Mohammed Siyad Barre appreciation thread

[Lord Flacko]

[

Let's say you're Aideed in 1991. You've just ousted an incredibly unpopular regime, you control nearly all of Somalia below Gaalkacyo, and you have the opportunity to reshape Somalia in your own image.

What would you do @Prince of Hobyo ?

Please answer seriously.

Execute Barre and his allies. On live television.



Let's say you're Barre in 1990. Everybody hates you cuz you're a war-losing, genocidal, qabilist, human rights abuser and hated by everyone. A petition is written calling for your resignation and the reinstatement of democracy. What do you do when even the first President of the only democratic United Somali Republic calls for your resignation?

 

[Bahal]

I get where you're coming from sxb, if only siad barre gave up power for sake of the nation to prevent bloodshed.

Gave power up to who?

Again, he was literally forced out let alone willingly stepping down.

What followed afterward was the sole responsibility of those that created a vacuum they were apparently unwilling to fill.

History has vindicated Siad Barre. His blame will always be the fact he did not put down the rebellion before it was too late.

 

[Lord Flacko]

Again, nobody is disputing the fact that abuses were committed against the Rahanweyn. They suffered first under the SNF and then for nearly the next decade under the occupation of the USC. Why are you so insistent on ignoring this simple fact? The UN intervened after the USC pushed the SNF out. After the death of Aideed the elder, Hussein Aideed continued where his father left off, ultimately culminating with the Rahanweyn mobilizing and fighting for nearly a decade to free themselves.

Btw, still waiting

I just said that Gutaale can burn in hell for applying "Marehan/Barre/Morgan tactics" on civilians. How am I denying anything?


I only said the truth, and that is this

Terrible acts committed by Barre on a large scale in Baidoa. May he burn in hell.

 

[SOMALI GENERAL]

Gave power up to who?

Again, he was literally forced out let alone willingly stepping down.

What followed afterward was the sole responsibility of those that created a vacuum they were apparently unwilling to fill.

History has vindicated Siad Barre. His blame will always be the fact he did not put down the rebellion before it was too late.

I agree that siad barre not giving up power isn't the sole reason why Somalia descended into civil war. There had to be a united opposition front for a transition of power to occur, but that was never the case unfortunately.

 

[Bahal]

Execute Barre and his allies. On live television.

What would you do next?

In reality, normal civilians faced firing squad while the likes of Abiqasim, the Interior Minister of the regime and head of the NSS, and Hussein Kulmiye, the literal vice president of the regime, were not only spared but ushered into the leadership of the USC.

Forget slaughtering "enemy" civilians, can you explain the rationale behind the victorious conqueror attacking his own allies within weeks of ousting MSB? Why attack Abgaals? Majerteen?Ogaden?Murusade? Xawaadle? Can you explain why even masaakiin minorities like the Reer Xamar and Barawanis were decimated?

Let's say you're Barre in 1990. Everybody hates you cuz you're a war-losing, genocidal, qabilist, human rights abuser and hated by everyone. A petition is written calling for your resignation and the reinstatement of democracy. What do you do when even the first President of the only democratic United Somali Republic calls for your resignation?

Knowing what I know now, I would kill every single individual who signed that petition, purge the army of all whose loyalties are under question, and commit all my forces to eradicating the rebellion at all cost i.e. total war.

 

[Lord Flacko]

Gave power up to who?

Again, he was literally forced out let alone willingly stepping down.

What followed afterward was the sole responsibility of those that created a vacuum they were apparently unwilling to fill.

History has vindicated Siad Barre. His blame will always be the fact he did not put down the rebellion before it was too late.

To the creators behind the Mogadishu Manifesto maybe?

Barre had tried to put down the rebellion for years, instead of just stepping down. He executed over a dozen Majerteen Generals after a failed Coup when he humiliatingly lost the Ogaden War. He ordered massacres on every demonstration and bombed Northern Somalia.

Heres the Mogadishu Manifesto. You should read it.

To: General Mohamed Siyaad Barre

President of the Somali Democratic Republic

Mogadishu

Subject: Recommendation Aimed at Bringing About National Reconciliation and Salvation

We, the undersigned elders, who took part in the national struggle for independence – sultans and chiefs of the Somali Communities from the various regions, religious leaders, businessmen, intellectuals and others – strongly and unanimously feel that we can no longer remain passive spectators, nor ignore the duties and responsibilities that we owe to our people and our country, both from Somali and Islamic points of view, given the sufferings, the bloodshed and the incalculable loss of life and property that our people have suffered for so long; as well as all the consequent unforeseeable and negative repercussion and risks that these may result vis-à-vis our national integrity and security.

