Snacks Updated DNA results

[Stark]

If it is confirmed to be of Arabian orgin as the evidence suggests, then it is a Semitic lineage as we share distant ancestry with Ashkenazi Jews. This lineage was probably part of ancient migration to the Levant/Northern Iraq like most Arabian T lineages and gradually spread through the Arabian peninsula.

It is illogical to argue that it could not be Semitic within the last few thousand years considering the ancient presence of haplogroup T in the Middle East.

Stating the T population is not of "Semitic" origin but as probable took a route via the Arabian peninsula to the Horn of Africa. As T is a minority lineage in the middle east it can't be certain that it came from there, there would be evidence for this as practically didn't inhabit all of the Arabian peninsula just a population that was in this case nomadic. Plus, the Ashkenazim barely have any T lineage at best it's a meager 3% as studies show.

 

[Apollo]

Stating the T population is not of "Semitic" origin but as probable took a route via the Arabian peninsula to the Horn of Africa. As T is a minority lineage in the middle east it can't be certain that it came from there, there would be evidence for this as practically didn't inhabit all of the Arabian peninsula just a population that was in this case nomadic. Plus, the Ashkenazim barely have any T lineage at best it's a meager 3% as studies show.

Ashkenazi Jews are a bottlenecked/founder effected group, not really the best example. T is found in nearly all Jewish populations. So it has been around in Semites for quite a long time. Nevertheless, I think its late Paleolithic / early Neolithic roots are with hunter-gatherers from around Southeast Anatolia/Northern Iraq/Western Iran.

 

[anonimo]

Stating the T population is not of "Semitic" origin but as probable took a route via the Arabian peninsula to the Horn of Africa. As T is a minority lineage in the middle east it can't be certain that it came from there, there would be evidence for this as practically didn't inhabit all of the Arabian peninsula just a population that was in this case nomadic. Plus, the Ashkenazim barely have any T lineage at best it's a meager 3% as studies show.

Who argued that the entire haplogroup T originated among Semites?

I argued that some T lineages, probably including the 'Dir' one, has its roots in Semitic Middle East going by the different subclades of Y16897.

T is not prominent among most Semites apart from some Eastern Gulf Arabs, Mizrahi/Kurdish Jews, Assyrians and Northern Iraqi Arabs. Nonetheless, it's overall percentage in the Middle East has no relation with the fact that it entered the Semitic gene pool millennia ago. If it ain't Semitic, neither is Haplogroup J as it precedes it in the Middle East as things stand. T's ancient presence in the Middle is attested to by the T samples found in the Pek'iin Cave ancient burial ground.

Ancient DNA from Chalcolithic Israel reveals the role of population mixture in cultural transformation - Nature Communications

The Late Chalcolithic material culture in the southern Levant has unique attributes that suggest spread of people or culture. Here, the authors use genome-wide ancient DNA data from 22 individuals from a Chalcolithic site and show evidence of complex population movements and turnovers.

www.nature.com

No one asserted that all Haplogroup T subclades are Semitic. Heck very ancient T samples are found as far away as Germany demonstrating that it is a widespread Haplogroup that spans the diverse ethno-linguistic labels we have today.

The Ashkenazi Y16897 samples highlight our origins probably stem from an ancient Semitic population in the Levant. For one reason or the other, the Y16897 lineage spread South into Arabia proper and then the Horn eventually.

 

[greyhound stone]

What difference does it make?

Are we Arab today?

They'll still call us 'Abeed' as our paternal lineage is not stapled to our prominent foreheads.

Abeed sxb my forefathers were elite nomads

 

[Apollo]

Learn the ancient culture of your ancient ancestors @anonimo and @Snacks

Joking.

 

[Stark]

Who argued that the entire haplogroup T originated among Semites?

I argued that some T lineages, probably including the 'Dir' one, has its roots in Semitic Middle East going by the different subclades of Y16897.

T is not prominent among most Semites apart from some Eastern Gulf Arabs, Mizrahi/Kurdish Jews, Assyrians and Northern Iraqi Arabs. Nonetheless, it's overall percentage in the Middle East has no relation with the fact that it entered the Semitic gene pool millennia ago. If it ain't Semitic, neither is Haplogroup J as it precedes it in the Middle East as things stand. T's ancient presence in the Middle is attested to by the T samples found in the Pek'iin Cave ancient burial ground.

Ancient DNA from Chalcolithic Israel reveals the role of population mixture in cultural transformation - Nature Communications

The Late Chalcolithic material culture in the southern Levant has unique attributes that suggest spread of people or culture. Here, the authors use genome-wide ancient DNA data from 22 individuals from a Chalcolithic site and show evidence of complex population movements and turnovers.

www.nature.com

No one asserted that all Haplogroup T subclades are Semitic. Heck very ancient T samples are found as far away as Germany demonstrating that it is a widespread Haplogroup that spans the diverse ethno-linguistic labels we have today.

