I hate this East African nonsense

[Nilotic]

welcome to the somali forums. if you return in 2030 it will be the same thing.

Bro, I think you meant to extend the welcome to the other guy

I'm practically one of y'all now; might as well call me Abdi Deng

 

[Yami]

Somalian main character syndrome. Get a job

 

[Lightshow]

East Africa is not an identity; it's a geographical region within Africa. No one, and I mean absolutely no one but Somalis would even entertain this absurd idea of removing themselves from a geographical label. They're so offended by being grouped with their neighbors in any capacity that they're now trying to reject an identity that never even existed in the first place. Then one user (xyro) says that it has nothing to do with Madows seeing that they have the same feelings towards Ethiopians and Middle Easterners, only for 'Puntite Queen' to post some bullshit like this:

"Humans have evolved to recognise and favor in-group members based on familiarity... That's why you'll see some Somalis sometimes support Tutsis (partial Cushitic dna). It would be similar to how Somalis would feel when they see another Cushitic person."

This whole conversation reeks of xenophobia masked as a need to preserve one's identity. Notice that no one has brought up a concrete example of who's stealing their identity/erasing their cultural footprint, even though I've asked several times. The only example that was brought up (by me) was the dirac to which I got a hostile response. "I don't know why you East Africans have a fixation with watching Somalis, and also trying to erase our cultural footprint."
As if there's this secret agenda against them. Absurd.

If this Ethiopian (Nilotic) girl knew how Somalis really felt about her wearing it, she'd probably throw it in the bin. I don't even know if this counts as a "baati"/dirac because it's nothing I've really considered.

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It's easy to sit there and list every single item different groups have "appropriated," but is it really systematic, or is it something that's gradually happened over time? And what's magically going to change by them rebranding themselves as "non-East Africans"? Nothing.

This whole discussion is bullshit; they're just cherry-picking examples and piling them on to create this false "us versus them" narrative.

Their cultural identity has nothing to do with East Africa as a region. If they want to preserve their culture, they should work on it internally instead of pointing fingers at everyone else.

Seriously, who even thinks of this shit? Imagine a Bulgarian starting a discussion about Southern Europeans trying to homogenise them. It's absurd.

Ironically, it's Somalia that's been begging to join the EAC since 2012. A community that was founded on principles such as mutual cooperation, equitable benefit distribution, and people-centered, market-driven integration.

I, for one, don't want a person with weird energy in my back yard. We've accepted them as a community and even made one of theirs MP in our second largest town yet it's always weird energy from their side. Perhaps they should collaborate with Rwandans, as they seem to have more in common with them.

I don't personally place much importance on the Kenyan label; I identify primarily by my tribe, whether it's in Kenya, Tanzania, Uganda, Congo, Ethiopia, or South Sudan. Nevertheless, I maintain cordial relationships with my neighbors. You might all label us as Madow but we're not the same. Our languages, cultures and histories are completely different but we still find a way to coexist because we have to

You wrote all of that because some Somalis voiced suspicion of colonial titles?

If you have Ubuntu we also have our own culture and governing system, its called Somali Xeer law.

Do some soul searching and stop with this. There is nothing wrong with mutually benefitting from economic exchange, but you have to learn respect for other cultures and stop lecturing to a people whom you do not understand at all.

 

[Nilote2]

So you obviously have a chip on your shoulders which is fine but you're lying about coming on here with good intentions if you can say these negative things about Somalis just because some users did not like your posts and rightfully called you out.

I will always express my views openly, regardless of the community. What you're trying to do is gaslight the situation because you don't like what I'm saying. Xyro initiated the thread with "wtf do me and a Ugandan have in common?" Only for other users to start talking about East African body genetics and how Yemenis are closer to them because they're Muslims. If you look at my initial response you'll see that I started off with "don't you think there are Muslims in other East African countries as well?"

You mistook them distancing from "East African" as an identity label (not geographic) in your mind as the typical racist Somalis who always distance themselves from other Blacks as is a common complaint by Kenyans which you identify with based on your posts.

There's no such thing as a Somali racist, you can't be racist towards someone that has the same skin colour as you. They're degenerates, we have plenty of those in Kenya too. I grew up around Somalis abroad, so my impression did not come from interactions in Kenya or on social media. My Somali friends have explicitly told me that your community has the same supremacist mindset towards everyone regardless of whether they're cadaan, Madow, Arab & that you even discriminate your own (Midgan/Madiban). So it's not about having a chip on my shoulder but questioning your reasoning when I hear stuff I don't agree with. There are many things about your culture/history that are admirable and some things that are detestable.

