Muslims, I need your input

[SuldaanGuled]

Oh ok, not centuries but many decades. Better? What is the state of women's rights in Somalia? Now whats the state of women's rights in Canada? What are the main differences between those places? Somalia is in a civil war, you may say. Ok, swap Somalia for Saudi Arabia.

War ninyahoow sii aan ku fahmsiyo waan garan laahay. Af ingriskayga miya jab jab ah mise adiga baa maskaxda laga yahay ?

If i were to ask you where do women's rights come from what would your answer be ? In your mind you already have a pre defined view of what women's right should be, now that view didn't simply arise from no where as you weren't born with it. It primarily came from the culture you were raised in and later on adopted as your own. When you make that comparison you are using your ideas and notions as the standard. It isn't a surprise which countries come up as the top.

Briefly would you care to tell us why canada is better with regards to women's rights ? make a list of the rights you consider to be the most important.

 

[AussieHustler]

Suldan

Sxb, when it comes to child brides and slave owning whom both were practiced by Mohamed, the Muslim argument reverts back to time and place, that his actions corresponded the cultural norms of that era and place. If the Koran and the teachings of Mohamed are timeless and are suitable for any era and Allah is an omniscience that could see that Muslims would one day find both acts to be immoral and disgusting, then it would have been banned immediately and Mohamed would have issued a warning. But, he didn't know the future Muslims would find such acts abhorrent and he never had a crystal ball to see their evolving cultural norms. After all, Muslims consider Mohamed's actions as Sunnah and the only ones left following the above tenants are terrorists like ISIS, ALQAEDA, BOKO HARAM and ALSHABAB. Other Muslims were emancipated from practicing such vile acts. I consider Mohamed as a social revolutionary who has suggested many noble improvements to lift human morals and spirit during his era, but was there Allah who is omniscient and commanded him? No. All leaders had fallacies too. His was marrying a child, trading and owning in slaves, encouraging the rape of slaves and etc. It could only be understood from that perspective.

 

[axmedxajiisback]

War ninyahoow sii aan ku fahmsiyo waan garan laahay. Af ingriskayga miya jab jab ah mise adiga baa maskaxda laga yahay ?

If i were to ask you where do women's rights come from what would your answer be ? In your mind you already have a pre defined view of what women's right should be, now that view didn't simply arise from no where as you weren't born with it. It primarily came from the culture you were raised in and later on adopted as your own. When you make that comparison you are using your ideas and notions as the standard. It isn't a surprise which countries come up as the top.

Briefly would you care to tell us why canada is better with regards to women's rights ? make a list of the rights you consider to be the most important.

Where do women's rights come from? Rational people who value the dignity of other humans and wouldn't arbitrarily make their testimony half a mans. Muhammad said women are deficient. That's completely arbitrary and objectively wrong. Furthermore, societies that give women rights are objectively better off.

 

[AussieHustler]

Where do women's rights come from? Rational people who value the dignity of other humans and wouldn't arbitrarily make their testimony half a mans. Muhammad said women are deficient. That's completely arbitrary and objectively wrong. Furthermore, societies that give women rights are objectively better off.

axmed

Look sxb, in discussing Mohamed one has to judge him what he has done during his era and based on that, he made major reforms towards women rights. But you have a point in asking, would all of Mohamed's legislations towards "liberating" women in 7th century Arabian customs pass the litmus test if one would apply to contemporary society? No, it will be a society like the Talibans or living under Alshabab. During the 7th Century in Arabia, Mohamed pioneered the eradication of female infanticide and encouraged brides to be paid the dowry and not to their fathers. These could be viewed as major steps towards empowering women at that era. Does anyone know how we Somalis treated our women 2-3 centuries ago?

 

[Inquisitive_]

This is a classic example why I regard these conformist people as intellectually inferior and morally bankrupt, they cannot even agree on a standard age of consent among themselves or even from state to state, let's look at Europe 21st century snow flake standards.