Among others things, we are deeply disturbed by:

THE CIVIL WAR:

1. The civil war ranging between the government forces and the opposition movements which has caused unlimited disaster to our motherland, not only militarily but also politically, economically, socially, morally, and materially- to the point of making us feel ashamed of ourselves as Somalis as well as being made pessimistic about our future.

1. The killings of tens of thousands of innocent civilians including: the aged, women and children as well as the destruction and looting of their properties.

1. The fleeing of hundreds of thousands of people from their homes because of fear for their lives which compelled to seek refuge in other countries like Ethiopia and Kenya.

The destruction and looting of major cities and towns including: Hargeisa, Burao, Shiekh, Erigavo, Buhodle, Galkaio, Galdogob, Do'ol, Wargalo, Hilmo and its surrounding hamlets, Afmadow, Liboya and Bada'de. To our shock and dismay, most of the wells and water reservoirs on which, because of the and nature of our land, the very existence and the life of the nomads and their livestock so much depend were deliberately destroyed as punitive measures.

LACK OF SECURITY AND RESPECT FOR LAW

The lack of security and respect for the law in the country have reached such proportions that there is hardly any Somali citizen, or a foreigner who sleeps at his house at present without fear for the safety of his own life, his family and property.

In addition, as a result of the regime, divide and rule policy, a widespread tribal feuds and hooliganism have taken and are taking an unlimited toll in almost every region throughout the country, causing great losses to life and property, and the disruption of trade, transport and communication as well as the sawing the seeds of disharmony among brotherly communities- thus endangering the peaceful co-existence of Somali communities.

VIOLATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS

In its twenty years' rule, the present regime has succeeded in monopolizing power in the domains of politics, economy and security. In the process, the people lost all their basic freedoms and role in the participation of the affairs of their own country. What is well known to all is the regime's arbitrary practice of throwing thousands of innocent citizens to prisons simply because they 'happened to comment on certain government policies or decisions which seemed to them unjust; worse still, others were jailed for the mere suspicion of being members or sympathizers of the opposition. Thousands of citizens have suffered years of imprisonment under cruel living conditions without proper food, water, light, health care, bedding etc. for periods up to 17 years. Many were tortured and others died while still in detention without any formal charges against them or due process of law. We cannot help but note, hereby, in a combination of shame and irony, that under the European colonial rule, the ordinary Somali enjoyed the right to Habeas Corpus whereas he has been arbitrarily deprived of such rights as a citizen by the regime as early as October, 1969 with Decree Law No. 64. In this case, comparing the record of the present regime to that of the British and Italian colonialism, doesn't independence mean less freedom to the ordinary Somali citizen? We must say, that in light of the kind of treatment the present regime has normally subjected to the Somali people for the past twenty years, many Somalis cannot help but sadly say that: "things were better under colonialism!"

No one can deny the fact that the present regime's human rights violation against the Somali citizen has become so notorious for so long to have reached such a point whereby Somalia has been listed as one of the four or five countries worse violators of human rights in the whole world by Amnesty International, African Watch and other human rights Organization.

GOVERNMENTAL MALADMINISTRATION

All Somalis as well as foreigners interested in Somali affairs are fully aware of the fact that government mismanagement and public maladministration have reached such a low and shameful point that the present regime is normally characterized with unconstrained corruption – from top to bottom – tribalism, nepotism, tyranny, injustice and inefficiency to the point where one cannot help but ask whether there is any national sense of responsibility in those who are supposed to govern the Somali people.

Public administration, from the center to the regional and district levels, and all public services that were intended to provide the basic foundations for the life of the people throughout the land, such as maintenance of law and order, protection of life and property, public health, basic education, water and electricity, transport and communication and the economic system, have practically ceased to function.

The Somali Commercial and Savings Bank, practically the only bank in the country, as a result of the monopoly introduced by the regime, now refuses or is unable to cash, strangely as this may sound, the very circular cheques and other credit papers that it previously issued to its customers with savings and bank accounts. This adds to the painful misery of poor citizens who now cannot get their own little savings so badly needed for the daily survival of their children.

