Basra maxa inoo cayse aan ku yeelenay. We are very educated and wealthy plus we are peaceful
Where are the Somali Historians?
- Thread starter Basra
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You know the sultanate started in Adan Yemen first .
That would explain the historic warsangeli minority in several Arab trade ports
Yh they still have hundreds of thousands in oman and yemen. Till today. I think the most somalis in Khaleej are Warsangali and issaq. Like kuwait and qatar are majority Warsangali when my dad wenr there
Can you show where you got the info
Wasn't there a subclan of SM that sold slaves in Berbera and to the British. I'd I'm not wrong they were selling slaves and in charge of the trades.
The Portuguese knew of an Imam who ruled the interior, but had no direct contact with the Ajuran. Professor Hersi searched the Egyptian and Middle Eastern archives (including the Ottomans) for any contact of the Ajuran with governments outside Somalia, in vain.
According to: Portuguese Rule and Spanish Crown in South Africa 1581-1640, chapter II:
Mir Ali Bey was an independent pirate from the Mediterranean who was interested in re-establishing the East-West trade through the Red Sea for friends in Europe who were fighting the Portuguese and Spanish. He was assisted by Somalis from Mogadishu and Brava, who had been attacked by the Portuguese. With the help of Somali sailors in small boats called pangaios he was able to capture Lamu through the treachery of the local sheikh and went on the build a fort at Mombasa. This was captured by the Portuguese, who burned the entire town. Mir Ali Bey surrendered and died a Christian in Lisbon.
There was no Ajuran-Portuguese war. For one thing, the Ajuraan had no ships. It was the Omanis that fought and defeated the Portuguese, which is how they came to control Zanzibar and the East African coast.
The Ajuran were a coalition of Hawiyye clans who probably united to fight the Oromo in the Gallo Madow wars. The Imams ruled the interior from various locations. They didn't even control many of the clans between their power centers, which is why that map of the "empire" that gets trotted out is not correct. The last Imam was killed by the Darandolle at Ceel Cawl. The Ajuran never ruled at or over Mogadishu. According to The Shaping of Somali Society by Cassanelli the reverse may have been closer to the truth. The Ajuraan controlled access to the interior trade, but had no control over the export.
P. 99
"The Islamic city-state of Mogadishu had been governed as a sultanate since the twelfth century by a series of Arab and Persian dynasties. The last of these, the Muzzaffar, were allies of the Ajuraan rulers and apparently provided officials in Ajuraan administration."
This is footnoted as #33 with additional references to Cerulli and Hersi, "While the Muzzaffar are generally regarded to be of Yemeni origin, I was told by one informant that some members of the dynasty came from the Daafeed (part of the interriver area controlled by the Ajuraan) and that they provided wakils (local governors) for several districts under Ajuraan administration. This may reflect intermarriage between Arab and local Somali families."
Shanshiyo is correct. The Somalis who fought off the Portuguese and assisted Mir Ali Bey at Lamu were reer Hamar.
According to: Portuguese Rule and Spanish Crown in South Africa 1581-1640, chapter II:
Mir Ali Bey was an independent pirate from the Mediterranean who was interested in re-establishing the East-West trade through the Red Sea for friends in Europe who were fighting the Portuguese and Spanish. He was assisted by Somalis from Mogadishu and Brava, who had been attacked by the Portuguese. With the help of Somali sailors in small boats called pangaios he was able to capture Lamu through the treachery of the local sheikh and went on the build a fort at Mombasa. This was captured by the Portuguese, who burned the entire town. Mir Ali Bey surrendered and died a Christian in Lisbon.
There was no Ajuran-Portuguese war. For one thing, the Ajuraan had no ships. It was the Omanis that fought and defeated the Portuguese, which is how they came to control Zanzibar and the East African coast.
The Ajuran were a coalition of Hawiyye clans who probably united to fight the Oromo in the Gallo Madow wars. The Imams ruled the interior from various locations. They didn't even control many of the clans between their power centers, which is why that map of the "empire" that gets trotted out is not correct. The last Imam was killed by the Darandolle at Ceel Cawl. The Ajuran never ruled at or over Mogadishu. According to The Shaping of Somali Society by Cassanelli the reverse may have been closer to the truth. The Ajuraan controlled access to the interior trade, but had no control over the export.