Just take a look at the wild variations here, there are no principles nor standards to go by other then quackademic whims and desires which varies from country to country, I can be a Paedophile in Britain but perfectly legal across the channel in France.

God Forbid if you make it happen in hot Spain at 13 years old (people mature quicker in hotter climates) you will be considered a Paedophile in the whole of Europe, forget Spain even going across the channel to wales from England will leave you with the same ramifications.

These are the kinds of quackademic brainless conformist charlatans that have the nerve to engage you in these types of topics for which they have no leg to stand on, no guiding unison principles they can agree on, no science, not even a quote from Monkey God Darwin to strengthen their views, just the usual emotional brainless donkey wailing.

 

[axmedxajiisback]

Where do women's rights come from? Rational people who value the dignity of other humans and wouldn't arbitrarily make their testimony half a mans. Muhammad said women are deficient. That's completely arbitrary and objectively wrong. Furthermore, societies that give women rights are objectively better off.

axmed

Look sxb, in discussing Mohamed one has to judge him what he has done during his era and based on that, he made major reforms towards women rights. But you have a point in asking, would all of Mohamed's legislations towards "liberating" women in 7th century Arabian customs pass the litmus test if one would apply to contemporary society? No, it will be a society like the Talibans or living under Alshabab. During the 7th Century in Arabia, Mohamed pioneered the eradication of female infanticide and encouraged brides to be paid the dowry and not to their fathers. These could be viewed as major steps towards empowering women at that era. Does anyone know how we Somalis treated our women 2-3 centuries ago?

Wtf is your point? Muslims don't see it that way but rather they see it as eternal guidance.

No I don't know how we Somalis treated women 3 centuries ago but I imagine it was shitty. I wouldn't listen to a Somali from that era, which is what muslims do with muhammad.

 

[AussieHustler]

Wtf is your point? Muslims don't see it that way but rather they see it as eternal guidance.

No I don't know how we Somalis treated women 3 centuries ago but I imagine it was shitty. I wouldn't listen to a Somali from that era, which is what muslims do with muhammad.

axmed

continue your jihad with rage brother.

 

[axmedxajiisback]

axmed

continue your jihad with rage brother.

My argument is not that muhammad was bad on women's rights compared to us (although he was). Its that people should understand his context as a 7th century merchant and not a divinely sent prophet for all time.

 

[axmedxajiisback]

This is a classic example why I regard these conformist people as intellectually inferior and morally bankrupt, they cannot even agree on a standard age of consent among themselves or even from state to state, let's look at Europe 21st century snow flake standards.

Just take a look at the wild variations here, there are no principles nor standards to go by other then quackademic whims and desires which varies from country to country, I can be a Paedophile in Britain but perfectly legal across the channel in France.

God Forbid if you make it happen in hot Spain at 13 years old (people mature quicker in hotter climates) you will be considered a Paedophile in the whole of Europe, forget Spain even going across the channel to wales from England will leave you with the same ramifications.

These are the kinds of quackademic brainless conformist charlatans that have the nerve to engage you in these types of topics for which they have no leg to stand on, no guiding unison principles they can agree on, no science, not even a quote from Monkey God Darwin to strengthen their views, just the usual emotional brainless donkey wailing.

Morality is NOT subjective. It can be measured and it has been measured over the decades. Yes, women's rights is a western concept but it's a fruitful concept. The countries that decided to grant women's rights and prohibit child marriage have benefited from that decision. Look at the countries on that map you posted and tell me what they have in common that they don't share with Muslim countries.

I use logic and reason. You on the other hand conform to 7th century barbarism and refuse to change no matter what.

 

[Inquisitive_]

Morality is NOT subjective. It can be measured and it has been measured over the decades. Yes, women's rights is a western concept but it's a fruitful concept. The countries that decided to grant women's rights and prohibit child marriage have benefited from that decision. Look at the countries on that map you posted and tell me what they have in common that they don't share with Muslim countries.

I use logic and reason. You on the other hand conform to 7th century barbarism and refuse to change no matter what.

