Do you guys believe in Sixir?

[Axmed Xaji]

Because they don't have gills the have to forcefully breath and they sleep with half of their brains and although oxygen in the water is less than in the air it's more than enough for dolphins since bigger animals like the white shark have gills

When they forcefully breathe, they take in WAY more air in such a short period of time than they would have if they were under water. This is benign. I don't know why you're so fixated on the matter. It's a trade off that's worked for these animals forever.

 

[government]

When they forcefully breathe, they take in WAY more air in such a short period of time than they would have if they were under water. This is benign. I don't know why you're so fixated on the matter. It's a trade off that's worked for these animals forever.

Ok let us ignore dolphins why do humans have only one
Mitochondrial Eve if evolution was real shouldn't there be different mitochondrial Eves

 

[Burhan]

You're too cowardly to even address my points.

The similarities in DNA indicates a common ancestor and the difference show the variations. Basic evolutionary science taught in primary school. Nonetheless, this isn't what I talked about, too cowardly to address my actual work, but the fact that the chromosome differences between us and chimps attest to a fusion of two chromosomes to give us the 46 chromosomes that humans have. This is literally definitive evidence. Chimps have 48 chromosomes and we have 46 because two chromosomes fused together. Now tell me, using your logic, was that a coincidence or was it Allah trying to testing us by tricking us?

I remember addressing this too brah. I think I said the common Origin is the Creator and the variations are intentional. Example I gave was like the engineer who writes an original code or draws an schematic, then sets out to change here and there to effect different results while the fundamental design is kept in all.

Whilst this is evidence for you of speciation and you claim these things happened on their own, and millions of years, I and others point out that due to the complexity of these creatures and the process, it is impossible for that to just happen by chance and give the results we see. Hence, as Allah told us in the Quran "He is the one who initiates the creation and repeats it".


Saxib, it is how we interpret science that makes us different. You lie about science in support of your No-God beliefs. I take science and respect it for its complexity knowing nothing happens out of chance based on our human experience, and assign the beauty of nature to God's ingenuity.


Aside from the insults we hurl at each other, that is what it boils down to. You guys make a point in demeaning people who believe in God who chart a destiny for themselves based on that. Just to feel better about your choices.

Looks bad on you brother.

 

[Ferrari]

It is funny because Greeks are not considered pure whites even to this day. Europeans hijacked their civilization to make themselves look good. And they did not see themselves as white either. There was even a famous black Greek. Being black was never an issue even for whites until recently.

Egyptian and Phoenician influence on Greeks were widely accepted in Antiquity. But Europeans changed everything after the 18th century. And it got worse during when Eugenics became great interest to them. Thanks to Darwin also, they made it scientific that blacks are Inferior and only an advanced ape compared to the advanced humans like Whites.


Then you have guys named tXaaji exactly sounding like their white masters without even knowing that. The whole affair would be funny if ain't sad.

Exactly my point. How am I supposed to believe the same whites who weren't showering in the dark ages are superior to us? If they are innately superior to darker skinned people, why were they lagging behind the world until 15th century? Unless one believes in intelligence being something learned/acquired, there is no way to answer that and if one believes, then they have denounced the idea of innate caqli. Cadaans have turned everything around and rewritten history to support their racist narratives.

 

[Burhan]

Pardon me, I typed fast and multitasked, so I corrected spelling and thoughts that were not cogently expressed.

 

[Axmed Xaji]

Ok let us ignore dolphins why do humans have only one
Mitochondrial Eve if evolution was real shouldn't there be different mitochondrial Eves

Evolution is not complete. It's an ongoing process. Think of it this way. If we didn't have technology and we werehunter-gatherers, someone with a rare condition of seeing in the infrared or ultraviolet would be a plus. This person would easily catch prey by detecting heat signatures and laying in wait. For a hunter-gatherer society, this would be ideal and the more people have this condition, the more prey they could catch and easier it will be to detect predators. If however we were developed, as we are today, this same hypothetical person would have no advantage his rare condition is not needed to survive as a species. This person wouldn't be naturally selected and the others wouldn't die out.

