Ummah forum!

[Bielsa]

pretty sure that dude aint a turk.

Yeah my bad.

Meant to say Abu Terrorism

 

[Geeljire]

That is your evidence ??? In what handbook does it say not having any interest in learning the language of your parents or not having interest in ever living in Somalia count as self hate? Let me guess in the handbook of Somali nationalism written by you right??? Despite what you say I am free from your slanders. I have never advocated for Arabization of Somalia or saying that it is the right way forward. What I choose for myself and my preferences in life I do not claim should be the standard for all Somalis.

I provided qoutations of you dismissing your own culture and language as irrelevant non benificial.

What evidence? The evidence of you calling your own parent juhaals? and you justifiying that.

Then how are you a Somali? without Somali culture and language? You claim to not be a self hater, but that is the definition of a self hater, rejecting who you are and thinking less of it. There is not single verse in the quran or the prophetic traditions that supports this.

You can be a proud Self hater if you want but you cannot cover behind Islam and act as if Islam supports or promotes it. It doesnt!

 

[Sufiyan]

Are you asleep? i just did bring proof. How you lesser the importance of the Somali language and culture. While valuing Arabic language & culture

So I am obligated to care for the Somali language and culture??? I was not raised in Somalia nor do I have any connection to the Somali community in any form. I dont owe Somalis anything nor am I 'selling out' when I was never apart of the community to begin with. What you fail to understand is what I choose to dictate for myself does not mean I call for that way of life for all other Somalis or for that to be the case in Somalia. Your argument is as stupid as accusing someone who likes to skydive as a hobby in their own life as calling for skydiving to be widespread among the society and that politicians should support and subsidize it.

Thereby putting Arab culture above everyone elses.

How is that putting Arab culture above everyone elses??? you have a very black and white type of thinking which is dangerous at times. If I prefer a way of life for myself and myself only how does that mean I call for that way of life and the abolishment of the Somali way of life??? If you want to live like a nomad then more power to you. But we dont all have to think alike nor have the same tastes or the same ways of life.

Not once did i say, that Learning Arabic is not useful especially for Islamic sciences as i myself am learning Arabic. Just like how i learned to read and write English out of necessity, but the point being that the message of Islam is for all people and all times; that’s the essence of its universality. So being a Muslim does not mean speaking Arabic or loosing one’s mother tongue and Muslims have no insight as to who will gain God’s favor on the Day of Judgment.

I never said speaking Arabic was an obligation for the lay Muslim. You are putting words in my mouth. You are making an argument where there is none and where we do not actually disagree. All I said was to learn the deen at its most deepest level one needs a mastery of the Arabic language or one must rely on the translations of others to learn the religion and these translations can be biased by politics and creed.

Oh i see, So the convo shift towards making accusations towards me? Aight! Never called for any forceful removal or expulsion but rather suggested repatriation as a Peaceful Resolution this will solve conflict about land & resources and even a bigger conflict down the line. The Same Muslim minority you speak of are running around threathing us with Genocide/War/Murder and theft as it is evident by the numeral videos online.

I dont have near the amount time to search your posts in the way you have mine. I can recall you laughing along with these atheists and idol worshipers that proliferate this site who call for the genocide and enslavement of Muslim minorities. There is no repatriation of Muslims living in darul islam because that is the land of all Muslims. If you do not agree and believe people should live in a land based on their heritage and ethnicity then you are a nationalist and this is not from Islam.

But as you know there is ''No compulsion in religion''. So if someone disbelieves is not in my name to enact hostility or hate towards them. However i will correct them and refute what ever they may say which i have done over and over again

It is called al walaa wal baraa. We ahl al sunnah have enmity for the disbelievers and love for the believers. When you attack Muslims by calling them 'excon reverts' and showing an intense dislike for halal union while laughing along with these atheists and idol worshipers who will stop at nothing to import western homosexuality and other immoralities into the country. Would you prefer if a Somali Muslim sister married one of these immoral disbelievers over a good Muslim of another ethnicity all because they share a lineage and heritage with you ??? Your rotten nationalism and false creed is confirmed if you answer yes to that question.

If it looks like a duck & it quacks like a duck then it's probably a duck.

You don't have to wholly endorse anything , but there are fundamental simmilarities between you and Salafis is the fact that you put Arab culture above everything else and are not afraid to call your own parents juhaals which ever way you try to justify this. Wether you identify as one or not is irrelevant to me, just showing how pointless it is to distance yourself from them and act as if you are two worlds apart.

