Madow guy giving UK Somalis some closure

[Burner123]

How come the Jamaicans in Canada are much cooler than the ones in the uk

Because we kill them in Canada they are scared of us

 

[Einar68]

Man I might have to make a long comment explaining all my specific issues regarding British somali relations with the with the wider black community without making it seem like I'm justifying the hate somali trolls from the UK throw at them

This is going to be a long post so if you want to skip then skip

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First, these are the formative years of a community that has no other reference point for anything. Racial identity is new to us, being "minorities" is new to us. Anything that takes place in this era sets the tone for the future, hence the importance of it

The Caribbean community in England existed earlier than everyone else for colonial reasons, they aren’t this “evil” group that terrorised the masses but human nature dictates that when other groups come into their already established community they’re gonna deal with hostility for being “different”. Unlike Canada (where similar immigrant groups exist) England (and other colonial European nations) have FAR more slanted migrant group diasporas which greatly exacerbate these differences. Nigerians and Ghanains dealt with it first, Somalis dealt with it later


Everything Somali was seen as negative growing up. Like every facet of our ethnic background was seen as negative, how we looked, our names, our faith, our food, the way we did this and that. Literally every facet of our ethnic existence was associated with negativity, it wasn't just some pirate jokes at all, do you know what that does to a group trying to establish an identity dealing with poverty and anti islamic rhetoric?

^ Very importantly this treatment wasn’t for being “black” or “african” or “muslim” like the treatment other somali diasporas had to deal with, specifically us as an ethnic group we were looked down upon, we had no one else like us to find solidarity with (as I mentioned unlike somewhere like Canada there aren’t many other black muslims, or other horn african/horn african adjacent looking people (regardless of religious background)). That creates a distinct environment relative to other diasporas. That isn’t to say in other countries Somalis don’t deal with this, but it’s usually in conjunction with a larger identity. The very specific harassment for just your ethnic group with no other ethnic groups remotely similar to us existing in our spaces is unique to reer england

One of the most important things that you guys don’t understand is that in our mockery we were actively "othered" from blackness, as opposed to other communities. The fact that Nigerian and Ghanian people dealt with the same stuff earlier than we did made this clear, they were mocked for being different (african) we were mocked for being different (separate to whatever “blackness” was). Notice how we’re also African but we aren’t in that bracket with them? That’s because we’re not the “same” as them, a rhetoric they drilled into the early england diaspora in some way or another whether by direct action or by implication. This laid down the groundwork for us to associate more with Islamic diasporas than with "black" ones, even today when there's no tension that formula still goes through.


Another HUGE factor is there was no reintegration attempt once the hate lessened, ESPECIALLY relative to the West African community. Across many different mediums from higher institutions to simple friend groups and shared culture I’ve witnessed the (non somali/horn african) black african community and black caribbean community become far closer since their migrations into the nation, more attempts to bridge gaps, acknowledge problems and move forward, by no means am I saying they no longer have problems with each other, however none of this happened for somalis. Once the novelty of openly mocking us stopped we just continued with life, people fucked with us now, but we definitely weren’t “one of them” (in terms of blackness) if that makes sense.

^ A good counter example to use against this is the UK Islamic community, South Asian Muslims were also racist but took time to attempt to unite British Muslim ummah for the sake of islam and acknowledged these problems. None of this means anti-blackness and xenophobia no longer exists in these south asian communities, none of this means somalis are suddenly open to south asians either (we have our own xenophobia problem) but the issue was acknowledged and efforts were made to fix them. That doesn’t exist between us and other black people in this country, in fact like @Ashraf said, this is literally the first non horn african black guy I’ve ever seen acknowledge this shit even existing.

And finally the lies, you know how I said these guys don’t acknowledge the shit that we received? Truth is they actively go out of their way to pretend it wasn’t even a thing, or that it was a couple of jokes. I have no issue with moving on from the past, but when I watch them write dissertations on how hard being “african” or being “dark skinned” was, it shows they know what happened to minority communities back in the day, and they also know the deeper and wider effects it has beyond just the initial mockery. They simply lie.