 

[The_Cosmos]

I remember addressing this too brah. I think I said the common Origin is the Creator and the variations are intentional. Example I gave was like the engineer who writes an original code or draws an schematic, then sets out to change here and there to effect different results while the fundamental design is kept in all.

Whilst this is evidence for you of speciation and you claim these things happened on their owns, and millions of years, I and others point out that due to the complexity of these creatures, it is impossible for the process to just happen by chance to give the results we see. Hence, as Allah told us in the Quran "He is the one who initiates the creation and repeats it".


Saxib, it is how we intercept science that makes us different. You lie to about science in support of your No-God beliefs. I take science and respect it for its complexity knowing nothing happens out of chance based on our human experience, and assign the beauty of nature to God's ingenuity.


Aside from the insults we hurl at each other, that is what it boils down to. You guys make a point in demeaning people who believe in God and chart a destiny for themselves base don that. Just to feel better about your choices.

Looks bad on you brother.

Glad to know that you'll know longer hurl insults. I'll chill as well on my part.

You must understand that I have not once used evolution as evidence against the existence of god, there are theistic evolutionists. I have however stated that Islam and evolution are not mutually inclusive. You can't believe all life evolved whilst believing in Adam and Eve which has been disproven by genetic analysis of our ancestry. Evolution doesn't disprove god but it's shows that such processes don't require one either. You can say he initiated it but you can't say he continues the process.

The example I used explicitly proves, without a doubt, that humans and chimps have a common ancestor. Do you accept this? This is not a question of god as evolution has nothing to do with that.

You claim I lie about science but it is you who has clearly rejected evolution and is now somehow trying to reconcile the findings with the Islam. 48 chromosomes from chimps and two of them have fused to give you 46 chromosomes that we humans have today. This clearly shows that humans and chimps have a common ancestor. You can say that this doesn't occur out of chance, but would you seriously deny that humans have evolved like any other species?

 

[Burhan]

I can't get over the fact that these guys were questioning directions on earth because earth is spherical. Just can't wrap this bullshit around my head still. Waan yaabanahay weli.

And they are telling us about Science. If you live long enough, you encounter strange things in life.

 

[The_Cosmos]

I can't get over the fact that these guys were questioning directions on earth because earth is spherical. Just can't wrap this bullshit around my head still. Waan yaabamahay weli.

And they are telling us about Science. If you live long enough, you encounter strange things in life.

I answered your point on this one and you conveniently ignored it. Refer back to it and you will understand the point that was intended.

 

[government]

Evolution is not complete. It's an ongoing process. Think of it this way. If we didn't have technology and we werehunter-gatherers, someone with a rare condition of seeing in the infrared or ultraviolet would be a plus. This person would easily catch prey by detecting heat signatures and laying in wait. For a hunter-gatherer society, this would be ideal and the more people have this condition, the more prey they could catch and easier it will be to detect predators. If however we were developed, as we are today, this same hypothetical person would have no advantage his rare condition is not needed to survive as a species. This person wouldn't be naturally selected and the others wouldn't die out.

You didn't answer my question

 

[Axmed Xaji]

You didn't answer my question

Isnt that interesting though? Or are you fixated on one thing?

 

[government]

Isnt that interesting though? Or are you fixated on one thing?

You told me what evolution is which I know. And I agree with you on that if person had infrared detecting eyes he would have an advantage so by natural selection the people with That mutation will increase in number same that happens with sickle cell anemia and malaria

 

[Burhan]

Glad to know that you'll know longer hurl insults. I'll chill as well on my part.

You must understand that I have not once used evolution as evidence against the existence of god, there are theistic evolutionists. I have however stated that Islam and evolution are not mutually inclusive. You can't believe all life evolved whilst believing in Adam and Eve which has been disproven by genetic analysis of our ancestry. Evolution doesn't disprove god but it's shows that such processes don't require one either. You can say he initiated it but you can't say he continues the process.

The example I used explicitly proves, without a doubt, that humans and chimps have a common ancestor. Do you accept this? This is not a question of god as evolution has nothing to do with that.

