Industrial Policy is the Only Thing that Saves a Nation

[Deng Xiaobling]

What you are forgetting is, they know in order for their plans to work, they need Somalia to be 1 day away from starvation and civil war.

So how exactly do you expect this government or previous one or the one after to have a national industrial plan? The government is literally existing on Pay cheque to pay cheque.

Can you explain the first part in terms of geopolitics? What is it exactly that you're saying people benefit by Somalia being this way, do you mean US and Saudi?

How do I expect this government to do it? I don't. There's no difference between this government and the last colonial government. We have experience on what to do to a government like this. Hopefully we also learn from our mistakes.

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Deng Xiaobling that was a interesting post. We must keep our nation internally built, I don't like the model of lots of african/arab countries that is external focused either thru oil or thru trade or thru services. We will always ride up and down with geopolitics while our house shakes inside with tremor.

A good example is former dictator all his arms came from the soviets, while the inside was sitting on nothing in terms of money, so even if he went to war, he would've exhausted all his money and end up not being able to continue his war. Then the weapon supply was cut as the soviets chose ethiopia, possibly for many reasons as Siyad wasn't loyal, broke deals, switched sides, and so forth. So a good idea is we need to learn to keep our loyalty and not this ok we got our policy secured and now will dump the guy who helped us and bring his enemy.

If we succeed in federalism adoption in Somalia, we need to be courteous to the west-ethio-khalij and say this wat we intend to do if we bring china in or any country they may perceive as a problem. Because they saved us from being a gun gun dhalay under a brotherhood nation and possibly our survival, you don't forget the realities when things get done.

Where-as with China, they never even interfered and would just sit there and watch u head into abyss and irrelevancy with a strong brotherhood nation focus on mogadishu. China would of stood by when the holocaust happen and it comes down to their values(none) it's all interest interest interest and the world is 8 billion and they know you need REAL FRIENDS.

A man with no principles is a man you can never trust. Even if you have bad principles at least ppl know where u stand like the brotherhood. China thinks it's outsmarting people but u aint, were gonna keep strictly business like i go to chinese store and buy stuff and then leave with no strings attached. Purely economical and you will not influence our foreign policy like i wouldnt accept a chinese store person to tell me who and what I should to my friends in my house.

 

[DR OSMAN]

I think we gonna have to get into the world mess, we could indirectly harm ourselves by not taking a position like China does(I mean does it really have any friends), everyone looks at the neutral guy as just standing by unreliable and only about ourselves. It needs a bit of work our foreign policy. How do we view the world is gonna be the first thing we need to decide.

Do we view as a threat or an opportunity? If we decide this world is a threat, american model may need to be studied. If we view it as an opportunity we need to find another model. We got a world that is basically a mix of values(hearts), idealogical spheres(or mind or thinking unities), economical(trade), others based on security(regional or global).

Start with listing the key themes in values. Freedom is one big one that is shared among nations. God is another one. Nationality is also in various degrees and forms some are strong as hell like china, others weaker like india or africa in general due to prevailing ancient identities. Some are mix of all that together like Israel(does freedom, nationality, and god in one swoop) in varying degrees obviously nationality is first or zionism.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Idealogical world is also important and people views of how a country should operate after their values are decided that binds them together, horta the ppl need to bind first before you move to idealogy. The idealogies in the world are simply democracy, some communism, some traditionalism mixed in with religion (oman, brunei, gulf). That's all I can see in the world as term of idealogy and they flavor it to their circumstances. Don't mix it up with enforcement of idealogy that is different, some enforcing it with a king, dictator, presidents, etc. How it's done can vary(elections, one party state, internal council). It can be faciliated thru money, guns, or votes some inherit it(kings). Gulf use money route to satisfy it's people, some a gun, some go to the polls.

Now how well it's admined all these idealogies is another scale. For example oman admined well but it aint democracy where-as some countries are democracies and admined bad. A good example is Africa the idealogy is good but the administration is rotten, the governance of the idealogy also matters to it's success or else it's just a nice idea. So I think the idealogy isn't the problem, if the people are binded by concrete values they agree on(whether its good values or not) is irrelevant their binded and they decided on their idealogy, what it boils down to is the governance.