And do you know when I realised all of this? When the Somali incel/troll community exploded in prominence and all of these people who knew nothing about us, our culture, put no effort into integrating with us and actively told us the shit we dealt with up to this point was all made up and in our heads suddenly became experts on us. Specifically learning all of the xenophobia within our community to justify all the hate that they’ve wanted to spew at us, where was this proactive effort to learn about us before? Now all of a sudden the division in the black community that they told us we made up is actually all real, and it’s actually caused by the xenophobic and Anti-black Somalis all along. Comical I tell you

 

[Einar68]

All this being said, it is undeniable that most of the shit we dealt with died down by like 2016 and anyone trying to pretend like it was still continuing past that stage is a liar, in real life all communities are quite cool and there's much more diversity all around in England.

My only issue is how after this period of time when the BS was lessening there was no attempt to Integrate us into the community like they did with other groups that dealt with this, and they had the audacity to pretend that we were the ones that caused problems to begin with

 

[Heartbreakkid]

Somalis live in states with low black populations

Not true. Ohio does not have low black population. The DMV does not have low black population. Toronto (which is in NA) has a large Caribbean/African population.

 

[Abaq]

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

 

[Abaq]

This is going to be a long post so if you want to skip then skip

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First, these are the formative years of a community that has no other reference point for anything. Racial identity is new to us, being "minorities" is new to us. Anything that takes place in this era sets the tone for the future, hence the importance of it

The Caribbean community in England existed earlier than everyone else for colonial reasons, they aren’t this “evil” group that terrorised the masses but human nature dictates that when other groups come into their already established community they’re gonna deal with hostility for being “different”. Unlike Canada (where similar immigrant groups exist) England (and other colonial European nations) have FAR more slanted migrant group diasporas which greatly exacerbate these differences. Nigerians and Ghanains dealt with it first, Somalis dealt with it later


Everything Somali was seen as negative growing up. Like every facet of our ethnic background was seen as negative, how we looked, our names, our faith, our food, the way we did this and that. Literally every facet of our ethnic existence was associated with negativity, it wasn't just some pirate jokes at all, do you know what that does to a group trying to establish an identity dealing with poverty and anti islamic rhetoric?

^ Very importantly this treatment wasn’t for being “black” or “african” or “muslim” like the treatment other somali diasporas had to deal with, specifically us as an ethnic group we were looked down upon, we had no one else like us to find solidarity with (as I mentioned unlike somewhere like Canada there aren’t many other black muslims, or other horn african/horn african adjacent looking people (regardless of religious background)). That creates a distinct environment relative to other diasporas. That isn’t to say in other countries Somalis don’t deal with this, but it’s usually in conjunction with a larger identity. The very specific harassment for just your ethnic group with no other ethnic groups remotely similar to us existing in our spaces is unique to reer england

One of the most important things that you guys don’t understand is that in our mockery we were actively "othered" from blackness, as opposed to other communities. The fact that Nigerian and Ghanian people dealt with the same stuff earlier than we did made this clear, they were mocked for being different (african) we were mocked for being different (separate to whatever “blackness” was). Notice how we’re also African but we aren’t in that bracket with them? That’s because we’re not the “same” as them, a rhetoric they drilled into the early england diaspora in some way or another whether by direct action or by implication. This laid down the groundwork for us to associate more with Islamic diasporas than with "black" ones, even today when there's no tension that formula still goes through.


Another HUGE factor is there was no reintegration attempt once the hate lessened, ESPECIALLY relative to the West African community. Across many different mediums from higher institutions to simple friend groups and shared culture I’ve witnessed the (non somali/horn african) black african community and black caribbean community become far closer since their migrations into the nation, more attempts to bridge gaps, acknowledge problems and move forward, by no means am I saying they no longer have problems with each other, however none of this happened for somalis. Once the novelty of openly mocking us stopped we just continued with life, people fucked with us now, but we definitely weren’t “one of them” (in terms of blackness) if that makes sense.

