The fast development of Ethiopia

World

VIP
You can't build factories in Somalia even there was total peace due to the cost of Energy.

Somalia has the highest cost anywhere in the world its around $1 per KWh, Uganda in comparison is $0.123 per kWh FOR BUSINESS

We still use diesel generators, we never had a national power grid, nor did we ever have the money or will to build this.


CountryAverage Electricity Cost (USD per kWh)
Cabo Verde0.31
Kenya0.22
Mali0.22
Burkina Faso0.21
Togo0.20
Uganda0.19
Benin0.17
Rwanda0.17
Senegal0.17
Ghana0.16
Namibia0.15
South Africa0.14
Zimbabwe0.14
Angola0.13
Somalia0.50–1.25
Nigeria0.06
Egypt0.05
Algeria0.04
Sudan0.04
Libya0.004
Ethiopia0.01
Solar/wind power is a meme. It doesn't provide enough energy and can be wildely inconsistent due to how it works. There is a reason why conventional energy sources like hydropower and fossil fuels are used the most. Somalia needs to construct dams and establish oil rigs to make it happen. High energy costs are simply due to lack of infastructure and poor regulation from the government, it can easily be solved when Somalia becomes stable and the government starts enacting energy policies.

Solar and wind can still be used to power homes and such but it cannot sustain entire industries.

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Solar energy is the future for Somalia. Combined with the rapid drop of LFP batteries in China:

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Solar/wind power is a meme. It doesn't provide enough energy and can be wildely inconsistent due to how it works. There is a reason why conventional energy sources like hydropower and fossil fuels are used the most. Somalia needs to construct dams and establish oil rigs to make it happen. High energy costs are simply due to lack of infastructure and poor regulation from the government, it can easily be solved when Somalia becomes stable and the government starts enacting energy policies.

Solar and wind can still be used to power homes and such but it cannot sustain entire industries.
I was still in the process of editing my post after crunching the numbers and saw your post afterwards, you are right, I wouldn't go as far as to call it a meme, but there is no precedence for this anywhere.

Hydropower doesn't make sense as both those rivers due to Ethiopia dam's, we have significant reduced flow and as for Shabelle it's very inconsistent flows, infrastructure cost are humongous while population density is very low relative to the big cities.

Its Oil or Gas or we are bust, we don't even have alternative like Coal, no proven reserves, South Africa 80% of their energy is coal.

The more I look at this and crunch the numbers, the more the conclusion becomes Hydrocarbon or BUST!
 
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Solar energy is the future for Somalia. Combined with the rapid drop of LFP batteries in China:

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I have revised my post after crunching the numbers for e.g. to power 50 factories in Somalia you will need around 3 million USD if your sourcing it directly from China the panels.

If you factor in batteries its astronomical even with the figures you posted for the 50 factories scenario your looking at over $100 million USD for storage alone.

Even after 25 years its only marginally cheaper then the hydrocarbons we import, despite ridiculous upfront cost


Cost Comparison Table for Powering 50 Factories in Somalia​


Energy SourceCapital Cost (USD)Annual Operating Cost (USD)Total Operating Cost (25 Years, USD)Total Cost Over 25 Years (USD)
Coal$10,075,000$900,000$22,500,000$32,575,000
Natural Gas/Oil$6,045,000$3,000,000$75,000,000$81,045,000
Hydropower$27,400,000$600,000$15,000,000$42,400,000
Solar + Batteries$65,963,152 ($52,273,152 for batteries + $13,690,000 for panels)$300,000$7,500,000$73,463,152


Its Hydrocarbons or bust if we want to industrialize, keep in mind Kenya has at least 3700 manufacturing facilities, Ethiopia has 4441 listed, Somali only has 9 publicly listed.

In Comparison UK has 138000, we need at least 10.000 to industrialise, if your crunch those numbers with solar, impossible.

