The spanish team new paper

[NidarNidar]

Diridhaba international View attachment 358254

That is Ras(cape) Siyyan. It was a small port of Bab EL Mandeb called "Dire" (or a variation like "Dirye" or "Dirir"). It had limited freshwater and lacked rivers, restricting large-scale settlement. It was probably one of the crossings the Dir used to come over 2,500 years ago.

edit you'll find it shown on much older maps aswell, but then it disappears, it was used as a small port or fishing village.

 

[Idilinaa]

I don't understand why you're being so aggressive towards @Duubpon. He didn't say anything trolly, imho. If anything he complimented you and the rest of us in saying that we should publish like these people are to counter them and their nonsense.

Ironically, that is exactly something you have advised me and advised knowledgeable Somalis in general do. Take it easy, walaal. Feel like you're too often in a state of dagaal.

I get what you're saying, walaal, but I don't think my response was aggressive just direct. If someone wants to encourage serious discourse, they should do so without adding exaggerated hypotheticals that serve no real purpose beyond stirring emotions.


I’m all for countering revisionism with research and publications, and I’ve said so before, but I also think it’s important to call out unnecessary rhetoric when I see it. No hard feelings on my end just keeping the conversation focused where it matters

She's definitely pissed I called out her and her victim-blaming Kacaanist brethren.

I’ve never debated or discussed anything Kacaan-related with you, nor have I seen you bring it up in conversation with me.

I approach it as just one period in Somali history, the same way I discuss other historical eras. I don’t fixate on any single period, and I also analyze present-day realities just as much.

 

[cunug3aad]

That is Ras(cape) Siyyan. It was a small port of Bab EL Mandeb called "Dire" (or a variation like "Dirye" or "Dirir"). It had limited freshwater and lacked rivers, restricting large-scale settlement. It was probably one of the crossings the Dir used to come over 2,500 years ago.

View attachment 358255

Does that mean evidence of arab ancestry??
Also If say theres a clan who claims ancestry from carabi ibn aqiil how does the arab ancestry track? because if hes one arab ute who marries somalis/protosomalis who marry more somalis/protosomalis then only one of his fifty tousand of ancient qaraabo is arab? Wouldnt the gene be lost or washed out over time and you cant detect it anymore Or is there a way to find the carab gene

 

[Idilinaa]

Does that mean evidence of arab ancestry??
Also If say theres a clan who claims ancestry from carabi ibn aqiil how does the arab ancestry track? because if hes one arab ute who marries somalis/protosomalis who marry more somalis/protosomalis then only one of his fifty tousand of ancient qaraabo is arab? Wouldnt the gene be lost or washed out over time and you cant detect it anymore Or is there a way to find the carab gene

None of those Somali clans actually claims Arab ancestry in a literal, genealogical sense.

Throughout Islamic history, "Arab" was not strictly a lineage-based identity but rather a cultural and linguistic one. This was well understood and expressed in classical sources:

''Arab is not from any of you the mother or father, but it is the language, so whoever speaks Arabic is an Arab''

With this in mind, it’s clear that Aqili lineage claims were not about ethnic Arab identity but rather an expression of Islamic affiliation intended to forge a stronger connection to religious heritage.


Further reinforcing this, external Arabic texts often referred to Somalis claiming Aqili lineage as Al-Ajam (non-Arabs). Additionally, they carried nisba names that tied them to their cultural homeland, such as Al-Zayla’i, Al-Jabarti, Al-Maqdishi, and Al-Sumali. This suggests they went out of their way to distinguish themselves culturally rather than assimilate into an Arab identity.


As for the genetic question, intermarriage with a single Arab ancestor centuries ago would have an extremely diluted impact today so much so that it would be nearly undetectable in modern DNA testing. The overwhelming majority of one’s ancestry would still be Somali, as genetic inheritance follows a broad and continuous process rather than being preserved in a single distinct "Arab gene."

So, while some Somalis may claim distant Arab or should i say prophetic lineage as a reflection of religious heritage, their cultural and historical identity has always remained distinctly Somali.

 

[NidarNidar]

Does that mean evidence of arab ancestry??
Also If say theres a clan who claims ancestry from carabi ibn aqiil how does the arab ancestry track? because if hes one arab ute who marries somalis/protosomalis who marry more somalis/protosomalis then only one of his fifty tousand of ancient qaraabo is arab? Wouldnt the gene be lost or washed out over time and you cant detect it anymore Or is there a way to find the carab gene

More likely Mesopotamian, the term Arab just means a desert-dwelling => nomad just like Somali, both societies had settled people who shared common language but have been called something else. The earliest written records date back to about the 9th century BCE in Syria from Assyrian inscriptions mentioning Arabu paying tribute in camels and spices.

Some Somali clans claim ancestry from Aqil ibn Abi Talib, like the Dir and Hawiye and the Darood, These claims are just myths since the tmcra of E-Y18629 is commonly found in Somalis has a formation date of 4,800 -3,200 YBP (years before present) and a TMRCA of 3,300 -2,300 YBP, meanwhile T-BY181210 formation dates to 2,900 - 2,200 and TMRCA of 2,100 - 1,600 ybp.

The laas geel cave painting are estimated to been made about 3,500-2,500 BCE most likely by southern cushites, it shows mostly cattle and a single camels, these camles were probably wild.

@alchemist wrote this already so won't deleve deeper into it.

The word for camel was in the land since before the Rendille ancestors moved south. So we can look at a 2000-year-old phenomenon or older. Glottochronology shows that the word was nested thrugh descent not contact during roughly that time:

This goes well with genetic influence, intesification of economic relations with Southern Arabia, probaby drying of the region and expansions of economic internal logistics, as camels revolutionized the caravan industry wheras the donkey would probably be the chief beast of burden for taking goods from one region to another.

Also here is a good read.

 

[Shimbiris]

More likely Mesopotamian, the term Arab just means a desert-dwelling => nomad just like Somali, both societies had settled people who shared common language but have been called something else. The earliest written records date back to about the 9th century BCE in Syria from Assyrian inscriptions mentioning Arabu paying tribute in camels and spices.

 

[NidarNidar]