Puntland, Federalist or Quasi Secessionist, article

[CangeeroBear]

https://www.hiiraan.com/op4/2018/may/157948/puntland_federalist_or_quasi_secessionist.aspx

Great read.

Secessionist***

 

[Sleepy Hollow]

The article is a horrible read that does nothing but whine about federalism, Puntland and Abdullahi Yusuf (AUN). Surprisingly enough he makes the case for secession by saying Somalia was peaceful when it was under three separate administrations. Whoever the author is he is a disingenuous hack. I'm laughing at the thought of Puntland or Somaliland listening to a central government that doesn't run its own secret service (the Americans do) or Senate that refuses to function without AMISOM protection. I despise fake nationalists like this writer.

 

[CangeeroBear]

The article is a horrible read that does nothing but whine about federalism, Puntland and Abdullahi Yusuf (AUN). Surprisingly enough he makes the case for secession by saying Somalia was peaceful when it was under three separate administrations. Whoever the author is he is a disingenuous hack. I'm laughing at the thought of Puntland or Somaliland listening to a central government that doesn't run its own secret service (the Americans do) or Senate that refuses to function without AMISOM protection. I despise fake nationalists like this writer.

Interesting take on the subject.

 

[waraabe]

can you blame puntland for looking after her interest ? the admin in xamar has so far refused the turks to build anything outside mogadisho

 

[Cotton Eyed Joe]

This is the kind of opinion piece I used to read at the height of FKD a 13 year old Cotton Eyed Joe would eat his cookies and milk as he devoured the farce in front of him Oh Allah what good times. The result is what happens when a child soldier puts down the Ak47 and picks up a pen without elementary education.

 

[Cotton Eyed Joe]

There's a lot of inaccuracies, anecdotal evidence and outright lies.

He claims Puntland is the only state that "bases it's jurisdiction on clan borders". He is wrong and should ask himself why "Galmudug/Central State" only claims half of Mudug or why Gedo is part of Jubbaland as opposed to Bakool.

He claims Puntland follows Somaliland's lead every step which proves it's quasi-secessionist. The adoption of a flag, constitution, foreign investment and future multi-party elections are his evidence so he completely disregards his first point that secession was Somaliland's first decision. What Puntland has adopted is the basic framework for a state and identity.

He claims the Bosaso deal is unconstitutional but it still stands and operates. The FGS has come out against DP World's Berbera port deal but not once against Bosaso.

He claims Somalia was peaceful until the Ethiopians that there was no suicide bombings or terrorism. The first suicide bombing in Somali history happened in September 2006 not after December when Ethiopia came and it was targeting Abdullahi Yusuf in Baidoa. Somalia was far from peaceful it was in a civil war this time religious as well as clan.

https://horseedmedia.net/2018/03/02...rbera-ay-ku-qaybsadeen-itoobiya-iyo-dp-world/

 

[Cotton Eyed Joe]

It's the conclusion that caught my eye. How do you draw comparison between the Bosaso port, Abdiweli and go all the way back to 2006, Abdullahi Yusuf, Ethiopia and federalism. I want reer Puntland to not fail to grasp the irony of their faux nationalism, don't let it escape you what the heart of it is such people like @Inquisitive_ and @CangeeroBear can't masquerade no more you have to see the core of the issue.

 

[Futurist]

There's a lot of inaccuracies, anecdotal evidence and outright lies.

He claims Puntland is the only state that "bases it's jurisdiction on clan borders". He is wrong and should ask himself why "Galmudug/Central State" only claims half of Mudug or why Gedo is part of Jubbaland as opposed to Bakool.

He claims Puntland follows Somaliland's lead every step which proves it's quasi-secessionist. The adoption of a flag, constitution, foreign investment and future multi-party elections are his evidence so he completely disregards his first point that secession was Somaliland's first decision. What Puntland has adopted is the basic framework for a state and identity.

He claims the Bosaso deal is unconstitutional but it still stands and operates. The FGS has come out against DP World's Berbera port deal but not once against Bosaso.

He claims Somalia was peaceful until the Ethiopians that there was no suicide bombings or terrorism. The first suicide bombing in Somali history happened in September 2006 not after December when Ethiopia came and it was targeting Abdullahi Yusuf in Baidoa. Somalia was far from peaceful it was in a civil war this time religious as well as clan.

https://horseedmedia.net/2018/03/02...rbera-ay-ku-qaybsadeen-itoobiya-iyo-dp-world/

He is right though. In 15 or 20 years Puntlanders will start identifying as Puntlanders more than Somalia

With every year that passess their sense of identity and nationhood as Puntlanders increases.

I wonder what their nationality will be. Punties maybe

 

[Cotton Eyed Joe]

He is right though. In 15 or 20 years Puntlanders will start identifying as Puntlanders more than Somalia

With every year that passess their sense of identity and nationhood as Puntlanders increases.

I wonder what their nationality will be. Punties maybe

You are right with every year the sense of identity increases but how do you conclude that leads to secession? A flag, constitution and elections are the basic framework for any state whether they are sovereign or not.

 

[Abdalla]

This is indeed elementary fkd read. It was incoherent gibberish and he was all over the place. The Puntland constitution actually bans secessionism. The PL constitution us actually very simple on this: PL will act as an independent administration until SFG comes up with a nationwide constitution. Until then PL will sign their own bilateral contracts.

Article 3:
Pending the completion of the Federal Constitution approved by a popular referendum, Puntland State shall have the status of an independent State.

