Ethiopia: Oromia and Somali Region

[Arkan]

Alright that candidate got 1600 vote that means Sameroon are 80k, Ciise are 9k. Fair enough? We want know the pro Somaliland subclans that vote and how they measure up to other sub clans. So far Awdal and Saaxi are the only 2 regions without sub clan breakdown. I think Sameroon should care because most of their population outside Somaliland are eligible. Isaaq and Ciise cross the border to vote all the time.

How does competing subclans constitute if they are pro sl or not? It's not about sl but about representation.

You see we don't even need to bring in voters from across borders like Ciise and Isaaq. It would be a wrap if we did. Total dominance.

 

[Yazi]

How does competing subclans constitute if they are pro sl or not? It's not about sl but about representation.

You see we don't even need to bring in voters from across borders like Ciise and Isaaq. It would be a wrap if we did. Total dominance.

The ones who vote in large numbers = support Somaliland. The ones who don't won't show up. It is really simple.

 

[Awd]

55K did not vote, I would hardly call that half of Sameroon unless you are including those living in Ethiopia. So Awdal had 90k vote 12k for Ciise, 800 Isaaq, that means +77k Sameroon cast their vote in 2021 elections. Can you provide breakdowns for every Sameroon subclan. For some reason, Awdal and Saaxil do not have vote breakdown lists by subclan like other regions.

Regarding Awdal having 13 seats I totally agree. I believe all regions should be given seats based on registered population or population census like US. However that would lead to Maroodi Jeex having endue representation. Sool & Saaxil in particular have 12 & 10 seats while providing less than 10% of the total vote count.

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What do you think is a fair allocation of seat should look like or what should Awdal get 15, 17 seats?

Subclan breakdown for the Awdal Parliamentary elections in 2021:

Samaroon subclans:
Reer Nuur: 19,623
Jibril Yunis: 15,738
Adan Yunis: 3,203
Makayldheere: 1724
Bahabar Cabdale: 1316
Habar Muuse (Reer Maxamed, Bahabar Muuse and Abrayn): 14,904
Bahabar Celi: 6,092
Muusefiin: 4642
Jibraacin: 3147
Xeebjire: 2681
Reer Xamuud: 2649
Reer Yeesif: 1944
Total Samaroon vote: 77,663


Total Ciise vote: 11,550
Total Isaaq vote: 880


Regarding the allocated seat numbers, personally I think Awdal and Togdheer should have the same number of seats. I think that would be fair.

 

[Awd]

There's literally a video of a Ciise candidate who vocally admitted that he got his votes from Samaroon in Lughaya.

Why'd you want the subclan breakdown. Pointless for them to cross the border. The Samaroon in Awdal are more than enough to keep the region on locks. We got 12/13 seats with only 30% of our total clan population that's in Awdal.

Actually Samaroon won all 13 seats, a Bahabar Celi candidate forfeited his seat for the Ciise UCID candidate who passed away recently AUN. It was a travesty that we won all seats just like in the 2005 parliamentary elections. Same thing happened. The Ciise candidate recently passed away and Amina Fariid Cilmi who was next in succession took the seat. She became the first female parliamentarian in Somaliland. Now all 13 seats representing Awdal are all Samaroon.

 

[Awd]

How does competing subclans constitute if they are pro sl or not? It's not about sl but about representation.

You see we don't even need to bring in voters from across borders like Ciise and Isaaq. It would be a wrap if we did. Total dominance.

The highest number of votes cast in the Zeila district in 2021 was in Lawyacado where thousands of Ciise crossed the border from Djibouti to vote and yet they still couldn't win a parliamentary seat cleanly.

 

[Arkan]

Actually Samaroon won all 13 seats, a Bahabar Celi candidate forfeited his seat for the Ciise UCID candidate who passed away recently AUN. It was a travesty that we won all seats just like in the 2005 parliamentary elections. Same thing happened. The Ciise candidate recently passed away and Amina Fariid Cilmi who was next in succession took the seat. She became the first female parliamentarian in Somaliland. Now all 13 seats representing Awdal are all Samaroon.

That is very informative.

 

[Awd]

I was referring to one of the local MPs but that is very informative.

Oh the Mamasan candidate in Lughaya? I know the one you're talking about. He thanked the Habar Muuse for voting for him.