In addition, the far-reaching serious economic losses suffered by the Somali traders and business community with a large deposits who cannot get their capital out of the bank in order to conduct their normal business transactions. This is bound to consequently have negative ill-effects and incalculable losses to the whole national economy, which Somalia can ill-afford.

The Somali Commercial and Savings Bank has practically closed its doors to all customers for the past eight weeks as of March 15, 1990. It is now widely believed that the bank is totally bankrupt and in fact is thirty billion shillings in the red. This has resulted from political, tribal interference and unbearable pressures on the management of the bank from the highest circles of the government who facilitated easy credit to the tune of hundreds of millions of shillings to the wives, sons, daughters, brothers and other relatives, as well as tribesmen and other political favorites of the governing echelon. Most of these loans are irrecoverable, since they were guaranteed by any assets or equities.

Another issue that is of particular concern to us and so deeply distresses us is the case of the National Army and the extent to which it has been reduced to an instrument to monopolize power and serve the political and tribal interests of the regime. It has also been used as an instrument of oppression of the Somali people.

The high purpose for which the National Army was created by the fast freely elected government was to defend our national sovereignty and to serve our national interest as a professional body, above political, tribal and personal interests. The Somali people had very high hopes in the National Army and gave their limited resources, paid a high price by giving its creation a top priority over badly needed social and economic developments.

Contrary to any sense of justice, the regime has placed its own political power and tribal interest above that of the whole nation by corrupting the army and involving it in party politics and tribal interests and promoting the officer corps on the basis of political and tribal loyalty as opposed to the traditional promotional system based on "professional merits" as it used to be in the past, under the command of the late General Da'ud Abdulle Hersi during the democratic civilian government prior to October, 1969.

The irresponsible, egoistic and power hungry instrumentalization of the National Army in order to maintain dictatorial power and tribal interest has reduced the National Army to the point where it has lost all inspect and credibility in the eyes of the Somali people. It has now practically disintegrated into tribal factions, sadly and painfully as this may sound to all sensible Somalis.

ECONOMICAL DISASTER

Today there is no doubt that hunger and misery have been felt in every Somali house except in those of the very few privileged ones. The entire national economy is in shambles. As a result, tens of thousands of Somalis have fled the country to the outside world in search for survival.

Unfortunately, the bulk of emigrants are the educated and the skilled laborers whose skills and expertise the country would need most to remedy the present national chaos.

The economic situation puts the existence of state at risk. It has already reduced the Somali people to the humiliating condition of being international beggars. This is an end-product of the dictatorial regime's mismanagement and corruption as well as the arbitrary imposition of Marxist Economic system contrary to our Islamic beliefs and cultural heritage. This philosophy has now been universally acknowledged as a failing system as demonstrated by recent events in Eastern Europe. By comparison, it is worthwhile remembering here that prior to the military take-over; Somalia had a national reserve fund of over sixty million dollars, plus a sum of stand-by hard currency capable of covering all import requirements for the whole country for four months.

To sum up, the present disastrous and tragic situation in which we find ourselves locked in is the end-product of twenty years of dictatorial rule and mismanagement by the present regime. The regime has arbitrarily deprived the Somali people of their fundamental rights for self-determination as well as the participation in the national decision-making process, affecting their own lives, families and future.

According to our considered opinion, only a replacement of the present regime by a care-taker government will get us out of the present mess (and the sooner we admit the reality the better) and will pave the way for a political settlement and peaceful solution to our most critical issues. This caretaker government must enjoy the respect and the confidence of the Somali people in general. The sooner we recognize the God given rights of the Somali people to freely choose their own government at every level, the better.

After all, once European Colonialism has left for good is there any Somali who has any right to rule, colonize, or worse still enslave other Somalis by force?

We do take note of the fact that lately the regime has been publicizing its willingness to abandon the present one-party rule, and its readiness to make changes in its own constitution in order to provide for its replacement with a multiparty democratic system, in time for a new political election in 1990.

However, the grim truth is that the Somali people have for the past twenty years become utterly tired, disillusioned and skeptical of the usual political rhetoric and empty promises that they have been subjected to and can no longer be deceived. If the regime seriously means business, it should immediately take concrete, clear-cut and tangible steps regarding constitutional changes, the introduction of a multiparty democratic system and free political elections under the close monitoring of independent observers from the Muslim World and Western democracies.

In order to dissipate all doubts and suspicions, why not allow the widest possible popular participation by duly chosen representatives of the Somali people, in order to realize the proposed constitutional, political and electoral goals?

