Atheist have no morals, they have no obligations to anyone.

[Omar del Sur]

I'm Muslim but

Anarchist communist here, I'm glad to see a Somali comrade

Interesting how you go from "Anarchist communist" to "I'm Muslim".

Anyone can say "I'm Muslim".

In any case, according to your words you are apparently an Anarcho-Communist-Muslim.

You can identify as Muslim all you want but I dislike this whole argument of "well, there are Muslims who do such-and-such".

I mean for example, if I talk to some random kuffar and say I don't believe in celebrating Christmas, they'll very likely say "lots of Muslims celebrate Christmas".

There are Muslims who commit zina. Is zina now halal?

You might be a Muslim who doesn't follow the religion in a particular aspect but that doesn't make the deviation halal.

Islam is based on Quran and Sunnah not whatever a person who says "I'm Muslim" (when they're not identifying with Anarchism and Communism) says.

Islamically, morality is objective. Just saying "I'm Muslim"... even "Mufti" Abu Layth says that... even that Shia fake "imam of peace" guy says that.

Anyways, I would like an explanation of your alleged anarchist-Communist-Muslim ideology.

I don't mean anything personal by "alleged" but I don't believe Communism is compatible with Islam. I don't think you can be a Muslim and an "Anarchist communist" at the same time.

 

[astorecalledkmart]

Morality was conferred upon humanity by God. In my opinion, there is no intrinsic right or wrong in atheism, but only laws created and enforced by men in power in order to maintain their power. The notion that humans have a natural affinity for morality is silly - the only affinity the base human has is survival. Atheists don't do "bad" things because they fear the consequences, legal or otherwise, not because they are innately good people

 

[astorecalledkmart]

Islam addresses slavery thru the Quran and hadith extensively assuming its existence as apart of the society the prophet lived in. Islam view slavery-like an exceptional condition and restrict it in its scope. Also, maybe slavery is "condoned" in Islam because it actually benefitted the prophet?!

Yes, that's why the he, the heir-apparent to the wealthiest and most powerful clan in ancient Arabia, would constantly promote the maumission and liberation of slaves

 

[Omar del Sur]

Havent bought my first book yet (sad i know) but my first one will definitely
be Gulag Archipelago

Have you got your first book yet?

I don't know if you should start with something like Gulag Archipelago. You might want to start with something like this

 

[Life]

Yes, that's why the he, the heir-apparent to the wealthiest and most powerful clan in ancient Arabia, would constantly promote the maumission and liberation of slaves

Are you being sarcastic? The more likely reason why the prophet was "against" slavery was to garner support and sway the lower class to Islam.

 

[astorecalledkmart]

Are you being sarcastic? The more likely reason why the prophet was "against" slavery was to garner support and sway the lower class to Islam.

The non-enslaved "lower classes" did not care about slaves as they were fundamentally different classes of people. That's like saying indentured white Irish servants in the US cared about the plight of African-American slaves, which they didn't

 

[Luciddreamer]

Have you got your first book yet?

I don't know if you should start with something like Gulag Archipelago. You might want to start with something like this

How is this relevant and why are you going through my post history

I didnt even post on this thread

 

[Life]

so you are non-Muslim it seems

also, pretty much everyone accepted slavery back then

My point exactly, slavery was accepted back then because it was considered to be right according to their moral compass that is moulded by outside factors like culture, society and belief.

so according to your logic

murder is not wrong

you say that objective morality does not exist

so that would mean murder is not objectively wrong

Depends on. In current time murder is okay if it's done in self-defence. Back then it was justified by other reasonings. Again, morality is relevant to time!

 

[Radical]

Interesting how you go from "Anarchist communist" to "I'm Muslim".

Anyone can say "I'm Muslim".

In any case, according to your words you are apparently an Anarcho-Communist-Muslim.

You can identify as Muslim all you want but I dislike this whole argument of "well, there are Muslims who do such-and-such".

