Why isn’t PL leaving?

[Zak12]

are too focused on fighting each other,

That is what the north has been doing lol. Its the main reason why you guys are still poor despite the peace.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

That is my point. You can’t compare a place that was the seat of power, wealth and the list continues which was also a place in which the war first broke out to a place that wasn’t even that developed during the time of SB and many people who were MJ ended up running to for a safe haven. It was hardly impacted.

Puntland was invaded by ICU terrorists in the 1990s, and they invaded all the way to Bosaso, we had to fight them off. You say we were not 'impacted', but we lost thousands of people, trying to hold onto our ancestral land, and not succumb to terror rule. ICU is the father of AlShabab, the group that preceded AlShabab, for those that don't know.

 

[ggoat]

That is my point. You can’t compare a place that was the seat of power, wealth and the list continues which was also a place in which the war first broke out to a place that wasn’t even that developed during the time of SB and many people who were MJ ended up running to for a safe haven. It was hardly impacted.

You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Learn Somali history

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

That is what the north has been doing lol. Its the main reason why you guys are still poor despite the peace.

The day that your region becomes free, and wealthy, is the day that you can discuss Puntland's economic state with me.

 

[Zak12]

The day that your region becomes free, and wealthy, is the day that you can discuss Puntland's economic state with me.

Enough with the whataboutism. The discussion is about PL and its woes.

 

[Angelina]

First of all, my family did not flee Puntland, we had to flee Mogadishu, just like all Daarood people who wanted to keep their lives, this was in 1991, before Puntland even existed. Puntland was created as a response to this, we needed a homeland, since we were not allowed to live in Mogadishu anymore.

I never claimed they fled Puntland. Why would they when Puntland wasn’t the place that was the seat of power or wealth? It wasn’t even that developed by Barre’s administration and many MJs ended up running away from capital back to PL meaning their cities like Bosaso, garawe and the like to escape the war since it started in Xamar.

In addition, USC troops, chased our people to Kismaayo and to Puntland, because they wanted to expand themselves, the same way they expanded into minority regions (Barawa, Marka etc,) which they occupy till this day. On top of fighting off USC troops, we have been forced to host thousands of Somalis from South Somalia, who are fleeing conflict.

As for Puntland's economy, I never said that we are rich, but we are developing, and we are at the stage that our tax money is being used to build infrastructure.

I’m glad it is developing wallahi. For me, Somalis winning regardless of qabil is a win for me. I do believe that charity starts at home. Let everyone focus on their backyard. But my point is, the issues in the South is a whole lot more complicated than PL. PL is a place in which one sub-tribe qabil is mostly the majority. The South is a place in which you have various sub clans from Abgaal, Hawadle and other Hawiye clans who are the most powerful atm to Marexaans, Rahanweyne, Leelkase, to Bimaal. It really isn’t fair to compare a place that’s like the United Nations in terms of qabils with ethnic minorities like the Bantus, the Reer Xamar Banadirs and the like.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

I never claimed they fled Puntland. Why would they when Puntland wasn’t the place that was the seat of power or wealth? It wasn’t even that developed by Barre’s administration and many MJs ended up running away to the capital back to PL to escape the war.

I’m glad it is developing wallahi. For me, Somalis winning regardless of qabil is a win for me. I do believe that charity starts at home. Let everyone focus on their backyard. But my point is, the issues in the South is a whole lot more complicated than PL. PL is a place in which one sub-tribe qabil is mostly the majority. The South is a place in which you have various sub clans from Abgaal, Hawadle and other Hawiye clans who are the most powerful atm to Marexaans, Rahanweyne, Leelkase, to Bimaal. It really isn’t fair to compare a place that’s like the United Nations in terms of qabils with ethnic minorities like the Bantus, the Reer Xamar Banadirs and the like.

It's true that the South has more clans, but you have to bear in mind, that Somalis still live within clan enclaves within South Somalia. For example, Gedo is mostly Marehan, they should be able to organise within themselves and free it. Same way that Hiiraan is mostly Xawaadle, and they managed to do this.