It seems to us that because the present regime has been accustomed to a total monopoly of political power for more than two decades, it is unable to appreciate the vital importance of popular participation in the political process. On the other hand, it is as clear as day light, to all concerned, that the present regime by itself alone no longer commands neither the power nor the ability to lead us from the present danger, without the concerted effort and full backing of the Somali people as a whole.

To give certain credibility to the proposed constitutional and democratic changes, the first step needed is to abrogate immediately all the repressive laws as well as all the institutional "appratichki" (NSS, the Hangash or Military Intelligence, the Dhabarjebinta or Military Counter Intelligence, Koofiyad-Casta- Red Hats or Military Police, Barista Xisbiga- Party Investigators, Guulwadayaal- Party militia etc) such as:

1. Law No. 01 of 10 January, 1970- power of arrest.
2. Law No. 03 of 10 January, 1970- creation of National Security Court.
3. Law No. 14 of 15 February, 1970- creation of National Security Services.
4. Law No. 54 of 10 September, 1970- National Security.
5. Law No. 64 of 10 October, 1970- the abrogation of the right to Habeas Corpus.
6. Law No. 67 of 01 Nov. 1970- Socialistic Defence.
7. Law No. 38 of April, 1972- judicial powers to the Military Supreme Revolutionary Council.

At the same time, the old penal laws of the land, code No-5 of 16 December, 1962 and the penal procedure No. 1 of 10 January, 1963- enacted by the former democratically elected Somali Parliament- should be immediately restored enforce entirely.

After having suffered oppressive dictatorship for more than two decades, the Somali people now feel heart-fully thirsty and hungry to re-acquire their fundamental freedoms and national dignity. Therefore, if the regime is honestly serious enough about its declared intentions of restoring democratic pluralism, then the best test case would be the immediate abrogation of all the above mentioned Marxist inspired oppressive laws, thus restoring forthwith, to the Somali people, their sacred rights to basic freedoms such as: freedom of speech, freedom of assembly and association, and freedom to travel. It may well be worth remembering of the various prominent Somalis who after having suffered detention without trail for well over a decade have subsequently been place under travel restrictions.

Considering the fact that the regime is now trying very hard to improve its lost image and creditability inside and outside the country, what better means can there be to achieve its own goals than the immediate abolition of these repressive laws and the restoration of basic democracy?

NATIONAL RECONCILIATION AND SALVATION CONFERENCE (NRSC)

First Priority of the NRSC is to:

1. Put a stop as quickly as possible all the blood that has so sadly and so painfully been shed in most parts of Somalia;

1. Restore law and order, peace and stability through the country;

1. Find a political solution to the widespread civil war being fought.

CREATE A TRUE DEMOCRATIC SYSTEM BASED ON THE CONSENT OF THE SOMALI PEOPLE

We believe that it is indispensable to call the Conference of National Reconciliation and Salvation according to our traditional "Shin" system of the most popular political, tribal, religious and business leaders from all regions of Somalia- leaders who enjoy the full respect and confidence of their local and national constituents- to convene on a neutral ground as early as possible preferably in Djibouti, Saudi Arabia, Egypt or Italy.

In order to prepare the ground and make sure that such a vital "shir" gets well organized, we propose that a 13-member committee, called the Committee For the Preparation of the National Conference of Reconciliation and Salvation, composed of the following personalities, who in our opinion posses all the necessary qualifications required for such a delicate task of national importance, be immediately created:

The Signatories of the Document

1. Mr. Adam Abbdulle Osman (First President of the Country)

2. Shiekh Mukhtar Mohamed Hussein (Former President of the National Parliament)

3. Dr. Ismail Jumale Osoble (Lawyer and Ex-Minister of Information)

4. Haji Muse Boqor (Ex Minister of Interior)

5. Dr. Mohamed Rajis Ahmed (Lawyer, Former Member of Parliament)

6. Mohamed Abshir Muse (Commandant of Somali Defence Forces 1958-60 Ex-Commandant of Somali Police Forces 1960—69)

7. Sultan Dulane Rafle Guled

8. Mohamed Shiekh Ahmed Muse Ex-President of Supreme Court

9 Garad Abdiqani Garad Jama

10. Haji Jirde Hussein Duale

11 Haji Ali Shidde Abdi (Ex-Vice President- Somali Youth League Ex-Ambassador)

12. Shiekh Sharif Sharafow

13. Shiekh Ibrahim Suley

The duties and the responsibilities of the Preparatory Committee would be as follows:

