SAW - either leave for her people or convert to Islam and wed the Prophet PBUH. And she freely choose the latter, as any sensible woman would. I'd also like to end by formulating to you a simple question, you warn the Muslimeen never to 'outsource their moral compass' but do you even have one yourself? I think not. If otherwise, from where do you draw this moral code of yours? I'd really like to know.
 
Q

Qali

Certified Pimp.
Mehdi Hassan said:
Although we cannot say for certain the reasoning behind prohibitions, alcohol is likely prohibited due to its vast and far-reaching harmful effects on the individual and society as a whole. And as for pork, it's the same - we just don't know for sure why it isn't allowed but it is most likely simply a test of our conviction, after all it is apparently quite delicious. But anyways they often are forced to eat their own feces on farms and bacon (which is quite popular) is unhealthy, so I believe it's safe to assume the harm outweighs the few benefits (not exclusive to it either). However, I must correct you in saying that Islam does not in fact explicitly abolish slavery, it actually has. Let me explain this to you though, this is very important in understanding this. At the advent of Islam, slavery was institutionalized and widespread in all four corners of the world. To completely abolish slavery immediately would have an unnecessary impact on the global economy, at a time where slavery was practically a necessity. Instead, what Islam did, was limit slavery in its various forms. It prohibited the enslavement of non-Muslims outside of prisoners of war, and made mandatory good treatment of slaves. Slavery ended worldwide after the international treaty was signed in Berlin in 1860 AD. Based on the aforementioned, slavery is impermissible in the Shari'ah. Rape is also haram. There are also no chapters entitled an entire sentence, regardless of the language they are translated to. Muhammad PBUH was the first person in recorded history to proclaim that no person was superior to another by the virtue of his race, but by his tawa (piety). I'll allow you to come to a conclusion as to his stance on racism (which he also described as a remnant of ignorance in one of his companions). And that perfectly leads into a little story, one day Bilal RA was called by another of the Prophet SAW's companions, "Oh son of a black woman (in Sawda)" In response, the Messenger SAW ordered him to kneel down and kiss his feet as a gesture to beg for forgiveness from Bilal RA. What does that say about him? I'll leave you to decide that as well. Maimuna also was never a slave, she was a free woman whom was given a merciful proposition by Rasullulah SAW - either leave for her people or convert to Islam and wed the Prophet PBUH. And she freely choose the latter, as any sensible woman would. I'd also like to end by formulating to you a simple question, you warn the Muslimeen never to 'outsource their moral compass' but do you even have one yourself? I think not. If otherwise, from where do you draw this moral code of yours? I'd really like to know.
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God bless you too brother :umad:
 
Mehdi Hassan

Mehdi Hassan

rational said:
Just don't come to me with Islam had a "kind version of slavery". Ain't nobody willingly found their way miles from their homeland to be someone's property. Especially my fellow black Africans.

Also, please don't bring up the token Bilal too. That man was so shook, everytime he made a mistake he lead with "May my father be ransomed for you". In some hadiths he even mentioned his "mother and father". Poor guy was used as a human alarm clock, butler, and security guard.
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Islam stipulates that an owner treat his slave with the respect and dignity as befits a fellow human being.
 
Mehdi Hassan

Mehdi Hassan

The Bloody-Nine said:
Perfect religion for a slave owner the convenience is super clear. Another example the prophet wants to marry his adopted sons ex wife but he can't cause adopted children being viewed as actual children so adoption is labeled haram all together.
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Where is the source for this blabbery? Islam is far from the perfect religion for a slave owner, it demands that owners treat their slaves with dignity and respect. And the only permissible circumstances for enslavement captors after a battle. I fail to grasp the so-called 'convenience' this religion provides for anyone, let alone the slave owner.
 
Mehdi Hassan

Mehdi Hassan

rational said:
You do not see how it is a messed up thing to have as a policy 'free a human being' in order to erase some supposed sin? "Hey fellas, didn't fast today, no problem, free a slave!" - and then on top of that have the prophet undo the freeing of such slaves in the examples I've shown above?

In regards to the Bilal situation: men who've always been free and who probably had pagan fathers (they were fighting against) vs. a man who was actually bought and sold? If you can't see why it is disturbing for Bilal to say that phrase I don't know what to say.
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Not at all, that surely is a good deed? I was under the impression that you sir are against slavery.
 
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