The Ashkenazi Y16897 samples highlight our origins probably stem from an ancient Semitic population in the Levant. For one reason or the other, the Y16897 lineage spread South into Arabia proper and then the Horn eventually.

Whatever, you're still an ....

 

[greyhound stone]

Whatever, you're still an ....

When we're somalis ever slaves??

 

[Apollo]

Whatever, you're still an ....

What's with the hostility? anonimo is not an Arab booty clapper. He is just interested in tracing where the Somali T lineage came from. No need for the hostility.

In the past many Suugo Scientist Somalis thought it was just one of the many proto-Cushitic lineages that entered the Cushitic genepool somewhere in Egypt-North Sudan (as they have some T there). Only recent findings in the past few years showed us that Southwest Arabia is the more likely source for the Somali version of T.

 

[4head]

Learn the ancient culture of your ancient ancestors @anonimo and @Snacks

Joking.

Gilgamesh,
my ancestor

 

[Mujahid Nur Marehan]

The mitochondria and Y-Chromosome get passed down to the next generation nearly unchanged. The female (mother) passes the mitochondria and male (father) the Y. They don't mix with each other. Only a few mutations happen every couple of generations that researchers then use to track ancient migrations.

How the Y is passed down resembles the Somali tribal system. Hence, the interest many Somalis have in this one in particular. On the MT it is the female equivalent of the Somali tribal system, but since Somalis have no records of their female line this is usually less interesting.

Who are the closest related haplogroup T carrying ethnic groups in Africa to Somalis? If And when did Somalis and then diverge?

 

[4head]

Abeed sxb my forefathers were elite nomads

Elite Lamagoodles

 

[Gacanka Cadmeed]

Elite Lamagoodles

The power of انا عربي

 

[Apollo]

Who are the closest related haplogroup T carrying ethnic groups in Africa to Somalis? If And when did Somalis and then diverge?

The one Somalis have probably has no long history in Africa. It likely entered Africa via Djibouti around 3 to 2.5 K years ago.

This explains many things:

A) Why Djibouti has suspicious high frequency of this.
B) In Somaliweyn it is generally highest towards the Northwest.

It is surpising that this lineage became so succesful in Somalis as autosomally Somalis are ironically one of the least South Semitic groups in the Horn. Yet Djiboutians have the most South Semitic paternal origins in the Horn, way more than Habeshas.

 

[Gacanka Cadmeed]

The one Somalis have probably has no long history in Africa. It likely entered Africa via Djibouti around 3 to 2.5 K years ago.

This explains many things:

A) Why Djibouti has suspicious high frequency of this.
B) In Somaliweyn it is generally highest towards the Northwest.

It is surpising that this lineage became so succesful in Somalis as autosomally Somalis are ironically one of the least South Semitic groups in the Horn. Yet Djiboutians have the most South Semitic paternal origins in the Horn, way more than Habeshas.

I think those Djiboutians are the afar because they have a lot of J1

 

[4head]

The one Somalis have probably has no long history in Africa. It likely entered Africa via Djibouti around 3 to 2.5 K years ago.

This explains many things:

A) Why Djibouti has suspicious high frequency of this.
B) In Somaliweyn it is generally highest towards the Northwest.

It is surpising that this lineage became so succesful in Somalis as autosomally Somalis are ironically one of the least South Semitic groups in the Horn. Yet Djiboutians have the most South Semitic paternal origins in the Horn, way more than Habeshas.

Yemenis and Horners, longest love story in the world.

 

[Apollo]

I think those Djiboutians are the afar because they have a lot of J1

Afars are like Somalis, they have different frequencies per sub-clan/region. Some have high E-V6 (think the ones Ethiopia) and others high J1. It depends on the location. The Afars in Djibouti have high T1 while the Ethiopian Afar don't (or not as much).

 

[Gacanka Cadmeed]

Afars are like Somalis, they have different frequencies per sub-clan/region. Some have high E-V6 (think the ones Ethiopia) and others high J1. It depends on the location. The Afars in Djibouti have high T1 while the Ethiopian Afar don't (or not as much).

So the Eritrean afars have the most semitic blood

 

[Apollo]

So the Eritrean afars have the most semitic blood

Paternal frequencies are not the best measure of who is the most Semitic in the Horn.

Autosomal is.

Autosomally, Tigres in Eritrea are the most West Eurasian/Semitic, then Tigray-Tigrinyas, then North Amharas and the Agaw & small Cushitic laangaabs who surround them. Afars are autosomally not the most.

 

[Mujahid Nur Marehan]

Paternal frequencies are not the best measure of who is the most Semitic in the Horn.

Autosomal is.

Autosomally, Tigres in Eritrea are the most West Eurasian/Semitic, then Tigray-Tigrinyas, then North Amharas and the Agaw & small Cushitic laangaabs who surround them. Afars are autosomally not the most.

Could the Harla people have been haplogroup T carrying Somalis?

 

[Apollo]

Could the Harla people have been haplogroup T carrying Somalis?

Djibouti is the likely source how it got into Somalis. Unlikely that Harar is it.