You claim I lie about science but it is you who has clearly rejected evolution and is now somehow trying to reconcile the findings with the Islam. 48 chromosomes from chimps and two of them have fused to give you 46 chromosomes that we humans have today. This clearly shows that humans and chimps have a common ancestor. You can say that this doesn't occur out of chance, but would you seriously deny that humans have evolved like any other species?

To show how similar in genetic mapping animals are to humans, let me drop a copy of the percentages first:

- Genome-wide variation from one human being to another can be up to 0.5% (99.5% similarity)

- Chimpanzees are 96% to 98% similar to humans, depending on how it is calculated.

- Cats have 90% of homologous genes with humans, 82% with dogs, 80% with cows, 79% with chimpanzees, 69% with rats and 67% with mice.

- Cows (Bos taurus) are 80% genetically similar to humans (source)

- 75% of mouse genes have equivalents in humans (source), 90% of the mouse genome could be lined up with a region on the human genome (source) 99% of mouse genes turn out to have analogues in humans (source)

- The fruit fly (Drosophila) shares about 60% of its DNA with humans

- About 60% of chicken genes correspond to a similar human gene.


Naturally, we share the compounds with these animals that our DNA is made up of. A CARBON in my DNA will be the same CARBON in the rat's DNA. But how does that make me relative of the RAT? I can say we have the same origins but that is misleading because I am using the basis of Chemical code that are similar to 75% to claim I am of mice. Really? So, it is our interpretation of data that makes us an atheist or theist. I say great! All these coded chemicals we call DNA have the same basis and are similar but there is no relation between me and chicken, mice or an Ape. The difference in our percentage is what makes unique and that was intentional coding By God. To create something new out of what already exited among creatures. That is acceptable to a Muslim.


The percentage difference is what gives an animal what it has in characteristics and makes it different from other animals entirely. This variation can in no way happen on its own. It is by design. It is By God.

Look at human to human differences, in between humans, there is .5% difference. This is what gives each of us personality and looks that are different even among siblings. Goes to show the percentage difference between humans as small as it is, must be by design simply to differentiate humans even though they are of the same Origin.

The crux of the matter is, mentioning percentage of similarities between man and ape does not make a human an Ape. An ape walks on two does not make the Ape the grandfather of man. Each one of us beings is created as they are by God, and from the same source of chemicals.


It is how Allah constructed them and coupled them together that gave each animal their characteristic. Nothing complex about that from a muslim perspective. You say it happened by chance and the same Origin, I say it can not happen by chance and yes the same Origin as chemicals found on the periodic table but coded as such to give each animal its distinct character. Giving these animals one original Animal and they continued to evolve and gave birth to intermediary species is unproven, just feel good stories to eliminate God in the chain of the process. Plus there were no such intermideiary animals found. And nothing in recent recorded history showed speciation. No recorded evolution(Macro).

I need to catch the train Saxib. I didn't have time to refine my statements plus I am Somali and English is my second language. It zapped the energy out of me already due to concentration.


Drink in Moderation kkkkkkk.

 

[The_Cosmos]

To show how similar in genetic mapping animals are to humans, let me drop a copy of the percentages first:

- Genome-wide variation from one human being to another can be up to 0.5% (99.5% similarity)

- Chimpanzees are 96% to 98% similar to humans, depending on how it is calculated.

- Cats have 90% of homologous genes with humans, 82% with dogs, 80% with cows, 79% with chimpanzees, 69% with rats and 67% with mice.

- Cows (Bos taurus) are 80% genetically similar to humans (source)

- 75% of mouse genes have equivalents in humans (source), 90% of the mouse genome could be lined up with a region on the human genome (source) 99% of mouse genes turn out to have analogues in humans (source)

- The fruit fly (Drosophila) shares about 60% of its DNA with humans

- About 60% of chicken genes correspond to a similar human gene.