We need to stop infantilising grown men and hold them accountable.

 

[Angelina]

What I would like to see, is what Xawaadle have been doing, organising and freeing their land from Alshabab. They have tried their best, their neighbours need to emulate them.

Puntland was invaded by ICU terrorists in the 1990s, and they invaded all the way to Bosaso, we had to fight them off. You say we were not 'impacted', but we lost thousands of people, trying to hold onto our ancestral land, and not succumb to terror rule. ICU is the father of AlShabab, the group that preceded AlShabab, for those that don't know.

I never said you weren’t, but was it as impacted as the The capital with Kharxiis day and night and people seeing bodies on the floor and mass R-word of different qabils?

Also, it’s a lot easier to become organized when it one subtribe compared to a whole host of different qabils with ethnic minorities in the mix. It’s like comparing apples and oranges and it simply isn’t fair.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

I never said you weren’t, but was it as impacted as the The capital with Kharxiis day and night and people seeing bodies on the floor and mass R-word of different qabils?

Also, it’s a lot easier to become organized when it one subtribe compared to a whole host of different qabils with ethnic minorities in the mix. It’s like comparing apples and oranges and it simply isn’t fair.

If Puntland was ruled by the local mafia called AaranJaan, we'd be in a similar state.
I truly sympathise with political grievances and sabotage. However, at clan-level, we should hold people accountable for not doing grass-roots freedom movements! For example, the Xawaadle/Macawisley movement , Hiiraan has multiple Hawiye clans and also a sizeable Bantu presence. But guess what? The fact that the Xawaadle clan declared war on AlShabab, made great in-roads into defeating this group in Hiiraan. In fact, they even pushed forth into other Hawiye regions and freed those also!

This movement should be replicated across South Somalia, and then the last place, should be Mogadishu.

But in order for that to happen, people have to tell the truth to themselves and point the finger at their clan elders and the able-bodied males in their families.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

The Hiiraan-Macawiisley movement is what I want to see. An entire clan that has decided to lose lives and live in discomfort for the sake of the future.

These are regular men, that took up arms, foregoing sleep, food, and other comforts.

1. Their region is clan-diverse, that didn't stop them.
2. AlShabab terrorises them, that didn't stop them.
3. They are not the largest or wealthiest clan in South Somalia, but they are still doing it.

Peace doesn't come easily and every peaceful region in Somalia, has large graveyards.

 

[Yazi]

Puntland was invaded by ICU terrorists in the 1990s, and they invaded all the way to Bosaso, we had to fight them off. You say we were not 'impacted', but we lost thousands of people, trying to hold onto our ancestral land, and not succumb to terror rule. ICU is the father of AlShabab, the group that preceded AlShabab, for those that don't know.

No they weren't who are you trying to fool. It was another terrorist Islamic organization called AIAI which had many Darood members, AY crushed them in the early 90s with substantial support from Ethiopia. He then crushed his own Majerteen rivals and remained in power till he stepped down in 2004 to become the president of Transactional Federal Government in 2004. ICU in 2006 was planning to invade Galkacyo but it never materialized due to the Ethiopian intervention (also a courtesy of AY) So even when Puntland was mainly a single sub sub sub sub clan of Darood it went through 2 civil wars and had to be held together by a dictator for 10 years to survive, think about that the next time you clown the much larger and diverse southern Somalia.

 

[wheel]

No they weren't who are you trying to fool. It was another terrorist Islamic organization called AIAI which had many Darood members, AY crushed them in the early 90s with substantial support from Ethiopia. He then crushed his own Majerteen rivals and remained in power till he stepped down in 2004 to become the president of Transactional Federal Government in 2004. ICU in 2006 was planning to invade Galkacyo but it never materialized due to the Ethiopian intervention (also a courtesy of AY) So even when Puntland was mainly a single sub sub sub sub clan of Darood it went through 2 civil wars and had to be held together by a dictator for 10 years to survive, think about that the next time you clown the much larger and diverse southern Somalia.

FYI as far as i remember there was no support (in crushing the AIAI) from Ethiopia in 1992.