My only question is, if you choose to distance yourself to the point of refusing to acknowledge our shared regional ties, why should I continue to invest in this relationship? Nairobi is a multicultural hub but when I go to my ancestral land, I don't want to be surrounded by negativity. We're all different communities but while we're trying to build bridges you're burning them with your divisive mindset.

 

[Nilote2]

You wrote all of that because some Somalis voiced suspicion of colonial titles?

If you have Ubuntu we also have our own culture and governing system, its called Somali Xeer law.

Ubuntu is not "my system," it's Zulu in origin but encompasses the African spirit.

Ubuntu means humanity onto others.

Do some soul searching and stop with this. There is nothing wrong with mutually benefitting from economic exchange, but you have to learn respect for other cultures and stop lecturing to a people whom you do not understand at all.

Our populations are only growing and it's going to get to a point where the Somali population in my region grows bigger seeing that more people will most likely move there once they see that there is an economic opportunity. To coexist you need to have some form of relationship because nobody wants to live next to somebody that totally distances themselves from them. This is how Indians acted before Idi Amin expelled them.

 

[Lightshow]

Ubuntu is not "my system," it's Zulu in origin but encompasses the African spirit.

Ubuntu means humanity onto others.



Our populations are only growing and it's going to get to a point where the Somali population in my region grows bigger seeing that more people will most likely move there once they see that there is an economic opportunity. To coexist you need to have some form of relationship because nobody wants to live next to somebody that totally distances themselves from them. This is how Indians acted before Idi Amin expelled them.

What do you mean "distance" themselves. Of course I can only guess what that means, but you surely have the answer.

Somalis are not racist or prejudice like you think, ofcourse we are not as we have the same skin like you mentioned right?

It is more to do with language, culture and religious barriers. The Somali culture is based on clan structure and the culture is built around the language. It is an ancient longstanding ethnic group, and that has to be respected like all cultures should be.

Two differing tribes/nations can be neighbours and mutually benefit without intermixing in terms of marriage, I can assure you that. Why does marriage, and ultimately sexual access have to be the goal? That does not even make sense if that is what you mean.

 

[Nilotic]

To coexist you need to have some form of relationship because nobody wants to live next to somebody that totally distances themselves from them. This is how Indians acted before Idi Amin expelled them.

If they follow the same laws and regulations; and you can conduct business with them... what else is required?

Who cares if someone distances themselve from you?

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

What do you mean "distance" themselves. Of course I can only guess what that means, but you surely have the answer.

Somalis are not racist or prejudice like you think, ofcourse we are not as we have the same skin like you mentioned right?

It is more to do with language, culture and religious barriers. The Somali culture is based on clan structure and the culture is built around the language. It is an ancient longstanding ethnic group, and that has to be respected like all cultures should be.

Two differing tribes/nations can be neighbours and mutually benefit without intermixing in terms of marriage, I can assure you that. Why does marriage, and ultimately sexual access have to be the goal? That does not even make sense if that is what you mean.

Somalis have friends in Kenya, neighbours, classmates, business partners. The only thing that is missing, that really pisses people off, is free sexual access, and intermarriage. Let's keep it real. That's what is really upsetting people. We've seen countless examples of Kenyan men complaining online about sexual access. Meanwhile, the truth is, nobody holds Somali women hostage. Somali women make the choice to not marry certain people, it's called a 'preference'.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

If they follow the same laws and regulations; and you can conduct business with them... what else is required?

Who cares if someone distances themselve from you?

You take pride in your people, your country and you love your women. Of course, it doesn't make sense to you for people to complain about people that offer friendship, business relations and overall hospitality. The only people that take issues with Somalis wanting to stay Somali, are people who want 'other access'.

 

[Nilote2]

What do you mean "distance" themselves. Of course I can only guess what that means, but you surely have the answer.

Somalis are not racist or prejudice like you think, ofcourse we are not as we have the same skin like you mentioned right?

It is more to do with language, culture and religious barriers. The Somali culture is based on clan structure and the culture is built around the language. It is an ancient longstanding ethnic group, and that has to be respected like all cultures should be.