You would probably accuse the Somalis of old of being Salafis as well. Because we dont acceept your homosexual buddies or your liberal secularist nationalist ideology and dismiss it as a falsehood then that means we are all Salafis. Either you are an extreme ignorant person or a deviant modernist with a clear agenda. You probably dont even understand who ahl al sunnah is and why the modern group known as the 'Salafis' are outside of the fold of ahl al sunnah. Learn your deen for you are lacking in knowledge.

 

[Sufiyan]

Then how are you a Somali? without Somali culture and language?

I am Somali by virtue of my lineage and that which runs in my blood. regardless of what culture or language I speak or lack thereof my heritage should never be questioned. Simply because I do not have any desire living the lifestyle you do does not mean I campaign against it nor do I have to think like you and have the same preferences as you. Are all Somalis who do not drink camel milk self haters as well ??? That is how weak your argument is.

 

[Geeljire]

There is not single word in the quran or the prophetic traditions that have any beef with Nationalism or lineages.
You cannot conflate chauvanism with nationalism since they are not one in the same.

Islam does not tell you to deny your clan lineages , infact in the prophetic traditions place important on knowing your lineages.
Islam has an egalitarian code to it, but this does not erase race,culture,nationality and the complexities that come with it as long it does not contradict the basice tenants of islam.

Race is real in Islam, and the purpose of race is a blessing to humanity. It is a gift to create a diverse and beautiful world. It is also a challenge which test our development and humanity.

Nothing in creation is accidental, Black skin/Phenotypes is not an accident, or a topic not to be discussed. In both the Qur'an and Hadith, the Prophet refers to both Ethnicity and Nationality. Thus the issue of race can never be smooth over with "it doesn't matter." If it did not matter then we are saying God made a mistake.

 

[Geeljire]

So I am obligated to care for the Somali language and culture??? I was not raised in Somalia nor do I have any connection to the Somali community in any form. I dont owe Somalis anything nor am I 'selling out' when I was never apart of the community to begin with. What you fail to understand is what I choose to dictate for myself does not mean I call for that way of life for all other Somalis or for that to be the case in Somalia. Your argument is as stupid as accusing someone who likes to skydive as a hobby in their own life as calling for skydiving to be widespread among the society and that politicians should support and subsidize it.

You are not obliged to do anything, thats your choice. This is however self hate which is the point i am making. As this goes under the pyschological term Self-Rejection. So you saying you are any different than the Self hating Salafis is untrue.

Wether you live or was raised in Somalia does not remove what community you are born in, your heritage and what household you grew up in as this.

How is that putting Arab culture above everyone elses??? you have a very black and white type of thinking which is dangerous at times. If I prefer a way of life for myself and myself only how does that mean I call for that way of life and the abolishment of the Somali way of life??? If you want to live like a nomad then more power to you. But we dont all have to think alike nor have the same tastes or the same ways of life.

There is no black and white thinking. Tomorrow i can learn chinese culture and language that doesn't make my language & culture redundant and useless. Nor does it make it superior.

Its doesn't go down to preference your heritage is who you are, rejecting that is rejecting oneself.

I never said speaking Arabic was an obligation for the lay Muslim. You are putting words in my mouth. You are making an argument where there is none and where we do not actually disagree. All I said was to learn the deen at its most deepest level one needs a mastery of the Arabic language or one must rely on the translations of others to learn the religion and these translations can be biased by politics and creed.

Glad we agree on that. But how does this make Somali language redundant and useless not beneficial to you?

I dont have near the amount time to search your posts in the way you have mine. I can recall you laughing along with these atheists and idol worshipers that proliferate this site who call for the genocide and enslavement of Muslim minorities. There is no repatriation of Muslims living in darul islam because that is the land of all Muslims. If you do not agree and believe people should live in a land based on their heritage and ethnicity then you are a nationalist and this is not from Islam.

You dont have time kulaha what you say does not exist , you ask people to fork over proof for accusations and you cannot do that yourself.
This is pure conjecture never have i laughed at the plight of other muslims nor have i supported antagonism on people.

Land being Muslim does not erase peoples ancestral homeland. Reptration was merily a suggestion to fix desputes between resources, poltical representation. To avoid bloodshed and conflict in the region.

Land and identity/heritage is linked with eachother. Arabia ,Somalia etc.