1. The organization, preparation of the agenda and the procedural rules of the conference;

2. The selection and invitation of all conference participants and the arrangements of all meetings required, making sure that all communities are fairly represented;

3. Consultations with any one, or party who may have useful contribution to make, inside or outside the country;

4. Conduct and oversee all necessary discussion with the government and the opposition groups, with the principal aim of laying the foundation for a peaceful political solution to the present crises;

Participants in the Conference for Reconciliation and Salvation:

1. Representatives of the governing party with full authority;
2. Representatives of all opposition groups with full authority;
3. Leaders, representing all regions in Somalia, who enjoy the full confidence and respect of their people;
4. Most prominent religious leaders and intellectuals of national standing;

The Principal aims of the conference on National Reconciliation and Salvation:

1. Stopping the blood-shed amongst Somali brothers and the restoration of law and order, peace and stability to the country;
2. Reaching a common agreement on the basic principles governing the new Somali constitution;
3. Reaching a political agreement on the timetable and the best electoral procedure for holding free elections e.g. for a new parliament, a new president, new regional and district councils, necessary reforms on public administration, the economy, public services and the armed forces.
4. Formation of a caretaker government to be charged with the responsibility of carrying out the final decisions and agreement arrived in the conference.

Finally, we earnestly hope that your Excellency will agree with us on the gravity of the present situation and the unprecedented danger facing our nation. Hence there is an absolute need on the part of every sensible citizen everywhere to put national interest first and concentrate all their efforts- moral and material resources- in safeguarding our motherland.

We, therefore, trust that you will give our proposal the maximum attention and most careful consideration as well as the urgency that the present national crisis objectively calls for in order to save our national integrity and honor.

THE COUNCIL FOR NATIONAL RECONCILIATION AND SALVATION

Signatories’ names in the order they appeared in the document:


1. Haaji Aadan Abdulle ‘Ismaan

2. Sheekh Mukhtaar Mohamed Hussein

3. Haaji Muuse Boqor

4. Dr. Ismaa’iil Jim’aale

5. Dr. Mahamed Raajis Ahmed

6. Mahamed Abshir Muuse

7. Dr. Huseen Haaji Bood

8. Suldaan Turki Suldan Husseen Haile

9. ‘Ali Shiddo ‘Abdi

10. Sheekh Muudeey

11. Haaji ‘Ismaan Ahmed Robble

13. Haaji Baynah Barre

14. Ahmed Mahamed ‘Abdulle

15. Mahamuud Yuusuf Aadan

16. Prof. Ibraahim Mahamuud Abyan

17. Dr. Mahamuud Jaama Afbalaar

18. Haashi Weheliye Maalin

19. Haji Kamaaludiin Haaji Ali

20. ‘Abdulaahi Sheekh Mahamuud

21. Mahamed ‘Ali ‘Aateeye

22. ‘All Mahdi Mahamed

23. ‘Ali Huseen Gura’

24. Dr. ‘Abdullaahi Ma’allin ‘Abdulle

25. Boqor ‘Abdulaahi Boqor Muuse

26. Mahamed Faarah Siyaad

27. Saalah ‘Ali ‘Abdulle

28. Dr. Hasan Dhimbil Warsame

29. Dr. ‘Abdi’asiis Nuur Hersi

30. Mire ‘Olaad ‘Awaale

31. Baashi ‘Ali Jaama

32. Dr. ‘Abdi Sheekh Aadan

33. Hersi Haaji Jaama’

34. ‘Abdulqaadir Haashi ‘Igaal Dholo-dholo

35. Aadan ‘Umar

36. Dr. ‘Abdirahmaan ‘ilmi ‘Igaal

37. ‘Abdulaahi ‘Umar Bootaan

38. Mahamed Si’iid ‘Iyow Gentelman

39. Mahamed Diirriye

40. Dr. Sheekh ‘Ali Mahamuud

41. Haaji ‘Ali Geeddi Shirdoon

42. Khaliif Jaama’

43. Dr. Muumin ‘Umar Ahmed

44. Yuusuf Jaama’

45. Dr. Ahmed Mahamed Darmaan

46. ‘Abdi Haaji Yuusuf Shulu’