P. 99
"The Islamic city-state of Mogadishu had been governed as a sultanate since the twelfth century by a series of Arab and Persian dynasties. The last of these, the Muzzaffar, were allies of the Ajuraan rulers and apparently provided officials in Ajuraan administration."
This is footnoted as #33 with additional references to Cerulli and Hersi, "While the Muzzaffar are generally regarded to be of Yemeni origin, I was told by one informant that some members of the dynasty came from the Daafeed (part of the interriver area controlled by the Ajuraan) and that they provided wakils (local governors) for several districts under Ajuraan administration. This may reflect intermarriage between Arab and local Somali families."
Shanshiyo is correct. The Somalis who fought off the Portuguese and assisted Mir Ali Bey at Lamu were reer Hamar.
Careful. Giving away Somali history to cadcads won’t make you popular. @SOMALI GENERAL @Factz @Sheikh
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He has no sources. You're talking to a historical revisionist troll. Nobody in this forum takes him seriously. He has a reputation of discrediting Somali accomplishments. He's simply an Cadaan dotard, no further explanation needed.
I will bring a source. The Ajuran Sultanate sent fleets to support their Ottomans ally to liberate the Swahili coast that were colonized by the Portuguese. While he's making assumption, I bring a clear source saying they received help from "Somali Ajuran Sultanate".
This is the Ajuran Sultanate map. It shows you how many ports they controlled including Mogadishu.
Ajuran Sultanate has a famous history of defeating the Portuguese and you have this idiot trying to discredit Somalis.
Mogadishu was known to be a province of Ajuran. Even the famous Portuguese traveller called Vasco Da Gama confirmed Ajuran Sultanate ruling Mogadishu.
Mudaffar dynasty only ruled Mogadishu which was an Ajuran province and the dynasty was part of the Ajuran stock. Basically, the Mudaffar dynasty was a sub-dynasty of Garen dynasty.
You know Moorshe is a sub-clan of Ajuran right that once dominated Mogadishu? After the fall of Ajuran Sultanate. Hawiye replaced them and established the Hiraab Imamate.
Another source I want to bring up is he said something about Ajuran Sultanate was a coalition. Well that is false. Ajuran was actually the leading confederacy. It tells you how much land and coast they controlled and how many tribes they ruled.
Don't entertain this moron. I've refuted him multiple times.
A_A
Islamic Fanfiction Writer
James Dahl
VIP
The Ajuuraan state was led by an Imam it was a quasi-theocratic monarchy that was founded in central Somalia in the 14th and 15th centuries. Subject to the Ajuuraan were a number of Gorgaate Hawiye clans, which at the time were not very powerful and the Bah Giirey Hawiye were the minor branch of Hawiye. The rise of the Hiraab clan of Gorgaate began with the intermarriage of the senior Hiraab subclan the Mudulood with the royal family of Ajuuraan, Cusmaan Darandoole Mudulood married Faaduma, the daughter of the Ajuuraan Imam Saarjecele Dayle Gareen. Their son Cali is the founder of the Abgaal clan.
In the 15th century the Ajuuraan and their allies conquered all of southern Somalia, which was at this time still Waaqist and inhabited by the ancestors of Digil and Rendille people. Following the conquest of the south the Ajuuraan established a number of important vassal states such as the first Geledi sultanate in Luuq Ganane, ruled by a different branch of the clan than the one that currently leads Geledi. The Ajuuraan clan spread out over their conquests to administer them but they spread themselves too thin and tried to rule over too many people.
In the 1600s the various subject clans of the Ajuuraan had grown fed up with their rule and overthrew them in a series of wars that lasted about 50 years. There wasn't one dramatic fall from power but a gradual nibbling away from one rebellion after another. The biggest rebellion was from the Abgaal who leveraged their claim from descending from the royal family to replace them in central Somalia. The last Imam to rule over central Somalia was killed at Ceel Cawl by the Abgaal and the Hiraab Hawiye took over central Somalia, and in 1624 the 8th Imam of Abgaal, Cumar Hilowle, tricked Muhamed Muzaffar the ruler of Mogadishu into leaving the city walls and was captured, making the Abgaal clan the masters of Mogadishu as well.
In the 15th century the Ajuuraan and their allies conquered all of southern Somalia, which was at this time still Waaqist and inhabited by the ancestors of Digil and Rendille people. Following the conquest of the south the Ajuuraan established a number of important vassal states such as the first Geledi sultanate in Luuq Ganane, ruled by a different branch of the clan than the one that currently leads Geledi. The Ajuuraan clan spread out over their conquests to administer them but they spread themselves too thin and tried to rule over too many people.
