Jamaacatul DNA two Somalis took the Full Y-DNA for Haplogroup T

[Prince Abubu]

You mean the Zagwe dynasty? That was an Agew kingdom pretty much the same as the Habesha kingdoms that proceeded and succeeded it.

 

[James Dahl]

No this was long before the Zagwe dynasty. Keep in mind this is all legendary.

In ancient Ethiopia the country was ruled by an evil tyrant called Arwe (Serpent). Legend has made this into a giant snake monster but yeah, interpret that how you will. Arwe was defeated by Za Baesi Angabo (Angabo is a title, not a name) who was the father of Za Gedur, who is probably GDR (old Ge'ez has no vowels so inscriptions are guesswork as to pronunciation). Gedur is recorded in Yemeni inscriptions as a king of Aksum who conquered Najran and parts of the Tihama. This means he is the same guy as the unnamed king who erected the Monumentum Adulitanum and the conqueror and architect of the Aksumite Empire.

The traditional lists off Gedur's successors 'ZBH (written Za Sebass Besedo in the lists but probably Azebah) and Azebah's son Qawasya. Qawasya is succeeded by his daughter Makeda.

Makeda's son is Minyelek or Ebna Hakim, supposedly the son of Solomon but since this happened in the 3rd century AD this is clearly inaccurate. The genealogies and legendary histories trying to shoehorn in this legendary descent from Solomon screw up all the genealogies and histories to the point where nothing prior to Ezana makes any sense at all.

Anyways circling back, the fathers of Aksum is "Malakya Aksum" literally King of Aksum, the genealogy of the fathers of Aksum goes Malakya Aksum, Aksumawi, Ityoppis, Kush, Ham. Malakya Aksum is "the King of Aksum", the founder of Aksum. This genealogy is completely mythical but notice the genealogy.

Anyways in actuality the historical genealogies have been so warped by various attempts to rationalize them (there were probably several different dynasties) and trace them to King Solomon that they are completely incomprehensible.

 

[Sosomalis]

@James Dahl

Here you can see the book:

Here is the Gadabuursi Dir lineage, however as you can see from Irir ending to Abu Talib there was a process of arabization. The book is a very old book in the Somali languagez written by Sheekh Cabdiraxman Sheekh Nuur. The founder of the Gadabuursi/Borama Script. The introduction mentions some very interesting history of how the Gadabuursi clan ancestor fought against Oromos and Afars. You can read right here that it was the Afars who kicked the Gadabuursi clan ancestor to the East. Read the whole page, if you know Somali.

Page 2 of the book

You can clearly see on Abtirsiintiisa of the Gadabuursi:


Madaluug
Abibakar (Dir)
Cabdiraxman (Irir)
Ismaaciil (Aji)
Cusmaan (Soomali)
Jibriil (Waarid)
Xassan (Lugaam)
Xuseen (Dalmar)
Harruun (Kamaal)
Ismaaciil (Kooshin/Kush)
Ridwaan
Nuux (Noah)
Axmad
Cuqayl
Abu Talib




However most of the Gadabuursi genealogists absolutely reject this Arabization abtirsi made from Irir to Abu Talib by the Sufi Shaykhs.

This is the official abtirsi:

 

[Sosomalis]

@James Dahl

What do you think? What is your assumption about Irir Samaale, the great ancestor?

 

[James Dahl]

I don't think there was an Irir Samaale, Irir or Erer is a river valley flowing out from the Ahmar (or Charchar) mountains south from Harar down into the plains below. This is probably the homeland of both Hawiye and Dir, who spread out from here in all directions. In ancient antiquity there was probably a federation of different clans and tribes from the Erer valley who gathered together under the banner of Irir.

Samaale is an occupational name, those who milk, or those who have wealth from cattle, probably a very ancient name, and a common type of name for different tribes who fill different niches.

At a certain point every genealogy goes from names of individuals to names that are not individuals but tribes and federations, this is not unique to Somali but to every people on earth. They either go to a tribe name, or a god, or both.

 

[Xaagi-Cagmadigtee]

Why are we asking our history for an explanation from a foreigner .

 

[World]

You can read right here that it was the Afars who kicked the Gadabuursi clan ancestor to the East. Read the whole page, if you know Somali.

Gadabuursi are probably the second most westernmost Somali clan after the Ciise, so how west are we talking?

 

[Xaagi-Cagmadigtee]

I think she is talking about during Adal period, when Afar reached as far east as Berbera? I am not sure​

Ise has no love lost for Afars and Oromos. Oromos used to mutilate the bodies of dead warriors by cutting their genitals off. Hence the name cadhgo is synonymous with Oromos and Afars.