Are you really that thick? How many years have you been drinking fluoridated water for? are you that stupid to grasp the simple fact that within Europe itself as demonstrated by the map regarding "the age of consent" they differ drastically as to what 'child bride' is?

What is considered legal age for marriage in one country is considered 'child bride' and paedophile in the neighbouring country that will land you in jail, the lowest age of consent is "13" and it goes as high as "18" and that's in Europe alone.

The same story in America/Japan/China/Russia etc. each coming up with their own arbitrary value disregarding the maturity of the women entirely with no scientific bases whatsoever other then mere whims and desires (hence the drastic differences in age of consent)

What prohibition of 'child marriage' are you talking about you moron? each country has it's own definition that will land you in jail in the other.

 

[axmedxajiisback]

Are you really that thick? How many years have you been drinking fluoridated water for? are you that stupid to grasp the simple fact that within Europe itself as demonstrated by the map regarding "the age of consent" they differ drastically as to what 'child bride' is?

What is considered legal age for marriage in one country is considered 'child bride' and paedophile in the neighbouring country that will land you in jail, the lowest age of consent is "13" and it goes as high as "18" and that's in Europe alone.

The same story in America/Japan/China/Russia etc. each coming up with their own arbitrary value disregarding the maturity of the women entirely with no scientific bases whatsoever other then mere whims and desires (hence the drastic differences in age of consent)

What prohibition of 'child marriage' are you talking about you moron? each country has it's own definition that will land you in jail in the other.

 

[Madara x]

You're an idiot.

The prophet and his messages are supposed to be timeless.

His message and Sunnah were for mankind until the end.

The logic is so simple a child would easily grasp it. Either:

(a) His actions/sunnah and message are not timeless.

(b) Or his actions/sunnah and message are timeless.


If (a), then Islam expired; if (b), then paedophilia is OK.


Make your choice carefully. One... two... three... Go.

lool this is a good one. I'll keep it in mind.

Now go worship the devil.

 

[Naissur]

lool this is a good one. I'll keep it in mind.

Now go worship the devil.

Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

 

[Madara x]

Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

But what if heaven and hell are actually on earth?

What if this is, the after-life?

Who, then, is god? And who is the devil?

 

[axmedxajiisback]

But what if heaven and hell are actually on earth?

What if this is, the after-life?

Who, then, is god? And who is the devil?

God is Muhammad's errand boy and the devil is the imaginary dude that warns you of Muhammad's fraud. He's a good guy in disguise

 

[Madara x]

God is Muhammad's errand boy and the devil is the imaginary dude that warns you of Muhammad's fraud. He's a good guy in disguise

You lost it. Istakfuralllah.

How about this? Heaven is Europe, hell is Africa. God is white and the devil is black.

And voila, we've just inserted a racial lens into a religious conversation.

But you haven't been initiated yet into such inter-disciplinary discussions . . . eh

 

[axmedxajiisback]

You lost it. Istakfuralllah.

How about this? Heaven is Europe, hell is Africa. God is white and the devil is black.

And voila, we've just inserted a racial lens into a religious conversation.

But you haven't been initiated yet into such inter-disciplinary discussions . . . eh

What on earth are you talking about? God does what Muhammad wants and the devil is the boogy man who's against god and Muhammad. The devil is the original civil rights activist and we should honor him for that.

 

[Madara x]

What on earth are you talking about? God does what Muhammad wants and the devil is the boogy man who's against god and Muhammad. The devil is the original civil rights activist and we should honor him for that.

Leave god and prophet Muhammad (pbuh) alone.

And answer this, if this was the after-life, how would know that it is the after-life?

 

[axmedxajiisback]

Leave god and prophet Muhammad (pbuh) alone.

And answer this, if this was the after-life, how would know that it is the after-life?

Well, I don't recall having died. Doesn't the afterlife come when you pass?

 

[Madara x]

Well, I don't recall having died. Doesn't the afterlife come when you pass?

Lets say that you were born dead.
You were born into death.
A dead baby, yes that is what you were at birth.