When people on this forum express that they don't want to be part of the East African community because they're culturally/phenotypically different from the rest and that we're stealing their identity, how do you expect us to interpret it? These reasons are ridiculous because we're all culturally and phenotypically different despite what you may think. I don't know why you feel threathened by acknowledging that you've been sharing a region with non-Somalis for hundreds of years.

Two differing tribes/nations can be neighbours and mutually benefit without intermixing in terms of marriage, I can assure you that. Why does marriage, and ultimately sexual access have to be the goal? That does not even make sense if that is what you mean.

Nobody mentioned marriage.

 

[bobby_hill-Punt]

I will always express my views openly, regardless of the community. What you're trying to do is gaslight the situation because you don't like what I'm saying. Xyro initiated the thread with "wtf do me and a Ugandan have in common?" Only for other users to start talking about East African body genetics and how Yemenis are closer to them because they're Muslims. If you look at my initial response you'll see that I started off with "don't you think there are Muslims in other East African countries as well?"



There's no such thing as a Somali racist, you can't be racist towards someone that has the same skin colour as you. They're degenerates, we have plenty of those in Kenya too. I grew up around Somalis abroad, so my impression did not come from interactions in Kenya or on social media. My Somali friends have explicitly told me that your community has the same supremacist mindset towards everyone regardless of whether they're cadaan, Madow, Arab & that you even discriminate your own (Midgan/Madiban). So it's not about having a chip on my shoulder but questioning your reasoning when I hear stuff I don't agree with. There are many things about your culture/history that are admirable and some things that are detestable.

My only question is, if you choose to distance yourself to the point of refusing to acknowledge our shared regional ties, why should I continue to invest in this relationship? Nairobi is a multicultural hub but when I go to my ancestral land, I don't want to be surrounded by negativity. We're all different communities but while we're trying to build bridges you're burning them with your divisive mindset.

You talk as if kenya is yours but you tend to forget that 40% of Kenya is Somali's ancestral land. If people are distant in cultural and custom maybe that who we are as a whole in Somali society.For instance the major cities or region were first named by Somalis because they were our trading posts. The Whole term of East African used to just belong to Somalis and Ethiopian and Eritrean and Djibouti. Now that we decided to leave the whole term and create a new identity as just Horners why are you having a problem with it?

 

[Nilote2]

If they follow the same laws and regulations; and you can conduct business with them... what else is required?

Who cares if someone distances themselve from you?

As someone who nearly lost half his family in a genocide, I can tell you that getting along with your neighbour is important. When you move into someone's ancestral land they're always going to ask you about your intentions because nobody wants to live next to a stranger. It might work at first when there are a few but as their population starts growing it's going to start bringing resentment if they're perceived as a community that's just there to profit. Especially if they carry the same attitude as Indians.

 

[Nilote2]

You talk as if kenya is yours but you tend to forget that 40% of Kenya is Somali's ancestral land. If people are distant in cultural and custom maybe that who we are as a whole in Somali society.For instance the major cities or region were first named by Somalis because they were our trading posts. The Whole term of East African used to just belong to Somalis and Ethiopian and Eritrean and Djibouti. Now that we decided to leave the whole term and create a new identity as just Horners why are you having a problem with it?

I'm not talking about Kenya, I'm talking about my ancestral land.

NB: My ancestors were the original inhabitants of Kenya, not yours. They intermarried with Nilotes. My E-V32 haplogroup predates yours by 2000 years if that's the route you want to take.

 

[Nilotic]

As someone who nearly lost half his family in a genocide, I can tell you that getting along with your neighbour is important. When you move into someone's ancestral land they're always going to ask you about your intentions because nobody wants to live next to a stranger. It might work at first when there are a few but as their population starts growing it's going to start bringing resentment if they're perceived as a community that's just there to profit. Especially if they carry the same attitude as Indians.

I'm sorry that you lost family members; and may they rest in peace.

If a different group of people enter your lands for mutually beneficial commerce; are still clearly a demographic minority in your ethnic lands; and abide by your laws... you're in the driver's seat.

It's really up to you to make sure that you retain the edge in commerce; and control the official and un-official levers of power.

Indians didn't even do anything wrong in Uganda; they were just used as a scapegoat by Idi Amin due to his incompetence and mismanagement.

The truth is that Uganda could have invested into their entrepreneurs and significantly reduced their dependence on Indian owned businesses.