@Sosomalis is a militant gal. I don't wanna be on her crosshairs .

 

[World]

I think she is talking about during Adal period, when Afar reached as far east as Berbera? I am not sure​

Ise has no love lost for Afars and Oromos. Oromos used to mutilate the bodies of dead warriors by cutting their genitals off. Hence the name cadhgo is synonymous with Oromos and Afars.


@Sosomalis is a militant gal. I don't wanna be on her crosshairs .

Afars have never reached as far east as Berbera. They've pretty much always lived in Eritrea/half of Djibouti. Furthermore, only the Ciise border them.

 

[Xaagi-Cagmadigtee]

Afars have never reached as far east as Berbera. They've pretty much always lived in Eritrea/half of Djibouti. Furthermore, only the Ciise border them.

There are so many misleading maps out there. I know for a fact that Isa is the westernmost and northernmost clan. The only Somali clan Isa borders is Gadabursi to the east and southeast.

 

[World]

There are so many misleading maps out there. I know for a fact that Isa is the westernmost and northernmost clan. The only Somali clan Isa borders is Gadabursi to the east and southeast.

Nah I'm pretty sure the Ciise also border Darood clans, not sure which ones tho.

 

[Xaagi-Cagmadigtee]

Nah I'm pretty sure the Ciise also border Darood clans, not sure which ones tho.

I am Ciise. I have been to the area. I know what I am talking about. We border Afars to the north, Oromos to the west and south, and Gadabursi to the east, at least in Ethiopia.

If you are talking about Abaskul, Jidwaq/Bartire they live in Fafan Zone. We live in Sitti Zone and Dire Dhabe and to some extent East Hararghe Zone and Harar. But our main populace is in Sitti and Dire Dhabe.

 

[World]

I am Ciise. I have been to the area. I know what I am talking about. We border Afars to the north, Oromos to the west and south, and Gadabursi to the east, at least in Ethiopia.

If you are talking about Abaskul, Jidwaq/Bartire they live in Fafan Zone. We live in Sitti Zone and Dire Dhabe and to some extent East Hararghe Zone and Harar. But our main populace is in Sitti and Dire Dhabe.

Oh alright and what about the gurgura?

 

[Xaagi-Cagmadigtee]

Oh alright and what about the gurgura?

Gurgura, which I forgot to mention, live in Dire Dhabe with us and also have their own district outside the city. They are bilingual and, unfortunately, have been Oromized quite a bit. They, however, are regaining their Somali roots. Their intellectuals, ugas, etc., are now reviving their identity as Dir, Somalis .

 

[Sosomalis]

Gadabuursi are probably the second most westernmost Somali clan after the Ciise, so how west are we talking?

If you read the page it says the Samaroon clan ancestor is buried in Sanaag Region which would mean that his descendants repopulated and returned back to the West. However that could be just a mythical story.

However, don't be surprised by the fact that the Afars were present in Awdal. It's very much a possibility. There was always a big Afar population in Zeila for example.

 

[Sosomalis]

Why are we asking our history for an explanation from a foreigner .

I was only intrigued by his comment on Kooshin being Kush. I thought he might have something else to say.

 

[Sosomalis]

Gurgura, which I forgot to mention, live in Dire Dhabe with us and also have their own district outside the city. They are bilingual and, unfortunately, have been Oromized quite a bit. They, however, are regaining their Somali roots. Their intellectuals, ugas, etc., are now reviving their identity as Dir, Somalis .

In Futuh Al Habasha, the Gurggura and the Barsuug are both counted as Somali clans.
The Patron Saint Aw Bube is also considered to have been Gurgura Madahweyne Dir and he is mentioned by name in Futuh Al Habasha

 

[Roba]

I just got my results from 23andme this week did some research and now im here on this funny thread and my haplogroup is TM70 which is far older than T1a or whatever comes after which many dir people have according to this thread. I am Oromo so my question is how is it that some oromos have this haplogroup but a much older version of it compared to the younger T1a?

 

[James Dahl]

I just got my results from 23andme this week did some research and now im here on this funny thread and my haplogroup is TM70 which is far older than T1a or whatever comes after which many dir people have according to this thread. I am Oromo so my question is how is it that some oromos have this haplogroup but a much older version of it compared to the younger T1a?

What is your clan if you don't mind me asking?

 

[Roba]

What is your clan if you don't mind me asking?

Borana