Somali claim over Galbeed is more legitimate than SLand + Taiwan is not similar to Sland

[Khaem]

Response from the other thread:

Why do you keep comparing Somaliland to Tawian, they are completely different cases.

And if you don't need recognition to develop Somaliland why is it 30+ years and you still celebrating the construction of a paved road.

Come back to me when Somaliland takes back Khatumo from Harti and you finally build those ports without selling your land.

Meanwhile we in Djibouti finna keep rising until we join with our Somali brothers to pack Habashi and Khaleejis once for all

 

[Itsnotthateasy]

@Itsnotthateasy Man I lost count of how many times you got steam cooked, grilled and fried on this forum

It's impossible to count something that has never happened.

Raila Odinga is the front runner for AU chairperson. This is a big deal. Somaliland loading.

This forum every time it tries to dunk on me:

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

The case is legal and doesn't involve defacto control of territory so you don't even know the first thing about what you are talking about. There's zero case for Isaaq territory or Dhulbahante for that matter they ceased to be legal entities on Independence when the protection treaties expired. SL has borders on independence - a defined territory recognized in the AU charter. This is the starting point then you have principles like territorial intergrity which is the counter point to SL borders.

British Somaliland ceased to have any legal status when its democratically elected parliament voted to "forever" unite with Italian Somaliland. There is no going back from a "forever" union. It is ironclad.

The gov of Somalia combined Las Anod district with Garowe & Eil districts to form the Nugaal region. This shows that the Somali state no longer recognized any boundary between Italian and British Somalilands. This is quite important legally.

 

[Periplus]

I would agree Taiwan has a better case than Somaliland but Somaliland still has one of the best cases in the world. Definitely the best case in Africa.

Puntland has little no to case so that's just a junk argument.

Puntland was actually a sovereign monarchy prior to independence. It had a civil service, military, defined borders and diplomatic corps as well as the ability to enter multilateral agreements.

Somaliland in 1960 did not meet all of those criteria…

 

[Som]

I actually have a real country but whenever people ask what I am I always say Somali. When I lived in Djibouti for 2 years we called ourselves Somali.

So imagine my surprise when I come on the internet and see these secessionists trying to distance themselves from Somali.

That's why I respect Djiboutians. Even as a pansomalist I can accept that we may be divided in different countries, what I'll never understand is the rejection of somaliness.

 

[Maakhri from dhahar]

The case is legal and doesn't involve defacto control of territory so you don't even know the first thing about what you are talking about. There's zero case for Isaaq territory or Dhulbahante for that matter they ceased to be legal entities on Independence when the protection treaties expired. SL has borders on independence - a defined territory recognized in the AU charter. This is the starting point then you have principles like territorial intergrity which is the counter point to SL borders.

Once British Somaliland was divorced from the British (no longer under British protection) ,
British Somaliland legally married to Italian Somaliland (unification).

What used to be called British Somaliland was legally dissolved after the marriage with Italian Somaliland (unification) .

After the marriage (unification), British Somaliland and Italian Somaliland no longer existed.

So according to international/Islamic law, once you are officially married,
You do not have the right to establish another relationship or separate from your current spouse (Somalia) unless you obtain divorce papers from your current spouse (Somalia).
Very simple .

 

[Idilinaa]

Why do you keep comparing Somaliland to Tawian, they are completely different cases.

And if you don't need recognition to develop Somaliland why is it 30+ years and you still celebrating the construction of a paved road.

Come back to me when Somaliland takes back Khatumo from Harti and you finally build those ports without selling your land.

Meanwhile we in Djibouti finna keep rising until we join with our Somali brothers to pack Habashi and Khaleejis once for all

You are right it's not comparable to Taiwan in terms of their history. Somaliland unlike Taiwan for example witnessed a devastating civil war that destroyed its two major cities

Alongside rebuilding from that carnage, the destructions of lands and properities, insitutions, it had to build up from scratch governmental institutions, basic services and stabilize the region enough for it to be developed and generate revenue sources without much help and that takes many years. Being in a volatile region made it difficult to attracted investors as well.