47. Haaji Ahmed Raage ‘Abdi

48. ‘Abdi Bullaale

49. Inj. ‘Abdulqaadir Aadan ‘Abdulle

50. Ahmed Ismaa’iil Boqor

51. ‘Abdulqaadir Iimaan Aadan

52. Mahamuud Haaji ‘Abdulaahi Qore

53. Hasan Haaji Mahamed

54. Dr. Mahamuud Muhumed Huseen

55. ‘Abdulaahi Haaji Yuusuf ‘Igaal

56. Dr. ‘Abdi Mahamuud Mahamed

57. Jibrill Hasan Mahamed

58. Mahamuud Geeddi Mahamuud

59. Mahamed ‘Ali Haashi

60. Ahmed ‘llmi ‘Ismaan

62. Huseen Ahmed ‘Abdulle

63. Ibraahim Rooble Warfaa

64. Faarah Warsame ‘Ismaan

65. Ahmaday Sheekh Qaasim

66. ‘Ali Iimaan Gadaw

67. Sheekh ‘Abdirashild Sheekh ‘Ali Suufi

68. ‘Ali Mahamed Osbite

69. ‘Abdulaahi Faarah Hoolif

70. Haaji Mahamuud Koogaar

71. Hasan Barre

72. Hasan Guureeye Kaarshe

73. Dr. ‘Abdulqaadir Mahamed Abuukar

74. Mohamed Jaama’ Geyre

75. Dubad Sugelle Mohamuud

76. Haaji M. ‘Awaale Liibaan

77. Jaama”Ali Jaama’

78. Mhamaed Yuusuf Faarah

79. Yaasiin Guure ‘Ali

80. Mahamed ‘Umar Jaama’

81. ‘Abdullaahi ‘Iise yuusuf

82. Mahamed Sa’iid Ismaa’iil

83. Beeldaaje ‘Ali Nuur Faarah “Bin Ja’eyl

84. ‘Abdi Muhumud Aanin

85. Ahmed ‘Abdi Daahir “Shell”

86. Mire’Ali ‘Ismaan

87. Abshir Kaahiye Faarah

88. Haareey Qaasim Weheliye

89. ‘Ali Muhumed Guuleed

90. Haaji Mahamed ‘Abdulle Furre

91. ‘Ali Mahamed ibraahim

92. Ahmed Sheekh Muhumed

93. ‘Ali ‘Alas Faarey

94. ‘Abdi Muhumed Khayre

95. Haaji Ahmed Haaji Mahamed

96. ‘Abdulaahi Huseen Maajoor

97. Salaad ‘Ali Diini

98. Sheekh Abuukar Ma’allin ‘Ali

99. ‘Abdirashid Mohamud

100. Hasan ‘Anshur Mohamed

101. ‘Abdullahi Mahamud Matukade

102. Sa’iid ‘Usmaan Keynadiid

103. Mahamed Haaji ‘Umar

104. ‘Umar Mahamed Guuled

105. Haaji Ahmed ‘Ali Islaweyn

106. Haaji Faarah ‘Usmaan

107. Muuse Yuusuf ‘Ali

108. ‘Abdihamiid Islaan Faarah

109. Faarah Osman Shiwaar

110. ‘Abdirahmaan Sheekh Nuur

 

[Bahal]

I just said that Gutaale can burn in hell for applying "Marehan/Barre/Morgan tactics" on civilians. How am I denying anything?


I only said the truth, and that is this View attachment 12302View attachment 12303
Terrible acts committed by Barre on a large scale in Baidoa. May he burn in hell.

Gutaale was a loyal lieutenant of the Lion of Africa™.

Hussein Aideed occupied Baydhabo and the surrounding regions for nearly a decade before being dislodged by the Rahanweyn resistance, who were ironically allied with the USC prior to their trademark betrayal.

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

Let's say you're Aideed in 1991. You've just ousted an incredibly unpopular regime, you control nearly all of Somalia below Gaalkacyo, and you have the opportunity to reshape Somalia in your own image.

What would you do @Prince of Hobyo ?

Please answer seriously.

Try to replace Siyaad Barre as dictator, start a civil war within my organization when members vote for my political rival, destroy my clan's biggest city, take food aid from starving people and sell it back to them, kill tens of thousands from my own clan over the next 4 years, get shot by my own child soldiers, die from a treatable wound because I have made all doctors into refugees.

 

[Lord Flacko]

@Thegoodshepherd one of the signatories of the Mogadishu Manifesto was Sa'iid Osman Kenadid.