It is called al walaa wal baraa. We ahl al sunnah have enmity for the disbelievers and love for the believers. When you attack Muslims by calling them 'excon reverts' and showing an intense dislike for halal union while laughing along with these atheists and idol worshipers who will stop at nothing to import western homosexuality and other immoralities into the country. Would you prefer if a Somali Muslim sister married one of these immoral disbelievers over a good Muslim of another ethnicity all because they share a lineage and heritage with you ??? Your rotten nationalism and false creed is confirmed if you answer yes to that question.

I dont have anything against interracial marriages in a generality sense. . Attack muslims by calling them excon? if they are former convicts then calling them that is not a untrue or a crime.

A hadeeth says "People are like gold and silver; those who were best in Jahiliyyah (Pre-Islamic Period of Ignorance) are best in Islam". You cant change metal

What i have against is people using the deen to mask their self hatred, the hypocrisy of insulting your own with stereotypes while defending others as part of the ummah.

Missapplying islamic concepts and phrases . If you don't want to allow your daughter to marry some ex-con revert, this means that you are '' Ahlu Biddac'' part of the people of innovation. What this does is remove the role of their parents and the ''Wali'' most importantly.

It is NOT "asabiyyah" if your parents reject someone for not being Somali, even tho many classical (as well as current) scholars view cultural incompatibility as a legitimate reason for refusing someone.

It is NOT jahiliyyah to prefer marrying someone from your own background.

When the many of these women specifically state that they do not want to marry men from their own background, yet for some reason this is not as seen as a form of "jahiliyya". Why is it halal to negatively stereotype your own people but haraam when it comes to foreigners?

Halaal marriage between muslims is not the debate here, but the methods being used. How you people use islam wrongly to justify self hate and wrong doings.

You would probably accuse the Somalis of old of being Salafis as well. Because we dont acceept your homosexual buddies or your liberal secularist nationalist ideology and dismiss it as a falsehood then that means we are all Salafis. Either you are an extreme ignorant person or a deviant modernist with a clear agenda. You probably dont even understand who ahl al sunnah is and why the modern group known as the 'Salafis' are outside of the fold of ahl al sunnah. Learn your deen for you are lacking in knowledge.

Isn't funny how you interject people i have very little agreement with and things that have no association with me. On this forum i neither befriend people or try to gain personal contact with. My opinion are my own and their opinions are theirs. I do not take credit for what someone elses views are.

Like i said before wether you wish to call yourself Salafi or not is irrelevant. I neither accused you of being one on this thread, only stating you have no different ideological thinking.

Calling people modernists, nationalist, your own parents juhaals,obsessively hating non-believers, placing Arabic culture above your own is the fundamentals of Salafism, which you have. Wether i call you one or you identifiying as one wont change anything.

 

[Geeljire]

I am Somali by virtue of my lineage and that which runs in my blood. regardless of what culture or language I speak or lack thereof my heritage should never be questioned. Simply because I do not have any desire living the lifestyle you do does not mean I campaign against it nor do I have to think like you and have the same preferences as you. Are all Somalis who do not drink camel milk self haters as well ??? That is how weak your argument is.

A Somali is someone who is culturally Somali who speak Somali language, practices Somali culture and holds Somali lineages. Matters not to me what campaign you are in or what you wish for. Or what choices or preference you have.

The bottom line is you are rejecting yourself , your heritage and that is an act of Self hatred. .
Ridicoulus you talk as if heritage is a part of collection of different randoms snacks and what you like is dependent on what you prefer. You can just pick and chose what your born to, that is assigned to you before you were born by Allah.

 

[Geeljire]

This maan who called is own parents juhaals is trying to questions peoples faith.

The nerve of him.

 

[Sufiyan]

I started typing out a long reply but realized it is fruitless. You are the type of individual who loves to argue for the sake of arguing. You are not interested in seeking the truth or changing your worldview. This is going nowhere. Khalass. And if what I said about you was false then I sincerely apologize and I probably have you mixed up for someone else.

 

[Geeljire]

I started typing out a long reply but realized it is fruitless. You are the type of individual who loves to argue for the sake of arguing. You are not interested in seeking the truth or changing your worldview. This is going nowhere. Khalass. And if what I said about you was false then I sincerely apologize and I probably have you mixed up for someone else.

Lool are you trying to scapegoat the fact that i disagree. Having disagreements does not mean the same as being bigotted or intolerant to others views. The fact you are intolerant to my disagreements is. So if i don't agree with you i am not trying to seek truth? So i wear the the title ''Rundoon''(Truth Seeker) for show myaa.

Save me the bulshit , either concede or bow out gracefully.