Solar only makes sense for small businesses and homes due to astronomic cost of current prices, but to really industrialise its BIG FAT NO.

@Zak12 that money is better spent elsewhere before you think of diversification, if your not efficient with your limited $$ your toast. So many stories of failed business people who failed to crunch basic numbers, the areas around those rivers are only sparsely populated, so to bring that energy to the big cities the costs are astronomical.

For some reason cannot find any data on Somalia coal stores, we literally toast in that end, which leaves Hydrocarbon as the only real solution, if we don't find this, we are toast, we will never industrialise.
 
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World

VIP
I have revised my post after crunching the numbers for e.g. to power 50 factories in Somalia you will need around 3 million USD if your sourcing it directly from China the panels.

If you factor in batteries its astronomical even with the figures you posted for the 50 factories scenario your looking at over $100 million USD for storage alone.

Even after 25 years its only marginally cheaper then the hydrocarbons we import, despite ridiculous upfront cost


Cost Comparison Table for Powering 50 Factories in Somalia​


Energy SourceCapital Cost (USD)Annual Operating Cost (USD)Total Operating Cost (25 Years, USD)Total Cost Over 25 Years (USD)
Coal$10,075,000$900,000$22,500,000$32,575,000
Natural Gas/Oil$6,045,000$3,000,000$75,000,000$81,045,000
Hydropower$27,400,000$600,000$15,000,000$42,400,000
Solar + Batteries$65,963,152 ($52,273,152 for batteries + $13,690,000 for panels)$300,000$7,500,000$73,463,152


Its Hydrocarbons or bust if we want to industrialize
Building a huge solar farm in Sanaag matching the capacity of Ethiopia's GERD dam would cost $8 billion today. Installation costs is inflated as well I would say, so the figure is likely a bit lower. The batteries would cost $6.6 billion, but in 5-10 years time that figure would probably be $1 billion if not less. Even so, it's still cheaper than how much it cost Ethiopia to build ($10+ billion). Also, it would generate $700 million a year in revenue if sold at $0.05 per kwh.

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Building a huge solar farm in Sanaag matching the capacity of Ethiopia's GERD dam would cost $8 billion today. Installation costs is inflated as well I would say, so the figure is likely a bit lower. The batteries would cost $6.6 billion, but in 5-10 years time that figure would probably be $1 billion if not less. Even so, it's still cheaper than how much it cost Ethiopia to build ($10+ billion).

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What you are not factoring in is that those batteries and those panels have 20-25 year lifetime so they will be no good, even if the prices drop 50% in the future (unlikely due to demographics issue China)

The figure is still astronomical to replace all of that and the safe disposal of it. The GERD has a life span that can exceed 100 years.

You also didn't factor into the equation the land required, you will need 145 square Kilometers of land for that Solar Farm, that's 29 times larger then the land GERD currently sits on.

The final nail in the coffin is reliability, its a no contest in that area, you can easily predict and forecast GERD, impossible Solar panels.
 

World

VIP
What you are not factoring in is that those batteries and those panels have 20-25 year lifetime so they will be no good, even if the prices drop 50% in the future (unlikely due to demographics issue China)

The figure is still astronomical to replace all of that and the safe disposal of it. The GERD has a life span that can exceed 100 years.

You also didn't factor into the equation the land required, you will need 145 square Kilometers of land for that Solar Farm, that's 29 times larger then the land GERD currently sits on.

The final nail in the coffin is reliability, its a no contest in that area, you can easily predict and forecast GERD, impossible Solar panels.
Why don't you think the prices of LFP batteries will drop in the future? It has already dropped 50 % in the last year. In 2015, the price was $350 per kwh, now it's $50 per kwh. That's an astronomical decrease in price.

Here is a good article on how cheap it can get, especially with the emergence of sodium-ion batteries which is poised to significantly impact the future cost of energy storage.

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$8/kwh in 2030, along with decreases in the price of solar panels, would mean building the solar GERD equivalent could cost $3-5 billion!