I don't know if he was one of the 50 signatories who were sentenced to death for the petition though.

To everyone, read the whole thing. It's an important part of Somali history

 

[Bahal]

Where were these patriots after the fall of the regime?



Why didn't Aideed let them run the show? Is it because they were part and parcel of the USC and other jabhads that balkanized Somalia?

 

[Bahal]

Try to replace Siyaad Barre as dictator, start a civil war within my organization when members vote for my political rival, destroy my clan's biggest city, take food aid from starving people and sell it back to them, kill tens of thousands from my own clan over the next 4 years, get shot by my own child soldiers, die from a treatable wound because I have made all doctors into refugees.

Wallahi you gotta give credit to the SNM. They saw the catastrophe coming from a mile away and
as fast as humanly possible.

 

[Lord Flacko]

Where were these patriots after the fall of the regime?



Why didn't Aideed let them run the show? Is it because they were part and parcel of the USC and other jabhads that balkanized Somalia?

Read the document you little shit. Nobody enjoyed Barre.

Don't try to disrespect their name. The people on that list did more good for Somalia than Barre. Some were the founding fathers of Somalia and ex-SYL members

 

[Bahal]

Read the document you little shit. Nobody enjoyed Barre.

Don't try to disrespect their name. The people on that list did more good for Somalia than Barre. Some were the founding fathers of Somalia and ex-SYL members

Answer the question.

Where were these patriots after the fall of the regime?

Why didn't Aideed let them run the show? Is it because they were part and parcel of the USC and other jabhads that balkanized Somalia?

Also, you said you would execute Barre and the rest of the regime. What would you do next? Put the names of your allies into a hat and pick one out to attack at random like the Lion of Africa™?

Btw, no need for personal attacks.

 

[Odeg]

"When I leave Somalia I will leave buildings but not people." Siyaad Barre

And now almost 27 years later this still ring true.

 

[McLovin]

Read the document you little shit. Nobody enjoyed Barre.

Don't try to disrespect their name. The people on that list did more good for Somalia than Barre. Some were the founding fathers of Somalia and ex-SYL members

Trust me if they had the full retrospect of what somalia turned into today I guarantee they would be having second thoughts of asking him to step down

 

[Lord Flacko]

Answer the question.

Where were these patriots after the fall of the regime?

Why didn't Aideed let them run the show? Is it because they were part and parcel of the USC and other jabhads that balkanized Somalia?

Also, you said you would execute Barre and the rest of the regime. What would you do next? Put the names of your allies into a hat and pick one out to attack at random like the Lion of Africa™?

Btw, no need for personal attacks.

Read the Manifesto. I don't have time for your silly hypotheticals that you only use to divert course of the discussion.


When will you admit Barre was absolutely shit? The funny thing is you've never actually tried to prove he wasn't a terrible leader, you've only gone on about everything else except him. I and everybody else see right through you.

 

[Bahal]

Trust me if they had the full retrospect of what somalia turned into today I guarantee they would be having second thoughts of asking him to step down

Haven't you heard, Somalia is doing so much better now



And yet paradoxically MSB destroyed Somalia



Not sure which one they're arguing now

 

[Bahal]

Read the Manifesto. I don't have time for your silly hypotheticals that you only use to divert course of the discussion.


When will you admit Barre was absolutely shit? The funny thing is you've never actually tried to prove he wasn't a terrible leader, you've only gone on about everything else except him. I and everybody else see right through you.

Wtf, I've stated time and time again MSB made critical errors that rightfully led to his downfall. In this very thread I said I'd probably fight against him.

What you don't seem to comprehend is that with the advantage of hindsight, Somalia has proven once and for all even a deeply flawed and repressive government is better than the anarchy that followed.

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

Wallahi you gotta give credit to the SNM. They saw the catastrophe coming from a mile away and
as fast as humanly possible.

SNM leaders knew that Aidiid was mentally unstable and acted accordingly. They worked with him until they achieved their objectives and they then bailed out. Anyone could have told you that disaster awaited if he replaced Siyaad Barre. The reason why Somalia totally collapsed was Aidiid's need for revenge and his attempts to exact it, and his refusal to accept the fact that his own people did not want a mentally unstable leader. Everything would have turned out differently had Ali Mahdi been allowed to rule unchallenged for a few years.

 

[Bahal]

I mean seriously, just look at this thread.

http://www.somalispot.com/threads/happy-26-january.18449/