 

[Nin123]

View attachment 275259

Subclan breakdown for the Awdal Parliamentary elections in 2021:

Samaroon subclans:
Reer Nuur: 19,623
Jibril Yunis: 15,738
Adan Yunis: 3,203
Makayldheere: 1724
Bahabar Cabdale: 1316
Habar Muuse (Reer Maxamed, Bahabar Muuse and Abrayn): 14,904
Bahabar Celi: 6,092
Muusefiin: 4642
Jibraacin: 3147
Xeebjire: 2681
Reer Xamuud: 2649
Reer Yeesif: 1944
Total Samaroon vote: 77,663


Total Ciise vote: 11,550
Total Isaaq vote: 880


Regarding the allocated seat numbers, personally I think Awdal and Togdheer should have the same number of seats. I think that would be fair.

So this settles samaroon are the bulk majority of awdal state. I think all cisse decided to immigrate to Djibouti.

 

[Awd]

So this settles samaroon are the bulk majority of awdal state. I think all cisse decided to immigrate to Djibouti.

A few mistakes with your post, firstly the vast majority of the Ciise who inhabit Djibouti are subclans who originate from Ethiopia and not the subclans that originate from Awdal. The only Ciise subclans who are native to Somaliland and have had historical representation are the Mamasan and those who are native to the Zeila district like the Odaxgob and Reer Geedi in Jidhi/Cabdulqaadir, the rest of the Ciise subclans in Djibouti originate from Ethiopia and they make up the vast majority of the Djiboutian Ciise at over 85%. The Ciise in Somaliland are primarily nomadic and migrate seasonally through the coastal areas all the way to Bulaxaar.

Also, it wasn't only the Ciise who migrated to Djibouti. The Samaroon and the Isaaq also migrated there aswell. Before 1963, both the Samaroon and the Isaaq had a larger population in Djibouti than the Ciise. The French kicked out the Samaroon and Isaaq who wanted a united Somaliweyne and imported thousands of Ciise from Ethiopia and renamed the colony as the French territory of the Afar and Issas.

 

[Yazi]

View attachment 275259

Subclan breakdown for the Awdal Parliamentary elections in 2021:

Samaroon subclans:
Reer Nuur: 19,623
Jibril Yunis: 15,738
Adan Yunis: 3,203
Makayldheere: 1724
Bahabar Cabdale: 1316
Habar Muuse (Reer Maxamed, Bahabar Muuse and Abrayn): 14,904
Bahabar Celi: 6,092
Muusefiin: 4642
Jibraacin: 3147
Xeebjire: 2681
Reer Xamuud: 2649
Reer Yeesif: 1944
Total Samaroon vote: 77,663


Total Ciise vote: 11,550
Total Isaaq vote: 880


Regarding the allocated seat numbers, personally I think Awdal and Togdheer should have the same number of seats. I think that would be fair.

Mashallah Reer Nuur are Landheer. That means+60% of the Sameroon in Awdal are composed of 3 sub clans the Reer Nuur, Jibriil Yunis and Habar Muuse.

 

[Yazi]

A few mistakes with your post, firstly the vast majority of the Ciise who inhabit Djibouti are subclans who originate from Ethiopia and not the subclans that originate from Awdal. The only Ciise subclans who are native to Somaliland and have had historical representation are the Mamasan and those who are native to the Zeila district like the Odaxgob and Reer Geedi in Jidhi/Cabdulqaadir, the rest of the Ciise subclans in Djibouti originate from Ethiopia and they make up the vast majority of the Djiboutian Ciise at over 85%. The Ciise in Somaliland are primarily nomadic and migrate seasonally through the coastal areas all the way to Bulaxaar.

Also, it wasn't only the Ciise who migrated to Djibouti. The Samaroon and the Isaaq also migrated there aswell. Before 1963, both the Samaroon and the Isaaq had a larger population in Djibouti than the Ciise. The French kicked out the Samaroon and Isaaq who wanted a united Somaliweyne and imported thousands of Ciise from Ethiopia and renamed the colony as the French territory of the Afar and Issas.

I read something similar in the CIA archives. Isaaq were estimated to be on parity with the Ciise at 20k at one point but then the French said you are economic migrants and kick them all out; majority were HA. Do you have the sources?

