Futuh al-Habasha: Somalis As Bedouins

[Shimbiris]

Found a source to pile on:

The first recorded reference to the Madhibaan people dates back to 1435 in Suleiman's translation of Ibn Majid's writings and poems found in Ababn Majid. In this text, Suleiman identifies the Madhibaan as Al-madhibaan, emphasizing their distinction as a separate nation from the Somali people. He briefly mentions the name Al Somali as well.

al_mahri_ibn_majid_books : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

١- شرح تحفة الفحول لسليمان المهري٢- القصيدة المسماة بالهدية لابن ماجد٣- القصيدة لابن...

archive.org

The handwriting is a bit annoying for me but I can read Arabic and it does seem to say what the English text from Wikipedia says. Basically, an Arab source is referring to the Madhiban and Somalis as separate peoples which we know, ethnically, is untrue. But if you read it as "Somali", at this time, meaning pastoralism/nomadism specialized people and the Madhiban obviously not being that, the source makes sense.

I truly am becoming quite convinced that during periods like the 1400s and 1500s "Somali" was basically a term for Geeljires/Bedouins and not an ethnic term. Really hits that this source is also basically contempraneous with the Futuh.

@Idilinaa @Khaem @Step a side @Yami @The alchemist @Midas

 

[Midas]

Found a source to pile on:

al_mahri_ibn_majid_books : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

١- شرح تحفة الفحول لسليمان المهري٢- القصيدة المسماة بالهدية لابن ماجد٣- القصيدة لابن...

archive.org

The handwriting is a bit annoying for me but I can read Arabic and it does seem to say what the English text from Wikipedia says. Basically, an Arab source is referring to the Madhiban and Somalis as separate peoples which we know, ethnically, is untrue. But if you read it as "Somali", at this time, meaning pastoralism/nomadism specialized people and the Madhiban obviously not being that, the source makes sense.

I truly am becoming quite convinced that during periods like the 1400s and 1500s "Somali" was basically a term for Geeljires/Bedouins and not an ethnic term. Really hits that this source is also basically contempraneous with the Futuh.

@Idilinaa @Khaem @Step a side @Yami @The alchemist @Midas

Wasn't hawiye also mentioned in like the 1100's ? We know so little about the environmental history of somalia. My best guess is that we are underestimating how much drier somalia is today than it was in the past. The shift to everybody identifying as somali might be symbolic of the change in the lifestyle of the entire country to one more dependent on pastoralism.

 

[Arabsiyawi]

Found a source to pile on:

al_mahri_ibn_majid_books : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

١- شرح تحفة الفحول لسليمان المهري٢- القصيدة المسماة بالهدية لابن ماجد٣- القصيدة لابن...

archive.org

The handwriting is a bit annoying for me but I can read Arabic and it does seem to say what the English text from Wikipedia says. Basically, an Arab source is referring to the Madhiban and Somalis as separate peoples which we know, ethnically, is untrue. But if you read it as "Somali", at this time, meaning pastoralism/nomadism specialized people and the Madhiban obviously not being that, the source makes sense.

I truly am becoming quite convinced that during periods like the 1400s and 1500s "Somali" was basically a term for Geeljires/Bedouins and not an ethnic term. Really hits that this source is also basically contempraneous with the Futuh.

@Idilinaa @Khaem @Step a side @Yami @The alchemist @Midas

I read Midg**n here ngl, so the exonym other somalis use for Madhibaan

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

I read Midg**n here ngl, so the exonym other somalis use for Madhibaan

I read that way too. It clearly says Al-Midjaan.

It is quite sad to realize that we have been doing this to our own blood brothers for at least 600 years. Depraved culture.

 

[Shimbiris]

I read that way too. It clearly says Al-Midjaan.

It is quite sad to realize that we have been doing this to our own blood brothers for at least 600 years. Depraved culture.

Sadly, it's probably a very, very old practice, walaal. It is shared with other Horners, Arabs and Barbers and could be thousands of years old:

Arabs also practiced Artisanal Taboo

I was always somewhat aware of this and how Arabians, like Somalis, have a similar aversion toward the crafts and "working with their hands" but didn't realize it was near exactly identical to the taboo among Horners: https://g.co/kgs/MgQ5PH Blacksmithing, masonry, carpentry, tanning and...

www.somalispot.com

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

Sadly, it's probably a very, very old practice, walaal. It is shared with other Horners, Arabs and Barbers and could be thousands of years old:

Arabs also practiced Artisanal Taboo

I was always somewhat aware of this and how Arabians, like Somalis, have a similar aversion toward the crafts and "working with their hands" but didn't realize it was near exactly identical to the taboo among Horners: https://g.co/kgs/MgQ5PH Blacksmithing, masonry, carpentry, tanning and...

www.somalispot.com

It is because of things like this that I don't believe in wholesale preservation of culture.

Some parts of Somali culture need to die. Pruning away things like this caste system and FGM is non-negotiable. Disgusting practices that remain virtually universal.

 

[Step a side]

@Shimbiris

It does say "Al-Midgaan," but since many Madhibaan reject the word due to its prejudiced usage, the writer has replaced it with the modern term "Madhibaan."

Regarding the word itself, this is evidence that "Midgaan" originally had no inherently negative definition. However, due to discrimination against the Madhibaan, words associated with them have taken on negative meanings over time. This process is known as a semantic pejoration.

 

[Shimbiris]

@Shimbiris

It does say "Al-Midgaan," but since many Madhibaan reject the word due to its prejudiced usage, the writer has replaced it with the modern term "Madhibaan."