^ A good counter example to use against this is the UK Islamic community, South Asian Muslims were also racist but took time to attempt to unite British Muslim ummah for the sake of islam and acknowledged these problems. None of this means anti-blackness and xenophobia no longer exists in these south asian communities, none of this means somalis are suddenly open to south asians either (we have our own xenophobia problem) but the issue was acknowledged and efforts were made to fix them. That doesn’t exist between us and other black people in this country, in fact like @Ashraf said, this is literally the first non horn african black guy I’ve ever seen acknowledge this shit even existing.

And finally the lies, you know how I said these guys don’t acknowledge the shit that we received? Truth is they actively go out of their way to pretend it wasn’t even a thing, or that it was a couple of jokes. I have no issue with moving on from the past, but when I watch them write dissertations on how hard being “african” or being “dark skinned” was, it shows they know what happened to minority communities back in the day, and they also know the deeper and wider effects it has beyond just the initial mockery. They simply lie.

And do you know when I realised all of this? When the Somali incel/troll community exploded in prominence and all of these people who knew nothing about us, our culture, put no effort into integrating with us and actively told us the shit we dealt with up to this point was all made up and in our heads suddenly became experts on us. Specifically learning all of the xenophobia within our community to justify all the hate that they’ve wanted to spew at us, where was this proactive effort to learn about us before? Now all of a sudden the division in the black community that they told us we made up is actually all real, and it’s actually caused by the xenophobic and Anti-black Somalis all along. Comical I tell you

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

 

[Einar68]

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

 

[Abaq]

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

 

[bobby_hill-Punt]

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Im at awe with these post sxb. Im glad Reer Uk has people like you

 

[Taintedlove]

I’m not trying to dismiss importance of talking about this, I have no problem with people talking about the racism somalis have faced, I’m sorry if it came across that way, my issue is with how much we talk about it, for example in that other thread about the UK lady who had fgm done on her, she mentions fgm all time, she got mocked on twitter for it, is the guy who mocked her being dismissive of the seriousness of fgm? No he’s simply pointing out how tiring it is for her to mention it all the time.

To further substantiate my point, when I first joined Somali spot I would routinely engage in these type of discussions, because again I have no issue with this topic, I stopped doing it now because there’s a thread about this every two days!!!! not to mention some of the users here play so hard into the victim narrative and use it to justify their own racism towards madows, like other users have pointed out, it’s all so exhausting.


I’m 18 so I was a very young during those days, so I didn’t really experience xenophobia, but with my generation or days in secondary school, i would get somali jokes or stereotypes thrown around, , but it was just jokes and they did that to
eyeryone.

I agree that a lot of Somalis have used it as leverage to be racist against madows. And that's very bad and annoying. I have to disagree on the fgm one. Fgm is a very traumatic procedure. It effects all parts of your life so I don't have a problem if somali women talk about it often. It hurts a lot to even do basic things. Controversial, but I think if your a man you shouldn't speak on women's fgm beyond "it's bad and should be gone,".

 

[Taintedlove]

Not true. Ohio does not have low black population. The DMV does not have low black population. Toronto (which is in NA) has a large Caribbean/African population.

I was thinking Minnesota, maine, Massachusetts etc.

 

[Heartbreakkid]

I was thinking Minnesota, maine, Massachusetts etc.

Boston doesn’t have low black population either. Quite the opposite it has a large population of Black people. Search up Roxbury and Dorchester neighborhoods. They’re predominantly black neighborhoods. Many Somali folks who live in Boston live alongside them.

 

[Taintedlove]

Boston doesn’t have low black population either. Quite the opposite it has a large population of Black people. Search up Roxbury and Dorchester neighborhoods. They’re predominantly black neighborhoods. Many Somali folks who live in Boston live alongside them.

Damn I always thought they were veey white states