Curious, was Mohammed Ramadan’s deceased father an ethnic Nubian or just a Sa’idi? Sometimes it’s hard to tell the two from each other.
Reconstruction of our Paleolithic ancestors
- Thread starter Al-Ma'mun
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Curious, was Mohammed Ramadan’s deceased father an ethnic Nubian or just a Sa’idi? Sometimes it’s hard to tell the two from each other.I honestly wonder how would the reconstruction of Mota look like.
@tariq moses
A question: Why would you portray the Kiffians as the ancestors of IBM, wouldn’t it be the other way around (Kiffians being a more admixed IBM)? Also, I thought the 2018 study proved that IBM’s African side was actually a local N.African component?
@tariq moses
A question: Why would you portray the Kiffians as the ancestors of IBM, wouldn’t it be the other way around (Kiffians being a more admixed IBM)? Also, I thought the 2018 study proved that IBM’s African side was actually a local N.African component?
@tariq moses Sorry, it was a question I was about to ask @Al-Ma'mun but erroneously directed at you. Just ignore that, man.
@Qeelbax
This is another photo of Ramadan’s father (a tailor). Normally how do you tell a Sa’idi from Nubian?
I have even spotted Coptic old men with this type of face.
Perhaps these faces represent the Non-Nilotic and non-Horn-HG ancestors of Somali and other Horn Africans.
@Qeelbax
This is another photo of Ramadan’s father (a tailor). Normally how do you tell a Sa’idi from Nubian?
I have even spotted Coptic old men with this type of face.Perhaps these faces represent the Non-Nilotic and non-Horn-HG ancestors of Somali and other Horn Africans.
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This is the alternate version. Capsians are related to Iberomaurusians (probably the same or more Eurasian shifted genetically).
Iberomaurusians do not carry the allele associated with light skin pigmentation. However if I have to take a guess
, well, I’d say at most they would be as dark as this man below
A Saharawi old man.
By K1a, he's talking about maternal haplogroup, not paternal, it has nothing to do with the paternal T.
Can you cite these studies? Any idea where I can find?
This paper used Late period Egyptians, who are rich in EEF and Iranian ancestry.
Chad Genetic Diversity Reveals an African History Marked by Multiple Holocene Eurasian Migrations
Understanding human genetic diversity in Africa is important for interpreting the evolution of all humans, yet vast regions in Africa, such as Chad, r…
Ancient DNA Reveals a Multi-Step Spread of the First Herders into Sub-Saharan Africa - PMC
How food production first entered eastern Africa ~5000 years ago and the extent to which people moved with livestock is unclear. We present genome-wide data from 41 individuals associated with Later Stone Age, Pastoral Neolithic (PN), and Iron Age ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
The f4 stats shows some of the remains prefer Sardinians(rich in EEF) over Bedouins(rich in Natufian)
In this they use Anatolia Neolithic which is EEF/ANF, and Minoans who are rich in EEF.
qpAdm runs show Somalis need an EEF source:
Somali qpAdm models using new ancient genomes
So, I asked David over at Eurogenes to run Somalis as a mixture between South Sudanese people and Natufians in order to see how well the...
anthromadness.blogspot.com
The first study pre-dated the release of the IBM samples and doesn't even include the Natufians in their and Awale's article pre-dates the release of the IBM/Taforalt samples.Nice try there Gebrehaile selassie left over of musollini,the tigray front is awaiting for you.This paper used Late period Egyptians, who are rich in EEF and Iranian ancestry.
Here they used LBK, a straight EEF genome. They also used Sardinians, out of all populations today, they have the highest amounts of EEF.Chad Genetic Diversity Reveals an African History Marked by Multiple Holocene Eurasian Migrations
Understanding human genetic diversity in Africa is important for interpreting the evolution of all humans, yet vast regions in Africa, such as Chad, r…www.sciencedirect.com
Here they use Chalcolithic Israel to model the Pastoral Neolithic genomes, they do the same below...Ancient DNA Reveals a Multi-Step Spread of the First Herders into Sub-Saharan Africa - PMC
How food production first entered eastern Africa ~5000 years ago and the extent to which people moved with livestock is unclear. We present genome-wide data from 41 individuals associated with Later Stone Age, Pastoral Neolithic (PN), and Iron Age ...
The f4 stats shows some of the remains prefer Sardinians(rich in EEF) over Bedouins(rich in Natufian)
In this they use Anatolia Neolithic which is EEF/ANF, and Minoans who are rich in EEF.
qpAdm runs show Somalis need an EEF source:
Somali qpAdm models using new ancient genomes
So, I asked David over at Eurogenes to run Somalis as a mixture between South Sudanese people and Natufians in order to see how well the...