It's really insane how Isaaq pursuit of Somaliweyn caused 60 years of humiliation and wasted opportunities. We could have a country (Somaliland), a leverage in another country (Djibouti) if we dropped the ball on Somaliweyn earlier in 1960. Hell, had Isaaq were politically savvy we could have joined forces with Sameroon & Afar to unite Djibouti with Somaliland into a single nation. Somaliweyne is the Isaaq version of the century of humiliation.

 

[Awd]

Mashallah Reer Nuur are Landheer. That means+60% of the Sameroon in Awdal are composed of 3 sub clans the Reer Nuur, Jibriil Yunis and Habar Muuse.

When it comes to Awdal, those 3 are the biggest and they steer the direction all the time. Last local elections the Jibril Yunis did better than the Reer Nuur which is why they managed to hold onto the mayor of Borama. The Reer Nuur played their cards right and threw their lot with Waddani which helped them win the mayor of Borama and Baki.

The Habar Muuse always do well in the coastal areas and Baki. They've always had the mayor of Lughaya, Cali Xaydh, and they are the xoghaye of Borama.

 

[Awd]

I read something similar in the CIA archives. Isaaq were estimated to be on parity with the Ciise at 20k at one point but then the French said you are economic migrants and kick them all out; majority were HA. Do you have the sources?
View attachment 275283


It's really insane how Isaaq pursuit of Somaliweyn caused 60 years of humiliation and wasted opportunities. We could have a country (Somaliland), a leverage in another country (Djibouti) if we dropped the ball on Somaliweyn earlier in 1960. Hell, had Isaaq were politically savvy we could have joined forces with Sameroon & Afar to unite Djibouti with Somaliland into a single nation. Somaliweyne is the Isaaq version of the century of humiliation.

Somalinimo is a wasted project. In the 50s up until the 90s, Isaaq was the biggest pro Somaliweyne clan. They were the ones who were fighting for Djiboutian and DDS inclusion into a greater Somali state. The first Somali clan that was targeted by the French in Djibouti was the Isaaq because of their desire to reunite the territories. Ironically it was the Dhulbahante and Samaroon who disliked the idea of combining the territories with Mogadishu

Somaliweyne was a noble idea in some ways but impractical and full of fantasy. The good thing about the Isaaq is that they woke up from the fantasy whereas some people including some Samaroon are still asleep with this fantasy.

It's really interesting how much things have changed since then.

 

[Yazi]

Somalinimo is a wasted project. In the 50s up until the 90s, Isaaq was the biggest pro Somaliweyne clan. They were the ones who were fighting for Djiboutian and DDS inclusion into a greater Somali state. The first Somali clan that was targeted by the French in Djibouti was the Isaaq because of their desire to reunite the territories. Ironically it was the Dhulbahante and Samaroon who disliked the idea of combining the territories with Mogadishu

Somaliweyne was a noble idea in some ways but impractical and full of fantasy. The good thing about the Isaaq is that they woke up from the fantasy whereas some people including some Samaroon are still asleep with this fantasy.

It's really interesting how much things have changed since then.

It was a noble project but got hijacked by politicians and lost its credibility. Now the majority of Isaaq and Dir understand that we could have our own cake and eat it too by having representation in 4 countries while running our affairs independently. The only good thing that comes out of it is the current generation of Isaaq being hysterically anti-Somali, it's almost comedic.

 

[Awd]

It was a noble project but got hijacked by politicians and lost its credibility. Now the majority of Isaaq and Dir understand that we could have our own cake and eat it too by having representation in 4 countries while running our affairs independently. The only good thing that comes out of it is the current generation of Isaaq being hysterically anti-Somali, it's almost comedic.

Absolutely 100%, just like all of the other Somali communities are looking after their own interests. Its funny how people who want a separate Somaliland state are called anti Somali when all of the other 'states' like Pntland, Jubbaland and the rest don't take orders from Mogadishu and are pseudo independent. At least Somaliland is clear where they stand. But the ones who want to have their cake and eat it too by claiming to be part of Somalia but do everything to undermine them is hypocritical at best.