Idi Amin was a Karo (South Sudanese ethnic group) so I'm not even criticising him for invalid reasons.

 

[canjeeroiyoshah]

I will always express my views openly, regardless of the community. What you're trying to do is gaslight the situation because you don't like what I'm saying. Xyro initiated the thread with "wtf do me and a Ugandan have in common?" Only for other users to start talking about East African body genetics and how Yemenis are closer to them because they're Muslims. If you look at my initial response you'll see that I started off with "don't you think there are Muslims in other East African countries as well?"



There's no such thing as a Somali racist, you can't be racist towards someone that has the same skin colour as you. They're degenerates, we have plenty of those in Kenya too. I grew up around Somalis abroad, so my impression did not come from interactions in Kenya or on social media. My Somali friends have explicitly told me that your community has the same supremacist mindset towards everyone regardless of whether they're cadaan, Madow, Arab & that you even discriminate your own (Midgan/Madiban). So it's not about having a chip on my shoulder but questioning your reasoning when I hear stuff I don't agree with. There are many things about your culture/history that are admirable and some things that are detestable.

My only question is, if you choose to distance yourself to the point of refusing to acknowledge our shared regional ties, why should I continue to invest in this relationship? Nairobi is a multicultural hub but when I go to my ancestral land, I don't want to be surrounded by negativity. We're all different communities but while we're trying to build bridges you're burning them with your divisive mindset.

Just remember the folks posting here are sharing their own views and opinions. They don't speak for every Somali person out there nor do they claim to. This was just a discussion, don't let it color how you see Somalis in your city since that wouldn't be fair. You don't even know what views they hold.

 

[Som]

Somalis are closer to Yemenis our Muslim brothers than Kenyans or Ethiopians

Our closest relatives when it comes to genetics and culture are Afar muslims , Oromo Muslims and maybe other Ethiopian habesha Muslims such as Hararis. Yemenis come after all these

 

[canjeeroiyoshah]

Our closest relatives when it comes to genetics and culture are Afar muslims , Oromo Muslims and maybe other Ethiopian habesha Muslims such as Hararis. Yemenis come after all these

Genetically the Habesha would be closer to you than a Yemeni.

 

[Som]

Genetically the Habesha would be closer to you than a Yemeni.

Yes them too of course. I mean that I feel more combined (culture and ethnic ) proximity to habesha Muslims , but the habesha christians are also our closest relatives after cushitic speakers. Yemenis are far removed from us , the connection is more historical and cultural because of islam

 

[Nilote2]

I'm sorry that you lost family members; and may they rest in peace.

If a different group of people enter your lands for mutually beneficial commerce; are still clearly a demographic minority in your ethnic lands; and abide by your laws... you're in the driver's seat.

It's really up to you to make sure that you retain the edge in commerce; and control the official and un-official levers of power.

Indians didn't even do anything wrong in Uganda; they were just used as a scapegoat by Idi Amin due to his incompetence and mismanagement.

Nah bro, Indians were brought over to build the railway seeing that the British had already exploited them while building the railway in India. Those who remained were granted privileges that other Africans didn't get and became intermediaries between the white man and the Madows. Nairobi and several other urban centres were segregated by race, with separate areas reserved for Asians and Europeans. However, Somalis were granted greater mobility and access to urban areas because their chiefs lobbied to be classified as Asians. There is a 1922 letter from a Darod chief stating that they would rather die than be treated equally to inferior tribes who had once been their slaves & in the 1930's members of an Isaaq clan also lobbied to be labelled Asian. At the time of Amin's expulsion, Asians controlled 70% of Uganda's economy despite making up less than 1% of the population & they were extremely racist/xenophobic. I went to school with an Asian girl whose grandfather, who had dementia, used to treat blacks like peasants when he first arrived in the UK. Even her father was prejudice, he didn't want her being around blacks at Uni but gave me a pass because I was Kenyan.

 

[bobby_hill-Punt]

I'm not talking about Kenya, I'm talking about my ancestral land.

NB: My ancestors were the original inhabitants of Kenya, not yours. They intermarried with Nilotes. My E-V32 haplogroup predates yours by 2000 years if that's the route you want to take.

I think that false information. Your ancestor are recent arrives to the East Africa. If we take a deep dive into your DNA I bet you'll have heavy admixture of bantu . My ancestor have always been in East Africa and ran trade with the enter world. What is your name of your people ?