Naturally, we share the compounds with these animals that our DNA is made up of. A CARBON in my DNA will be the same CARBON in the rat's DNA. But how does that make me relative of the RAT? I can say we have the same origins but that is misleading because I am using the basis of Chemical code that are similar to 75% to claim I am of mice. Really? So, it is our interpretation of data that makes us an atheist or theist. I say great! All these coded chemicals we call DNA have the same basis and are similar but there is no relation between me and chicken, mice or an Ape. The difference in our percentage is what makes unique and that was intentional coding By God. To create something new out of what already exited among creatures. That is acceptable to a Muslim.


The percentage difference is what gives an animal what it has in characteristics and makes it different from other animals entirely. This variation can in no way happen on its own. It is by design. It is By God.

Look at human to human differences, in between humans, there is .5% difference. This is what gives each of us personality and looks that are different even among siblings. Goes to show the percentage difference between humans as small as it is, must be by design simply to differentiate humans even though they are of the same Origin.

The crux of the matter is, mentioning percentage of similarities between man and ape does not make a human an Ape. An ape walks on two does not make the Ape the grandfather of man. Each one of us beings is created as they are by God, and from the same source of chemicals.


It is how Allah constructed them and coupled them together that gave each animal their characteristic. Nothing complex about that from a muslim perspective. You say it happened by chance and the same Origin, I say it can not happen by chance and yes the same Origin as chemicals found on the periodic table but coded as such to give each animal its distinct character. Giving these animals one original Animal and they continued to evolve and gave birth to intermediary species is unproven, just feel good stories to eliminate God in the chain of the process. Plus there were no such intermideiary animals found. And nothing in recent recorded history showed speciation. No recorded evolution(Macro).

I need to catch the train Saxib. I didn't have time to refine my statements plus I am Somali and English is my second language. It zapped the energy out of me already due to concentration.


Drink in Moderation kkkkkkk.

The problem with you is that you assume, I don't know why, that I interpret the data for my own atheist agenda. This is the science saxib. You must understand that over 97% of scientists accept that all life has a common ancestor. You're the one who is choosing your own interpretation.

Before I go quoting actual academic sources, I'm going to call you out on your attempted slippery logic. You still haven't answered me on now chromosomes can merge to go from 48 to 46. You've essentially ducked this question to answer something that wasn't on my main agenda. Chimps have 48 chromosomes and two have merged to make 46. This is definitive evidence for the conclusion that both humans and chimps have a common ancestor.

To answer the rest of your point, I must say that you're playing some mental gymnastics to honestly even try and get around this. This four minute essentially articulates everything I wanted to say on both of the matters you presented. It's coming from a scientists as well with a PHD in the field.

 

[Burhan]

Cosmos, let me watch the video first. And no, I am not playing semantics. I am looking at the same data in genetic similarity and variation but not coming away with random selection that spawned different species from prior species(predecessor). To me, each creature and specie is by design. Different from the other. A cow does not and can not give birth to anything else other than a cow. And that is how it had been for millions of years or as far back as humans could record their life. DNA is coded for all of these living animals and organisms to give them their unique characteristics. Just because this DNA looks coded similar to some degree does not make a mice an ancestor to humans, It is claim your claim that animals diverged from one another long ago.. This process should happen often if it was part of evolution. Evolution should not stop spawning these new creatures. Does not happen now, never happened before.

Marka, the whole thing is a fairytale. It is using legitimate Genetic science to serve the non-creationist views.

Will watch the video to learn new information I haven't seen before. And holding a PhD doesn't make someone's words fool proof. I work with many who hold it and some are working on it, and I swear, I would not think to ask them anything about life and purpose in life.

 

[The_Cosmos]

Cosmos, let me watch the video first. And no, I am not playing semantics. I am looking at the same data in genetic similarity and variation but not coming away with random selection that spawned different species from prior species(predecessor). To me, each creature and specie is by design. Different from the other. A cow does not and can not give birth to anything else other than a cow. And that is how it had been for millions of years or as far back as humans could record their life. DNA is coded for all of these living animals and organisms to give them their unique characteristics. Just because this DNA looks coded similar to some degree does not make a mice an ancestor to humans, It is claim your claim that animals diverged from one another long ago.. This process should happen often if it was part of evolution. Evolution should not stop spawning these new creatures. Does not happen now, never happened before.