And it's not just paved roads (what i linked was major highways that stretch several miles in different direction to different towns connecting trade)

or simple Xafaad urban infrastracture, it's also building manufacturing plants/factories

Somaliland Cement Factories

2 cement factories anounced so far 2 different models of financing 1 Ground up 1 Rehabilitation Part of MSG Group of Companies, which is a composite organisation with its subsidiaries specialising in the following fields: Manufacturing of tobacco-based products, Telecommunications &...

www.somalispot.com

Kaabsan Batching Plant | Somaliland's First Batching Plant

kaabsan.com

And isn't just building a port, its expanding its capacity to faciliatate economic growth thats why they are building out an economic zone

The point i was making that it is that Somaliland is able to make these developments without recognition and Taiwan is also another proof. So the recognition seeking is not needed and is potentially destabilizing and sovereignity breach. Taiwan knows wisely the mintute they declare outright independence that stability will collapse and they might even lose their sovereignity with China and the US fighting over it, there will also be fight between different fractions within Taiwan as well.


The most important part to any development from happening is the need for stability and keeping that stability is the most important thing. Another example is Ogaden/Galbeed.

The last 5 years Somali Region of Ethiopia has been an oasis of peace and stability, especially since like you mentioned there is war in other parts of ethiopia.

Five years on: a region of stability in Ethiopia | Conciliation Resources

Five years ago, on 21 October 2018, the Government of Ethiopia and the Ogaden National Liberation Front (ONLF) signed the Asmara Peace Deal - an historic occasion marking the end of over 30 years of armed conflict in the Somali Regional State of Ethiopia (SRS). But a peace deal isn’t an...

www.c-r.org

“When you transition from a position of war and conflict to democracy, it’s not an easy road. We will struggle and fight for our rights through peaceful means. We will be active participants in the politics of this country.”

“There is a freedom of speech now. People can talk freely without fearing any interference from the government. They can criticise the government itself or the opposition leaders or they can talk about different aspects of life, whether it is a social thing or a political thing. People have the freedom to express themselves and bring their ideas to the table.”

This has lead to major progress being made , i posted about this in another thread:
Look through it

SOMALI REGION - Somali Region + Babiile Pictures & Videos

https://www.facebook.com/share/v/1AD3mHade4edifne/ Erer valley is breathtakingly beautifull

www.somalispot.com

 

[Idilinaa]

If Somalis across all 5 regions focus on mutual co-operation , integration, institution building , freedom of movement, security and economic development rather than political squabble over territorial control, qabil representation, or recognition it will be a good thing.

This is what the current mission should be about , both in the diaspora and back home.

 

[Itsnotthateasy]

British Somaliland ceased to have any legal status when its democratically elected parliament voted to "forever" unite with Italian Somaliland. There is no going back from a "forever" union. It is ironclad.

The gov of Somalia combined Las Anod district with Garowe & Eil districts to form the Nugaal region. This shows that the Somali state no longer recognized any boundary between Italian and British Somalilands. This is quite important legally.

View attachment 333631

Definitely not Iron clad and open interpretation, so let's leave that to the lawyers. A Barrister, later turned Judge wrote:

Puntland fake state advocates need to back off, you are not in the conversation.

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

Cotran makes it clear that all issues were resolved by the Jan 31 1961 Act of Union and the June 20th 1961 passage of the Somali Constitution. It is moot.

This uncertainty as to the precise legal effect of these legislative instruments led the Somali Government, in order to remove any doubt, to pass a new Act in accordance with Article 60 of the Constitution. This law, entitled the " Act of Union " was adopted by the National Assembly by acclamation on January 18, 1961, and was promulgated on January 31, 1961. However, the Act is deemed to have come into operation on July 1, 1960 (Article 10).

The position has now therefore been clarified, and although it may still be necessary to examine the previous enactments for certain matters, the two important instruments setting up the union and the new Somali State are the Act of Union (deemed to have come into effect on July 1, 1960) and the Constitution of the Somali Republic of July 1, 1960.