In the 1600s the various subject clans of the Ajuuraan had grown fed up with their rule and overthrew them in a series of wars that lasted about 50 years. There wasn't one dramatic fall from power but a gradual nibbling away from one rebellion after another. The biggest rebellion was from the Abgaal who leveraged their claim from descending from the royal family to replace them in central Somalia. The last Imam to rule over central Somalia was killed at Ceel Cawl by the Abgaal and the Hiraab Hawiye took over central Somalia, and in 1624 the 8th Imam of Abgaal, Cumar Hilowle, tricked Muhamed Muzaffar the ruler of Mogadishu into leaving the city walls and was captured, making the Abgaal clan the masters of Mogadishu as well.
So who made the Mogadishu sultanet and built it to a major trading hub?
James Dahl
VIP
Mogadishu was originally two cities, Xamar and Shingani which were both merchant republics. along with Marka and Baraawe, all were led by a council of leading families in the city and the city's chief Qadi. The cities and Xamar and Shingani were united into the Sultanate of Mogadishu by the first Sultan, Fakhr ad-Diin in the 13th century. The Sultanate eventually came under Ajuuraan hegemony and the last Sultan was Maxamed Muzaffar, who was a Yemeni Arab who brought cannons and firearms to Mogadishu in the 17th century.
2 questions then
- Was the cities in benadir built by Arab/Persians or Somalis?
- The Yemeni-Arab leader, was he and his predecessors that were Arab assimilated Somali into the somali or Arabs that distanced themselves from Somali culture
James Dahl
VIP
Probably both. The original cities of the Banaadir coast most likely began as trading emporiums of the local clans like those on the northern coast. The Ximyar kingdom conquered the Banaadir coast some time prior to the 1st century and the Periplus of the Erythraean Sea specifically states that the emporiums of the Banaadir were subjects of Ximyar.
Ximyar merchant families were the first groups to build towns on the Banaadir coast, the local people were not urban people they were nomadic people with no urban traditions, and came to the emporiums to trade and did not live there. Around the year 700 the Islamic Caliphate conquered the Banaadir coast and settled the towns with additional colonists mostly from Syria. The Chief Qadi of Shingani was hereditary to an old Ximyar family and legends state that Shingani was founded by Shingan ibn Hadi ibn Ma'adikarib.
Over the centuries more and more Somali clans became urban and the Banaadir towns over centuries became largely Somali, with many Somali Reer Banaadir clans.
Maxamed Muzaffar is, in the Abgaal story about him, specifically stated as having come "from Yemen" so he was not just of Yemeni descent but actually from Yemen.
Ali Dable
where do persians fit into this? why does the city have a persian name
James Dahl
VIP
Bandar is originally a Persian word but a lot of Arab places also use Bandar to mean a port or entrepot. Bosaso was originally known by Bandar Qasim. There's little evidence of a significant direct Persian influence on Mogadishu, and the name probably came from Arabic and Arab merchants.
Also the origin of Mogadishu is not confirmed to be "seat of the shah", there are other possible origins and some are Old Somali.
I disagree with you man. You need to look up at Ibn Sa'id, Ibn Battuta and other medieval scholars who travelled to Mogadishu, Merka and Barawa. They don't say what you say.
Merka was the capital of Hawiye according to Ibn Sa'id, the 13th century scholar.
Barawa was founded by a Tunni sheikh and was historically dominated by the Tunni clan.
Read about it: https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...nd coastal areas predominantly somali&f=false
Lastly, here is what Ibn Battuta said about Mogadishu and the Benadir coast. Note: he said it was never described as an alien enclave of Arabs or Persians.
As for Muzaffar dynasty. It ruled the Mogadishu province of Ajuran and apparently, Muzaffar was of Ajuran stock.
False, you're mixing up Barbara region with Azania. Himyar conquered Azania, the Benadir coast was considered part of the Barbara civilization and was independent from foreigners. Also, proto-Somalis were heavily engaged in trade which boosted their urbanization, especially on the coast. Read these sources.
James Dahl
VIP
We've already gone over this before I'll have to agree to disagree. To accept your interpretation requires ignoring too much evidence and too many leaps of logic and interpretations of specific passages of books from ill informed Europeans.
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