So far no completion of a federal constitution. You can accuse PL of being unreasonable, if there was a federal constitution and PL violated some laws. But there's simply no constitution to violate.

 

[Hassan Garguute Buldanana]

Nonsense that doesn't deserve a reply

2018 and they still ing about federalism

 

[CangeeroBear]

It's the conclusion that caught my eye. How do you draw comparison between the Bosaso port, Abdiweli and go all the way back to 2006, Abdullahi Yusuf, Ethiopia and federalism. I want reer Puntland to not fail to grasp the irony of their faux nationalism, don't let it escape you what the heart of it is such people like @Inquisitive_ and @CangeeroBear can't masquerade no more you have to see the core of the issue.

I don't support puntland out of principle , nor do I support a federalised nation , to this extent, at all.In a proper federal nation the constituents shouldn't have the same power as the federal government , the latter always trumps the former in certain affairs.

 

[Sleepy Hollow]

I don't support puntland out of principle , nor do I support a federalised nation , to this extent, at all.In a proper federal nation the constituents shouldn't have the same power as the federal government , the latter always trumps the former in certain affairs.

Why don't you support a government that managed to bring peace and prosperity to the North East region of Somalia during the civil war? Puntland was a bedrock of stability that managed to prevent a famine while taking in refugees fleeing the South. 250k people died due to famine in the fertile South while the NorthEast took in a swell of fleeing people into drylands and avoided famine. Puntland managed to do much good in Somalia while being a bottom-up process, a series of clan elders keeping peace till Abdullahi Yusuf (AUN) created local councils that spearheaded reconciliation between clans (those who supported Siad vs those against him) till SSDF formed the government of Puntland when the South failed to stabilize. Puntland has been a massive force for good and has brought real development to the region, trying to abolish it will only polarize the people.

 

[waraabe]

puntland region of Somalia simply wants to be like Somaliland, their former president even begged to join Somaliland but was refused every time

https://horseedmedia.net/2013/02/01...oo-aan-heshiino-laga-yaabee-inaan-isla-goano/

however, puntland depends on mogadisho for its budget so cant even afford to entertain the idea of leaving somalia. in addition, the puntlanders also want to eat their cake (receive mogadhiso taxes, while refusing to pay any tax to the fed gov of somalia)

 

[Cotton Eyed Joe]

I don't support puntland out of principle , nor do I support a federalised nation , to this extent, at all.In a proper federal nation the constituents shouldn't have the same power as the federal government , the latter always trumps the former in certain affairs.

The article attempts to link Somalia's failures with federalism and Puntland. How do you justify that? What exactly would change if Puntland ceases to exist and how does the port deals affect Somalia's problems?

 

[CangeeroBear]

The article attempts to link Somalia's failures with federalism and Puntland. How do you justify that? What exactly would change if Puntland ceases to exist and how does the port deals affect Somalia's problems?

The actual pathway in which Somalia becomes recentralised will be long and tedious however we should push to becoming fully centralised.

 

[Cotton Eyed Joe]

The actual pathway in which Somalia becomes recentralised will be long and tedious however we should push to becoming fully centralised.

Is that an answer to one of my questions or a general statement?

 

[CangeeroBear]

Is that an answer to one of my questions or a general statement?

Its a general statement , as for your specific questions.Its not the port itself that has any real effect on Somalia nor does the Berbera port itself.It is the fact that Puntland enters foreign deals that are independent of FGS caution. The centralization of the tribal states in somalia decentralizes the nation and simply lessens any geopolitical strength the FGS has.When AbdiWeli Gaas went to the Dubai , without a care for the geopolitical impact ,he was working to the benefit of Puntland and his pockets not Somalia.Hence a divide grows between somalis, reer puntland will see the FGS as a detriment to Puntland.

Many people forget that Puntland itself was made to safe guard Harti from the massacres that were inflicted on us after '91.The lack of the trust holds merit hence why we need to gradually move to centralized nation which safeguards all clan interests.

Naturally there needs to be a compromise , this should be discussed by democratically elected heads of each region.

 

[Cotton Eyed Joe]

Its a general statement , as for your specific questions.Its not the port itself that has any real effect on Somalia nor does the Berbera port itself.It is the fact that Puntland enters foreign deals that are independent of FGS caution. The centralization of the tribal states in somalia decentralizes the nation and simply lessens any geopolitical strength the FGS has.When AbdiWeli Gaas went to the Dubai , without a care for the geopolitical impact ,he was working to the benefit of Puntland and his pockets not Somalia.Hence a divide grows between somalis, reer puntland will see the FGS as a detriment to Puntland.

Many people forget that Puntland itself was made to safe guard Harti from the massacres that were inflicted on us after '91.The lack of the trust holds merit hence why we need to gradually move to centralized nation which safeguards all clan interests.

Naturally there needs to be a compromise , this should be discussed by democratically elected heads of each region.

So there's a lack of trust and your idea is a centralized government? I hope you understand that Somalia once had that. But lets say for argument sake Puntland and federalism cease to exist tomorrow. What will the result be in Somalia?

 

[CangeeroBear]

So there's a lack of trust and your idea is a centralized government? I hope you understand that Somalia once had that. But lets say for argument sake Puntland and federalism cease to exist tomorrow. What will the result be in Somalia?

Siad Barre era was a centralised Auocratic nation.

I'm stating we should push for a centralised DEMOCRATIC nation.These processes take time but we should plan them today.If we don't do that Somalia will continue to further fragment.

Puntland itself is an attestament to the idea of centralisation.

Let me ask you a question, what do you think the power ration between the federal states and the FGS be eventually?