I disagree with your statement that you can't forecast and predict solar panels. Pairing solar farms with large-scale battery storage (e.g., LFP or sodium-ion batteries) can store excess energy during sunny periods and release it during nighttime or cloudy days. A solar farm with 6,928 MW capacity and 3 days of storage (124,686 MWh) can provide consistent power even during periods of low sunlight, however Somalia and Sanaag in specific would be one of the most reliable solar farms in the world due to our geography. I strongly believe that by 2030, it will be more cost effective to build a solar farm than a hydro dam. China is going all in with solar energy for a reason, and that's because it's the future.

Sure the lifespan of the GERD is longer, but we also have the benefit of scalability that they don't have. In 20-25 years, those batteries that need replacing would cost a fraction it first did. And this solar farm would be generating revenue as well! So lets say it cost $3-5 billion to build, it would generate $1 billion a year in revenue if sold at $0.065 per kwh. Long before the batteries need replacing you would have been making profit and recouped your investment.

The most important thing is what this would do for Somalia's economy, and the jobs it would create.

By the way, it would not need 145km2 of land, but 30km2.

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It looks like he was promised several things.





<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">“This year, the United States will complement its already huge investment in emergency assistance in Somalia with another 28-million dollar contribution to support the first year of two new five-year resilience and food security-focused projects. Over the next five years, these… <a href="https://t.co/gB5RHEbn6i">https://t.co/gB5RHEbn6i</a></p>&mdash; U.S. Embassy Mogadishu, Somalia (@US2SOMALIA) <a href="">January 4, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
USDA’s estimated MY 2023/24 wheat area is approximately the same as the previous two years. Satellite imagery analysis by USDA’s Foreign Agricultural Service and several other researchers indicated that irrigated wheat area did not increase by two million hectares as claimed by Ethiopia’s Ministry of Agriculture.
https://downloads.usda.library.corn.../5q47rn72z/tm70pd08x/n5840d235/production.pdf

It's insane. Even the US are calling them out .

They don't benefit from lying about their agricultural production to inflate their GDP numbers because how will they have accurate numbers and estimates first hand to tackle their food insecurity problems and address it and distribute rations to the most vulnerable communities who are effected by drought and famine.
 

Thegoodshepherd

Galkacyo iyo Calula dhexdood
VIP
@Inquisitive_ @World

You are both assuming that Somalia is a normally sunny/windy country. This is not the case. Somalia is a massive outlier in wind. Somalia may be the only country in the world that does not require baseload power or storage. We would need some natural gas powered peaker plants just in case, but they would probably go unused for months at a time.


Somalia has potentially 8,000 hours per year of consistent solar+wind production.
It is the only area in the world that has decent population density with this kind of combination. Tibet and Patagonia are empty. Figure of 8,362 TWH for Africa is mostly Somalia. Keep in mind the US uses only 4,100 TWH a year.

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This makes me incredibly hopeful. It means that we will likely be able to have running water and energy for potentially everyone. We need to get urbanization right and make sure our cities have grids and don't sprawl. Service delivery in Somalia may be cheaper than we imagined. We can desalinate water, have cheap air conditioning, and shift to cheap electric vehicles. This would mean that we can reduce our fuel imports and perhaps even export green hydrogen, earning dollars.
 
Holy shit i was right about the Nobel peace prize thing @Idilinaa





<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">President Hassan Sheikh Mohamud is a nominee for the Nobel Peace Prize and is regarded as a leading contender due to his remarkable achievements and contributions to peace and development.<a href="https://twitter.com/HassanSMohamud?ref_src=twsrc^tfw">@HassanSMohamud</a> <a href="https://t.co/O74BFf0O6l">pic.twitter.com/O74BFf0O6l</a></p>&mdash; Jihan Hassan Sheikh (@jihansomali) <a href="">January 4, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
@Inquisitive_ @World

You are both assuming that Somalia is a normally sunny/windy country. This is not the case. Somalia is a massive outlier in wind. Somalia may be the only country in the world that does not require baseload power or storage. We would need some natural gas powered peaker plants just in case, but they would probably go unused for months at a time.