Regarding the word itself, this is evidence that "Midgaan" originally had no inherently negative definition. However, due to discrimination against the Madhibaan, words associated with them have taken on negative meanings over time. This process is known as a semantic pejoration.

Yes, walaal, I can read the original Arabic "al-Midjan". I translated it as "Madhiban" to avoid using the more pejorative exonym. To be fair, it's still possible the word had a pejorative meaning back then and it was basically Somalis who were not Madhiban telling the Arab who heard that the name but it may have very well taken a similar route to the word "Gaal/Galla" with the Oromo. Originally, if I'm not mistaken, it probably just referenced the Qallu priests and how Oromos were basically Waqists and their followers but since the Oromo were constant enemies to both Somalis and Habeshas the term eventually took on an unpleasant meaning like "infidel" and "barbarian".

For all we know "M*dgaan" originally was just what they were called but from other Somalis pretty much turning it into an insult it possibly got warped. "I'm not a M*dgo!" is still a sentence I hear sometimes.

 

[Idilinaa]

It is because of things like this that I don't believe in wholesale preservation of culture.

Some parts of Somali culture need to die. Pruning away things like this caste system and FGM is non-negotiable. Disgusting practices that remain virtually universal.

I don't agree with @Shimbiris on this. Somali did not actually have a artisanal taboo or a caste either, this idea is born out of European orientalist, that tried project their societal feudalism in interpreting Somali social structure, which is based on an economic exchange system, not serfs and feudal overlords.

I explained it a bit before with sources:

Urban craftsmen were not Gaboye at all. When those 19th century orientalist sources mention this they are focusing on rural bondsmen in Miiyiga who btw are descended from various clans , Gaboye is not a clan and their role is often reduced because food production take up the more importance, so they are secondary to that.

The urban ones were different they were organized into the formal professional guilds and were also from various lineages. They crafted things for market places and traded it.




And when other Somalis moved into the towns and cities they would often take up on the same occupations , the same with the rural Gaboye as they were no longer were bondsmen when they settled in the major towns and as it was more common place.

Although it was done on a minor scale by the rural ones, it was the urban craftsmen that crafted the bulk the traditional crafts, and other stuff and they regularly exchanged it with the nomads and agriculturalists in return for other pastoral/agro products and raw materials.

.

 

[Idilinaa]

Found a source to pile on:

al_mahri_ibn_majid_books : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

١- شرح تحفة الفحول لسليمان المهري٢- القصيدة المسماة بالهدية لابن ماجد٣- القصيدة لابن...

archive.org

The handwriting is a bit annoying for me but I can read Arabic and it does seem to say what the English text from Wikipedia says. Basically, an Arab source is referring to the Madhiban and Somalis as separate peoples which we know, ethnically, is untrue. But if you read it as "Somali", at this time, meaning pastoralism/nomadism specialized people and the Madhiban obviously not being that, the source makes sense.

I truly am becoming quite convinced that during periods like the 1400s and 1500s "Somali" was basically a term for Geeljires/Bedouins and not an ethnic term. Really hits that this source is also basically contempraneous with the Futuh.

@Idilinaa @Khaem @Step a side @Yami @The alchemist @Midas

I think it's a bit of a hasty interpretation.

We cannot be sure if this is Madhiban but rather Madigaan which is a clan identity often confused for it which lives between Somaliland and Harar, people see them even in 19th century maps and think it's in refrence to Midgan/Madhibaan.

I believe it's Madigaan being mentioned, they are a Somali clan that are also called Massare Saransoor they live around harar and babile and some in Somaliland.

They are mentioned in Futuh as the Mazza clan. They are unrelated to Madhiban or the name Midgan.

IRB – Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada (Autor): „Information on the Madigan clan, a minority clan that is unrelated to the Midgan-Madiban clan, including its location, prominent clan members, occupational activities, whether it speaks any dist

Information on the Madigan clan, a minority clan that is unrelated to the Midgan-Madiban clan, including its location, prominent clan members, occupational activities, whether it speaks any distinguishable Somali dialects, and whether there is any information that links this clan to the Mahari...

www.ecoi.net

If you ask me , i believe the bigger more clear evidence for occupational seperation comes from ethiopian medieval texts that mention Temur(Tumaal) and Semur(Somaal) seperately but it survived as an archaism until 20th century.

 

[Idilinaa]

Wasn't hawiye also mentioned in like the 1100's ? We know so little about the environmental history of somalia. My best guess is that we are underestimating how much drier somalia is today than it was in the past. The shift to everybody identifying as somali might be symbolic of the change in the lifestyle of the entire country to one more dependent on pastoralism.

View attachment 352382View attachment 352383

Significant environmental changes happened in both the north and the south. Even flooding of the coast that damaged the towns in the North that we know of by Arabic sources.

Said Shidad made a little headway investigation into it as well and you see certain sources mention rivers behind Berber and Zeila and more rivers between Harar and showa in local sources that dried out today.

Understanding the Drivers of Drought in Somalia: Environmental Degradation as a Drought Determinant

This is further attested by an important Awdali (Somali state) document regarding earlier decades of the sixteenth century. According to the document, there were large herds of elephants and antelopes in today’s arid lowlands in the west of Harar uplands where forests were also prevalent

.56 Additionally, besides the surviving Hawash River, the study names at least five other rivers in the area between Harar and Shawa plateau.57 All these living elements have gone by the nineteenth century or before

and you see it in this source as well:

This qoute from the 1700s on Northern Somalia shows how we overcame the lack of rainfall.
''It seldom rains here; but the country is well watered by rivers and abounds with wheat, millet, frankinscense and pepper''