Marka, the whole thing is a fairytale. It is using legitimate Genetic science to serve the non-creationist views.

Will watch the video to learn new information I haven't seen before. And holding a PhD doesn't make someone's words fool proof. I work with many who hold it and some are working on it, and I swear, I would not think to ask them anything about life and purpose in life.

A cow does not and can not give birth to anything else other than a cow. And that is how it had been for millions of years or as far back as humans could record their life.

This the sort of crap that infuriates me! You speak about evolution with such confidence but you literally know zilch about it! How could you make such an absurd and flat out wrong statement about evolution?! One species cannot give birth to another species, it happens gradually to the extent that the new species cannot mate with the species it evolved from. This happens over generations long cycle of adaption via natural selection.

The very fact that you cannot even get the most basic of things correct, shows how much you really lack in knowledge.

Please, educate yourself about evolution before you make other more nonsensical statements.

 

[Burhan]

This the sort of crap that infuriates me! You speak about evolution with such confidence but you literally know zilch about it! How could you make such an absurd and flat out wrong statement about evolution?! One species cannot give birth to another species, it happens gradually to the extent that the new species cannot mate with the species it evolved from. This happens over generations long cycle of adaption via natural selection.

The very fact that you cannot even get the most basic of things correct, shows how much you really lack in knowledge.

Please, educate yourself about evolution before you make other more nonsensical statements.

The gradual speciation is your theory to support the bottom-line belief you have. And that in of itself fails big time to convince anyone. It is all theorizing how things happened without showing evidence for it. Let us face it, you condemn my view but still have no evidence for your claims and you want me to believe/take that at face value. Reality is, if evolution was a fact, it would still be happening today.

Writing with indignation doesn't turn a theory with no proof into a reality. When presented with simple logic that puts your assertions on the spot, don't resort to demeaning the person. It shows you had nothing to begin with and you are exposed for the fraud you are. If you have evidence today for gradually changing animal into something predictable, or a fossil record showing half human half ape, show that to us by all means. However, if your reply is that it takes millions of years for that to happen, it is your fairytale and there is no evidence for that.

There is no mystery about evolutionary theory as presented to us, it is taking the available biological evidence and add claims of how things happened without proofs. No other branch of science asks people to have blind faith in grand claims. Show it or Keep it to yourself. After all, you stance that says if something can not be proven, it doesn't exist. So asking people to take a leap of faith you took in bullshit amounts to dogma.

 

[Prince of Lasanod]

The so called "atheist" scientists are the biggest shaytaan worshippers who have contact with the outside world, and then you got fools here thinking that Jinns don't exist.

 

[Burhan]

Here is a good example of what I am talking about. That things boil down to theorizing with no facts. This article below talks about scenarios of why 46 instead of 48 chromosomes for humans. I would like everyone who has interest in this thread and topic and who followed to take time to read the article and share with me if there was any clear evidence of how 46 human chromosome came about.

I am cool with guess work to explain mysteries, but I take offense at someone wanting me to take the guess work for proof.

http://www.slate.com/articles/healt...omes_than_our_closest_primate_relatives_.html

 

[Burhan]

The so called "atheist" scientists are the biggest shaytaan worshippers who have contact with the outside world, and then you got fools here thinking that Jinns don't exist.

Their whole objective in life is to fight God exists. And the evidence they present for that fails simple logic. Their efforts to prove gene mutation giving rise to new species failed miserably. They have been abusing(pun intended) insects with radiation to cause gene mutation, and non of those experiments resulted in healthy insect that can be considered new species, all deformed and ultimately died of misery.

They can't support their theories, so all left for them is insult others.


Note how cosmos got his nigis twisted when I told him a cow won't give birth to something different. I understand the embarrassment he felt reading that because exactly that is what evolutionary theory tells us.

And he loves to tease Muslims of running away from their own book when he thinks he has a point against them( though that never happens at all).