I mean for example, if I talk to some random kuffar and say I don't believe in celebrating Christmas, they'll very likely say "lots of Muslims celebrate Christmas".

There are Muslims who commit zina. Is zina now halal?

You might be a Muslim who doesn't follow the religion in a particular aspect but that doesn't make the deviation halal.

Islam is based on Quran and Sunnah not whatever a person who says "I'm Muslim" (when they're not identifying with Anarchism and Communism) says.

Islamically, morality is objective. Just saying "I'm Muslim"... even "Mufti" Abu Layth says that... even that Shia fake "imam of peace" guy says that.

Anyways, I would like an explanation of your alleged anarchist-Communist-Muslim ideology.

I don't mean anything personal by "alleged" but I don't believe Communism is compatible with Islam. I don't think you can be a Muslim and an "Anarchist communist" at the same time.

Nice try on shifting the argument sxb couldve made it more subtle tho.

Too bad you only got your communism opinions from Mao and Stalin, hope we can have an interesting discussion when you broaden your horizons one day and realize that wasn't its true form.

 

[Omar del Sur]

Nice try on shifting the argument sxb couldve made it more subtle tho.

Too bad you only got your communism opinions from Mao and Stalin, hope we can have an interesting discussion when you broaden your horizons one day and realize that wasn't its true form.

I mean you represented yourself as a Muslim... and maybe you are... but you yourself acknowledge that you are a commie.

You want to have an interesting discussion? I do too.

I would like you to explain your alleged Anarchist-Communist-Muslim ideology. I feel I must say alleged because I don't believe that Islam and Communism are compatible.

 

[Life]

The non-enslaved "lower classes" did not care about slaves as they were fundamentally different classes of people. That's like saying indentured white Irish servants in the US cared about the plight of African-American slaves, which they didn't

The prophet came with a religion that was for all. By embracing the slave class who were the backbone of society by telling them that they mattered he basically showcased that Islam was meant for all and not only for the privileged. Of course, the non-slave class are gonna care. The class below them will no longer be under them because God values them. Also, the rich shunned the prophet. I would assume the lower non-slave class would follow suit. No one would want to be at the bottom and by embracing the considered lowest of all, a slave, the non-slave lower class and the former slaves lower class would be at the same level which by default make them the lowest. The prophet challenged the societal hierarchy by claiming that in gods "eyes" we are all equal.

 

[Radical]

How is this relevant and why are you going through my post history

I didnt even post on this thread

He did the same thing with me lol

I mean you represented yourself as a Muslim... and maybe you are... but you yourself acknowledge that you are a commie.

You want to have an interesting discussion? I do too.

I would like you to explain your alleged Anarchist-Communist-Muslim ideology. I feel I must say alleged because I don't believe that Islam and Communism are compatible.

So you can move the goal post again and bring up some weird comment I made in 2017? No thanks, I only argue with people who are willing to look at both sides and don't see debating as a competition but as a way to look at interesting viewpoints

 

[Omar del Sur]

He did the same thing with me lol

So you can move the goal post again and bring up some weird comment I made in 2017? No thanks, I only argue with people who are willing to look at both sides and don't see debating as a competition but as a way to look at interesting viewpoints

I would like to look at the viewpoint. I have asked you twice and you don't want to explain your ideology.

You want to present yourself as "I'm a Muslim" and just sort of gloss over the Communist identification.

You're not willing to be open about what it is you actually believe.

Nice try on shifting the argument sxb couldve made it more subtle tho.

Too bad you only got your communism opinions from Mao and Stalin, hope we can have an interesting discussion when you broaden your horizons one day and realize that wasn't its true form.