So you could have a socialist state or communist state that is great administration or a kingdom that is great administration, or a theocracy that is great administration. It really boils down to how they govern. I'd prefer being in a country like oman then in any second rate democracy in the world.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Should we use a simple rule with the world, if we see happiness from your people, we are happy for you too and if we see anyone jepordising that regardless who they are we stand firmly against it. If their happy being under a gun, we must support them and if anyone comes along saying otherwise, we should rebuke them for ruining a happy home cause you don't like how it operates.

Warzone areas will be bit different sxb, you cant be on all sides here. We must look at all their policies and see which one looks like it will hold long-term and not re-collapse after studying their history, differences, problems, foreing hands, local agendas, etc. Being neutral will mean whoever wins will say u wouldn't of supported me when I was in trouble, why should I trust u now and we could lock ourselves out.

But I have been to many homes who run strangely to what I envision as a good home but their happy as pig as shit with the arrangement. Isn't that the whole purpose so their happy, how they get there who really cares. For example if ethio is at war with eritrea and eritrea crumbles and ethio has a hand in there, we must just step back and consider their foreign interest as they supported us in federalism, it needs to be taken into consideration foreign hand especially if they stood by us.

Even we dont agree ethio approach in a warzone eritrea, the most we should do is respond with neutrality and even then we must speak to ethio if it's ok we do not involve ourselves as we don't see what your doing is wise but we won't hurt you either. Foreign policy isn't about taking sides from what I can see, it's showing u hold your word so even if your side loses, the next guy knows you will hold your word and not switch around like a futo. We can start new partnership with the new guy who won and say listen I know I was against u but we have a foreign policy that we don't change and we would like to work with u and keep that sort of relationship where it won't change either after their assessed obviously.

 

[Descendent-Of-Fiqi]

Industrial policy requires a source of investment and a united country. Could we even manage to run even a factory without a manager giving jobs to he's clan members only, also physical labour has a bad stigma in Somalia, it's why businessmen import Kenyans to work on fields as general labour.

 

[Ras]

Can you explain the first part in terms of geopolitics? What is it exactly that you're saying people benefit by Somalia being this way, do you mean US and Saudi?

How do I expect this government to do it? I don't. There's no difference between this government and the last colonial government. We have experience on what to do to a government like this. Hopefully we also learn from our mistakes.

More threads like this please.


I agree with you for the most parts apart from the nuclear desalination plants.

For one, that isn't economically feasible if you want to grow food cheaper domestically than importing it.

It's at around 5-3 kwh/m3 today at large plants.

We need 10,000 m3 per hectare in our climate.

Secondly, a nuclear power industry would take ages to develop even if we stole or bought the tech from abroad.

We need to feed everyone today if you want to increase the GDP per capita.

Like you said we can't rely on Ethiopia and the water from the rivers are far from enough to feed 15 million of us anyways.

Desalination is not viable without new tech and collecting water from mountain springs & other surface water resources won't cut it.

I'm holding out for large reserves of underground fresh water aquifers.

However the discoveries so far are mostly high salinity aquifers.

If we can only farm around 100k hectare with our available water then it's time we start thinking of other ways we can secure a reliable food supply for a working population.

With food you can print money, dig up resources and build infrastructure.

Without it you're stuck with being forced to spend other countries currencies to buy their excess food.

In regards to the quote above:

Our neighbours benefit from a chaotic Somalia because we've always been a threat to their sovereignty.

If Ethiopia loses the Galbeed; other regions would leave soon after; which would mean the end of the Ethiopian dream.

They don't care about the oil & gas if there's any... they are more worried about the domino effect it may cause with the other non Habesha.

Kenya is hard to figure out but I'm sure the Brits have something to do with their policy on Somalia.

The west sees the Gulf of Aden as an important strategic place to control militarily.

We still live in the age of naval dominance over other theatres of war.

They know that Somalis are too headstrong, overly ambitious or just too retarded to control.

Hence they gave up and would rather work with multiple weaker warlords instead.

I wouldn't trust the Turks either but at this point our credit is so bad that anyone willing to sign a Faustian deal with us is our saviour.

 

[La Xawla]

This thread was too short

 

[Deng Xiaobling]

This thread was too short

I will make more development posts in the future!