Somalia has the 2nd highest electricity rate in East Africa after Kenya at 36-49% nationally and 60-80% urban. Business and factories are all already using electricity even with it being more expensive, many have started to move away from diesel and the power plants and renewable projects are only now being established, with electrification expected to hit 75% in 2027.

The Somali NDP targets a 6% yearly increase in generating capacity, which was achieved with an increase from 115 to 344 MW (2015 to June 2021), while the current electrification rate is 36% and a target for Somalia to increase up to 1043 MW (2022–2027) and expect electrification rate will increase up to 75%. The Federal Ministry of Planning aims to deliver more than 200 MW of the state’s energy production by RE sources.


It has the highest potential in renewable energy and as you said the wind energy alone can produce as much as the entire diesel and hybrid generations. It is estimated that the country can provide itself completely with self-produced energy in the long run.


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Somalias biggest advantage and what makes stand out from other countries is that were s country led by a private sector who takes the initiative to do things and is self reliant. This is extremely rare. One of the persistent problems countries all over the world but especially in southeast asia have ran into is that they will have good public policy but the private sector is not responding. I suspect some of these african leaders who want somali buisnessman to come to their country is because of this.

We can add this to what you said
Somalia has the highest Business Process ratings in the regions

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This one is being the most important. Because AbrahamFreedom said ''about owning the business decades ago and come up with fake paperwork to prove it. Workers are many times denied pay and businesses are regularly fooled by lazy workers who promise to deliver....''

This is basically not true in general, because Somalia performs relatively well in ensuring legal agreements are honored and disputes are resolved more effectively compared to the Sub-Saharan Africa average.

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Holy shit i was right about the Nobel peace prize thing @Idilinaa





<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">President Hassan Sheikh Mohamud is a nominee for the Nobel Peace Prize and is regarded as a leading contender due to his remarkable achievements and contributions to peace and development.<a href="https://twitter.com/HassanSMohamud?ref_src=twsrc^tfw">@HassanSMohamud</a> <a href="https://t.co/O74BFf0O6l">pic.twitter.com/O74BFf0O6l</a></p>&mdash; Jihan Hassan Sheikh (@jihansomali) <a href="">January 4, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Thats his daughter saying it so it must be true.

That's crazy, how did cowboy know that just from that Ethiopian Defense minister posing next to ocean with no caption
 
Why don't you think the prices of LFP batteries will drop in the future? It has already dropped 50 % in the last year. In 2015, the price was $350 per kwh, now it's $50 per kwh. That's an astronomical decrease in price.

Here is a good article on how cheap it can get, especially with the emergence of sodium-ion batteries which is poised to significantly impact the future cost of energy storage.

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$8/kwh in 2030, along with decreases in the price of solar panels, would mean building the solar GERD equivalent would cost $2 billion!

I disagree with your statement that you can't forecast and predict solar panels. Pairing solar farms with large-scale battery storage (e.g., LFP or sodium-ion batteries) can store excess energy during sunny periods and release it during nighttime or cloudy days. A solar farm with 6,928 MW capacity and 3 days of storage (124,686 MWh) can provide consistent power even during periods of low sunlight, however Somalia and Sanaag in specific would be one of the most reliable solar farms in the world due to our geography.

I strongly believe that by 2030, it will be more cost effective to build a solar farm than a hydro dam. China is going all in with solar energy for a reason, and that's because it's the future. Sure the lifespan of the GERD is longer, but we also have the benefit of scalability that they don't have. In 20-25 years, those batteries that need replacing would cost a fraction of the price it cost in the first place. Every year, solar is getting cheaper but the same can't be said for hydro. Imagine how many jobs this field would create in Somalia as well. How it would rejuvenate our economy.
Demographic collapse in China is the reason why I am not so optimistic, you will have decline in domestic demand coupled with wide spread labor shortages which will drive up the cost, automation is still too expensive contrary to popular opinion.