"that wasn't its true form" is clearly a variation of "that wasn't real Communism"

I don't see why you don't share the message of whatever it is you believe- rather than try to cover it




also the "I'm an Anarchist Communist" post was not from 2017

it was from a month ago


"Anarchist communist here, I'm glad to see a Somali comrade

Nov 5, 2019"
Menu

 

[astorecalledkmart]

The prophet came with a religion that was for all. By embracing the slave class who were the backbone of society by telling them that they mattered he basically showcased that Islam was meant for all and not only for the privileged. Of course, the non-slave class are gonna care. The class below them will no longer be under them because God values them. Also, the rich shunned the prophet. I would assume the lower non-slave class would follow suit. No one would want to be at the bottom and by embracing the considered lowest of all, a slave, the non-slave lower class and the former slaves lower class would be at the same level which by default make them the lowest. The prophet challenged the societal hierarchy by claiming that in gods "eyes" we are all equal.

Walaal, JazakAllah kahir that was very well said. The notion of equality and justice did exist in the ancient world. You yourself have just explained how morality is timeless and eternal using the early days of Islam in the 7th century as an example to demonstrate how equality among people has always been a righteous endeavour

 

[AhmedSmelly]

I considered myself a quranist a long time ago in hopes to make sense of Islam and religion overall. And yes to a certain degree I was rejecting the hadith because there are things in there that I disliked but mostly I rejected it because it actually makes sense to take your source from one book only.

atheism and theist are basically two sides of the same coin. I think claiming my self know whether God exists or that he doesn't exist is too extreme for me. I realise and accept that, in all honesty, I will never know until I die if Islam is right. I, for the time being, don't fully oppose the idea of a creator however I feel like that "creator" is not what we humans define as a creator and I don't believe that we humans are the centre of everything.

As to the subject at hand "objective morality" I actually fully believe that it doesn't exist. I don't believe I am misleading anyone and I think that I did the best I could to present my arguments. Read thru all of my arguments on this thread and then tell me what specifically you disagree with.

There is nothing called quranist and rejecting hadith is wrong. Rejecting hadiths that are taken out of context is acceptable. Totally Rejecting hadith because of some of its flaws, is shamefully wrong. Hadith is what makes humans use their brain. Hadith is the fog that clears the sheep from the wolf. I am neither. I am not a prey nor a predator. Hadith is the only way to find the sunnah of prophet mohammed SAW. You shouldnt deny hadith totally. It makes you look weak and ignorant. I have hated some hadiths and even debated of just cutting it out totally of my life. Everytime I had a problem with a hadith, it was because of my innate moral compass. They were colliding, and I had a gut feeling that the hadith was fabricated. Even tho it was a strong hadith. How did I overcome this hatred for some hadiths??? Attaining more Islamic knowledge. Sometimes not accepting them, believing I dont have the full story, or the context of the story.

 

[Luciddreamer]

I would like to look at the viewpoint. I have asked you twice and you don't want to explain your ideology.

You want to present yourself as "I'm a Muslim" and just sort of gloss over the Communist identification.

You're not willing to be open about what it is you actually believe.



"that wasn't its true form" is clearly a variation of "that wasn't real Communism"

I don't see why you don't share the message of whatever it is you believe- rather than try to cover it




also the "I'm an Anarchist Communist" post was not from 2017

it was from a month ago


"Anarchist communist here, I'm glad to see a Somali comrade

Nov 5, 2019"
Menu

Why do you always pretend to be genuine and sincere when you
already have people labeled and prejudged inside your mind?

You're only interested in hearing and seeings what supports your philosophy anyway.

 

[Omar del Sur]

i believe in god, just not religion

therefore a kaffir

and one clearly with an anti-Islam agenda

the quote is from

"Oct 29, 2019" in case there's any more lying about me digging up stuff from 2017

 

[Luciddreamer]

therefore a kaffir

and one clearly with an anti-Islam agenda

If you say so darling

 

[Omar del Sur]

@Luciddreamer you're a retard troll who possibly still hasn't started their first book yet

 

[Omar del Sur]

If you say so

Have you changed your mind and are you now a Muslim?

It was you that said you don't believe in religion and it's obvious you're anti-Islam and anti-religion.