 

[Twwin]

why don't we somalispotters create one common party/xiisbi and someone who we all trust e.g @Bohol makes a gofundme for this party and we all save up money. And our goal should be to spread this xiisbi to Somalia, and try to take power some day.

maybe a stupid idea but hey its worth a try?

 

[Yaquub]

why don't we somalispotters create one common party/xiisbi and someone who we all trust e.g @Bohol makes a gofundme for this party and we all save up money. And our goal should be to spread this xiisbi to Somalia, and try to take power some day.

maybe a stupid idea but hey its worth a try?

I wouldn't mind donating to like a patreon but it would have to be to someone with a reputable background in the somali community and preferably someone who is trusted back home by the local ppl. However despite there being 14 million somalis we are a very distrustful ppl and no one will donate.

Your best bet is to support my youtube channel so i can chip in when i get paid ad revenue.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0fBf62YEICaYdSx3AQ9adA?view_as=subscriber

 

[Deng Xiaobling]

why don't we somalispotters create one common party/xiisbi and someone who we all trust e.g @Bohol makes a gofundme for this party and we all save up money. And our goal should be to spread this xiisbi to Somalia, and try to take power some day.

maybe a stupid idea but hey its worth a try?

This is actually a good idea but I would only use SS to spread the word in the diaspora. Recreating something like the Somali Youth League would be great.

 

[DR OSMAN]

This is actually a good idea but I would only use SS to spread the word in the diaspora. Recreating something like the Somali Youth League would be great.

You do realize the SYL idea came from yasin ali sharmarke? you know who he was? he was the grand kids of keenadiid, why is it you support his politics but reject his grandfather hobyo empire who was essentially trying to do the same thing by ending the 'sultanate' of majertenia and creating his own sultanate in hobyo based on 'somalinimo' not tribe or lineage?

 

[Deng Xiaobling]

You do realize the SYL idea came from yasin ali sharmarke? you know who he was? he was the grand kids of keenadiid, why is it you support his politics but reject his grandfather hobyo empire who was essentially trying to do the same thing by ending the 'sultanate' of majertenia and creating his own sultanate in hobyo based on 'somalinimo' not tribe or lineage?

I don't know what you're talking about, where did I mention the Hobyo empire? Either way, he sounds good as you described him but I'm not an expert on Somali history.

 

[DR OSMAN]

I don't know what you're talking about, where did I mention the Hobyo empire? Either way, he sounds good as you described him but I'm not an expert on Somali history.

Yasin Ali Sharmarke was the guy who created SYL? Do you understand this point? Now lets flow to the second point. Yasin Ali Sharmarke is keenadiid grand child. Do you understand that point? SYL platform is Somalinimo and ANTI tribe? Do you understand this point? Keenadid ran away from Majertenia sultanate and went to hobyo, do you understand this point? Keenadid came to HOBYO to create an empire based on 'multi clan' hawiye and darods. His administration stretched from Hobyo to all mudug and galgaduud. It consisted of Darod and Hawiye, hence he united them on 'Somalinimo' not tribe, do u get it now?

He was establishing Somalinimo not out 'love' for Somalinimo, but because he wanted to be a sultan and have power and he couldn't do in proper majertenia because boqor osman was there so he told him to get fucked, ill create an empire that will supercedes yours by fooling the hawiye and darod on somalinimo. Then his sons and grand children basically converted that empire into SYL, the politics of SYL originates from Keenadiid is the point.

Which point didn't u understand or were you trying not to understand it due to the implications it would lead too?

 

[DR OSMAN]

I don't know what you're talking about, where did I mention the Hobyo empire? Either way, he sounds good as you described him but I'm not an expert on Somali history.

I am very smart and know when I smell bullshit. I know what Keenadid was up too niyahow and I know what the SYL agenda truly was and it was not somali interest but was to establish keenadid as the father of somalinimo and the new father of the nation and his children being the founders of the new PAN SOMALISM all because he hated king osman in majertenia, noticed how he was arrested in mogadishu boqor osman but keenadid wasn't. Boqor Osman was the true ROYALTY, Keenadid and his GRANDKIDS WHO FOUND SYL was just a run-away scum in reality.

But you mudug-galgadud folks take the shit from bari and turn it into 'dahab' and base all your somalinimo crap up untill today from some guy who was thrown out from 'bari'. U then expanded SYL to the south and till today we are still suffering from the Keenadid effect from Hobyo.