Somalis (not heavily Semitic Habeshas) mainly derive our "Eurasian" ancestry from NE Africa.The ANA ancestry was probably a continuum that got weaker the more east you get in Northern Africa untill you reach the Levant.It is clear Somalis (and the proto-cushites) derived majority of our ancestry from NE African HG turned cattle herders who probably had more ANA (IBM-like) ancestry than the Natufians but not as nearly as much as the IBM (who were 40-50% ANA)
The Sahrawi old man probably has SSA ancestry..The pure Southern Maghrebis are just as light on average as the coastal Maghrebis, they just have more SSA outliers and a more harsh lifestyle
Really? What gave that away, his lips I presume?
Yeah it makes sense those living in the Sahara would acquire more “recent SSA admixture”.
Although regarding the southern magrehbis I cannot be sure as most Tuaraeg images I found on the internet have them looking extremely SSA-shifted.
Btw, if you have to take a guess, is Ramadan’s dad a Sa’idi or ethnic Nubian?
Those are the low-caste Tuaregs the high caste ones are regular Maghrebis with elevated SSA ancestry.Here are the results of a Tuareg High Caste and the Beidan high caste Arab of Mauritania
| Target: Berber_Mali_Tuareg Distance: 5.0286% / 0.05028561 | |
|---|---|
| 83.2 | NW_African |
| 16.8 | SSA |
| Target: Mauritanian_Beidan Distance: 1.9124% / 0.01912447 | |
|---|---|
| 91.6 | NW_African |
| 6.2 | SSA |
| 2.2 | Arabian |
That was a bad fit for the Tuareg, it needs additional IBM...
Perhaps this additional IBM-like ancestry found in Tuaregs is from Saharan groups that have a lot of ancestry from this Mali HG:
| Target: Berber_Mali_Tuareg Distance: 1.9511% / 0.01951145 | |
|---|---|
| 67.2 | NW_African |
| 20.4 | Morocco_UP_Taforalt_(Iberomaurusian) |
| 12.4 | SSA |
Perhaps this additional IBM-like ancestry found in Tuaregs is from Saharan groups that have a lot of ancestry from this Mali HG:
So, does this mean Kiffians would plot more or less around the position of Taforalt IBMs on a PCA?
Now that we talk about Kiffians I honestly wonder what happened to them. I searched the wiki and it wrote that Tenerians were demographically dominant in that area after the absence of Kiffians. But HGs always search for new lands so who knows, maybe some of their remnants were absorbed by the newer, more Eurasian shifted Maghrebis like KEBs and IAMs.
Eburrans were a peculiar group as well, I remember seeing their morphologically “caucasoid” skulls (an old picture/sketch). But they apparently lived near Rift Valley.
Now that we talk about Kiffians I honestly wonder what happened to them. I searched the wiki and it wrote that Tenerians were demographically dominant in that area after the absence of Kiffians. But HGs always search for new lands so who knows, maybe some of their remnants were absorbed by the newer, more Eurasian shifted Maghrebis like KEBs and IAMs.
Eburrans were a peculiar group as well, I remember seeing their morphologically “caucasoid” skulls (an old picture/sketch). But they apparently lived near Rift Valley.
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Just finished the thing. Thanks, it answers a lot of my questions regarding the two populations. The guy’s voice was pretty soothing as well.
Btw, may I ask what’s your take on the Eburrans? Do you think they were ENP-like or IBM-like?
^If I may….
Natufians are considered gracile. Large portions of Eurasian-like ancestry found in modern Horn Africans would be Natufian-like.
Iberomaurusian-related individuals (Kiffians, Tenerians) are robust but Northeast Africans carry little of that in their gene pool.
Sexual selection is also imo a viable option as the SSA side of Horn Africans is mostly proto-Nilotic like. They by all means were robust individuals (described as much more robust compared to post-Holocene lower Nubians).
So perhaps the ancestors of modern Horn Africans sexually selected more Natufian/Al-Khiday-like facial features when they entered the horn, or maybe living in arid areas (Red Sea coast, highlands) did the trick too.
Natufians are considered gracile. Large portions of Eurasian-like ancestry found in modern Horn Africans would be Natufian-like.
Iberomaurusian-related individuals (Kiffians, Tenerians) are robust but Northeast Africans carry little of that in their gene pool.
Sexual selection is also imo a viable option as the SSA side of Horn Africans is mostly proto-Nilotic like. They by all means were robust individuals (described as much more robust compared to post-Holocene lower Nubians).
So perhaps the ancestors of modern Horn Africans sexually selected more Natufian/Al-Khiday-like facial features when they entered the horn, or maybe living in arid areas (Red Sea coast, highlands) did the trick too.
Toubou look very Eurasian almost somali lookingThe Mali HG (probably genetically related to Maghrebi Taforalt with SSA admix) possible ancestors of the IBM heavy modern populations like the Tobou,Zaghawa & Fulanis perhaps
Are you an cad cad yemeni? Cause if you aren't there is no way you are banu hashim.
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