They are already shifting to high value manufacturing with EV's and Semi-conductor focus, Labour cost is already cheaper in Mexico then China, but the reasons companies are not moving away on mass is because China crushes everyones else on infrastructure, so even decentralised manufacturing will not compete on prices.

The global implication for this is terrifying, no country is able to compete with their efficiency and scale of production which they will loose in the next decade or two, this will have a major impact on global prices, your looking at the peak right now, unless we start manufacturing it ourselves your energy needs will be dependent on global supply chains.

You also haven't addressed the land this will occupy, 29x greater then the GERD, for home or small business use no problem, anything at scale, huge risk.

Hydropower is more maintenance heavy and would create more jobs then Solar, the reason you can't adequately predict output is you have a lot of factors outside the sun and cloud that play a role, especially maintenance, we have a lost of dust and sand which have an impact, impossible to calculate when you have 100.000 panels, how much energy you loose just through that or a few cloudy days.

Take a look at the failure of America's $1 billion dollar solar Farm.
 
@Inquisitive_ @World

You are both assuming that Somalia is a normally sunny/windy country. This is not the case. Somalia is a massive outlier in wind. Somalia may be the only country in the world that does not require baseload power or storage. We would need some natural gas powered peaker plants just in case, but they would probably go unused for months at a time.

Here is the breakdown using the 50 factories as an example.

The most damning thing about Wind Farms for the 50 factory example is that it requires 15x times more land than the factories themselves, this is unsustainable, its much worse then Solar which only requires 2.5x times the land.

You are also restricted to coastal areas were wind is consistent thus forced to run cables to industrial Urban centres which is extremely expensive and we don't have the infrastructure for it, if you add in the cost of land that it requires, you realise very quickly its not feasible at any industrial scale.

It only makes sense for a few fisheries and marine processing plants around the coastal areas, but not for industrialisation.

Wind also has the highest maintenance cost of all, the more I crush the numbers, the more it becomes clear, its Hydrocarbon or BUST! if we want to industrialise.

CategorySolar FarmWind FarmHydropowerHydrocarbonCoal
Capacity Needed250 MW143 MW100 MW56 MW (Cheapest)59 MW
Total Land Required1,250 acres4,290 acresDepends on reservoirMinimal (Cheapest)Minimal (Cheapest)
Installation Cost$250M$214.5M$250M$28M (Cheapest)$177M
Annual Maintenance$2.5M$4.29M$5M$1.4M (Cheapest)$5.31M
Lifetime Maintenance$62.5M$107.25M$125M$35M (Cheapest)$132.75M
Annual Fuel Cost$0$0$0$11.2M$5.9M (Cheapest)
Lifetime Fuel Cost$0$0$0$280M$147.5M (Cheapest)
Storage Cost$75M (optional)$42.9M (optional)$0 (Cheapest)$0 (Cheapest)$0 (Cheapest)
Total Cost (w/o Storage)$312.5M (Cheapest)$321.75M$375M$343M$457.25M
Total Cost (w/ Storage)$387.5M$364.65M (Cheapest)$375M$343M$457.25M
Energy ReliabilityRequires storageRequires less storageHighly reliable (Best)Highly reliable (Best)Highly reliable (Best)
Lifetime Energy Output~43,800 GWh~43,785 GWh~54,750 GWh~110,000 GWh~111,525 GWh (Highest)
 
Thats his daughter saying it so it must be true.

That's crazy, how did cowboy know that just from that Ethiopian Defense minister posing next to ocean with no caption
Nah he said that he had an insider source that told him about this. I just didn't expect to happen a day later.
 
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