 

[Yazi]

Absolutely 100%, just like all of the other Somali communities are looking after their own interests. Its funny how people who want a separate Somaliland state are called anti Somali when all of the other 'states' like Pntland, Jubbaland and the rest don't take orders from Mogadishu and are pseudo independent. At least Somaliland is clear where they stand. But the ones who want to have their cake and eat it too by claiming to be part of Somalia but do everything to undermine them is hypocritical at best.

I couldn't agree more. This whole Hawiye centralists vs Darood federalists is determinantal for the existence of the Somali state, but every clan undermines the national interest for their own benefit. Isaaq don't even care bout being called traitors or appealing for so-called unwritten code of Somali unity, in fact the new generation takes pride in distinguishing themselves from Somalia/Somalis and the gap will only grow wider with time. We will be Like Eritreans and Ethiopians or Djibouti and Somalia by fostering a different identity that abhorrents anything remotely Somali/southern.

 

[Yazi]

A few mistakes with your post, firstly the vast majority of the Ciise who inhabit Djibouti are subclans who originate from Ethiopia and not the subclans that originate from Awdal. The only Ciise subclans who are native to Somaliland and have had historical representation are the Mamasan and those who are native to the Zeila district like the Odaxgob and Reer Geedi in Jidhi/Cabdulqaadir, the rest of the Ciise subclans in Djibouti originate from Ethiopia and they make up the vast majority of the Djiboutian Ciise at over 85%. The Ciise in Somaliland are primarily nomadic and migrate seasonally through the coastal areas all the way to Bulaxaar.

Also, it wasn't only the Ciise who migrated to Djibouti. The Samaroon and the Isaaq also migrated there aswell. Before 1963, both the Samaroon and the Isaaq had a larger population in Djibouti than the Ciise. The French kicked out the Samaroon and Isaaq who wanted a united Somaliweyne and imported thousands of Ciise from Ethiopia and renamed the colony as the French territory of the Afar and Issas.

How much was the population of Sameroon back then? Ciise were 28k, Isaaq were 20k But most of them got the boot. I guess Sameroon were no less than 25k and Afar no less 40k, Afar had larger population than Somalis.

 

[Garaad.XIV]

55K did not vote, I would hardly call that half of Sameroon unless you are including those living in Ethiopia. So Awdal had 90k vote 12k for Ciise, 800 Isaaq, that means +77k Sameroon cast their vote in 2021 elections. Can you provide breakdowns for every Sameroon subclan. For some reason, Awdal and Saaxil do not have vote breakdown lists by subclan like other regions.

Regarding Awdal having 13 seats I totally agree. I believe all regions should be given seats based on registered population or population census like US. However that would lead to Maroodi Jeex having endue representation. Sool & Saaxil in particular have 12 & 10 seats while providing less than 10% of the total vote count.

View attachment 275161



What do you think is a fair allocation of seat should look like or what should Awdal get 15, 17 seats?

@Araabi How can we ensure fairness in allocating seats to Togdheer and Awdal? It is important to avoid any sense of entitlement. In the previous election, Togdheer received 40,000 more votes than Awdal. It would not be fair to allocate the same number of seats in this case. The best approach would be to assign seats proportionally based on the number of votes each region received. Additionally, Somaliland needs to make cross-border voting illegal to maintain the integrity of the electoral process.

 

[Ximan iyo Xadeed]

To the Dir brothers/sisters simping for Oromia

 

[Awd]

How much was the population of Sameroon back then? Ciise were 28k, Isaaq were 20k But most of them got the boot. I guess Sameroon were no less than 25k and Afar no less 40k, Afar had larger population than Somalis.

View attachment 275290

View attachment 275289

View attachment 275291

I'm not sure exactly regarding the population but in the 1940s there was a bigger Gadabursi population in Djibouti City than the Ciise as is confirmed by the Historical Dictionary of Djibouti, we also had the first native leader representing the country:

Alwan, Daoud A (2000). Historical Dictionary of Djibouti


The Gadabursi and Arab populations also controlled the politics and dominated the native representation during this period aswell:

Eyoh, Dickson; Zeleza, Paul Tiyambe (2005). Encyclopedia of Twentieth-Century African History

It was only after 1963 where the Isaaq and Samaroon were persecuted and exiled en masse.