Article III (1) of the Transitional and Final Provisions of this Constitution provided that the Constitution was to be submitted to a popular referendum within one year. The result of the referendum, which was held on June 20, 1961, showed an over- whelming majority in favour of the Constituti

 

[Haragwaafi]

Taiwan is completely different from Somaliland.

The government who rules Taiwan claims that they are the sole government of China and hold claim to all these lands:

View attachment 333597

The Taiwanese government is the same government that fought and lost the civil war agaisnt the communist CCP that rules China today. The Nationalist KMT party fled mainland China and set up in Taiwan.

The Taiwanese government was actually the ones who sat as the representative for China in the United nations and was actually in the 5 permanent members of the security council along with the Soviets, USA, UK and France until the Chinese ccp became recognised as the sole China by the United nation in 1971.


Taiwan's official name is The Republic of China. This is why the ccp in Beijing is so focused on invading Taiwan.

And even so, Taiwan isn't even fully recognised by these countries and even thr United States doesn't call them a country nor explicitly states they're Chinese. They're in this weird state of limbo.

The only reason Taiwan remains relevant is due to their Semi conductor industry making Taiwan one of the most important country in the world as its one of the few that produces semi conductors at such a level.

Meanwhile, Somaliland is merely another african shithole secessionist group trying to break away from Somalia. It's only claim to being a country is that it's borders were drawn in the Berlin conference of 1889 and the land was given to the British to set up a colony to protect shipping trade routes to their Indian colony that passes through the red sea to England.

It's government has no legitimacy, the Taiwanese government was the government of China during ww2 before being beaten by Mao in 1949.

It cannot challenge the authority of the internationally recognised government of Mogadishu which, as far as every country is concerned, rules all lands from Awdal to lower Juba.
View attachment 333595

As far as the international community is concerned, Somaliland, puntland ect. Are all just regional government of "autonomous states" within the country of Somalia

There is no question about this fact by every relevant question. The only country that tries to bend this fact is 4th world shothole called Ethiopia.

This doesn't matter to me as I was in Djibouti as a child watching niggas lift ethiopias food aid from the Port. Whatever Ethiopia does has no real affect. They're are 1 bad harvest away from state collapse and currently have civil wars and genocides that were only calmed down a few years ago.

View attachment 333596

If you go to maps you will see a dotted line between Somalia and Ethiopia, this is due to the disputed border between the two governments. The Somali claim to Galbeed is more legal than Somaliland or Puntland or any succession from states within Somalia.

Dotted lines exists because Ethiopians have different interpretation on the treaty signed by the old Ethiopian empire and the Italians before Mussolini invasion and ever since then there was no demarcation on the border as illiterates are ruling Xamar

 

[Khaem]

Dotted lines exists because Ethiopians have different interpretation on the treaty signed by the old Ethiopian empire and the Italians before Mussolini invasion and ever since then there was no demarcation on the border as illiterates are ruling Xamar

May I remind you Somalia never recognised the border. President Siad Barre only withdrew the troops form galbeed after the 77 war he never recognised that galbeed is official Ethiopian, only to peace.

 

[Haragwaafi]

Djibouti did try to unify with Somalia but many factors stopped this.

First the French and tbe Canfar collaborated with each other and also killed the independence activist in the 1960s.

Then after we gained independence we didn't because of course the French had and still have their Millitary bases in the country.

Even if we removed that factor, we gained independence after the 1969 revolution, the Djiboutian President Aptidon was a fierce anti-communist and hated Siad barre due to being a socialist.

I'd happily join Somalia, the borders are illegitimate to me. It's like Iraq-Sryia, or Albania-Kosovo. These borders were drawn by Colonialists.

The Canfar didn't care if you want to join Somalia or not what they wanted is there lands to split away and join Ethiopia as anti French rebel group led by Ahmed Dini was funded by Ethiopia and Gouled Aptidon in 1974 created or founded a pro independence party LPAI that united the Canfars and Somalis to achieve independence without the partition of the colony

 

[Haragwaafi]

May I remind you Somalia never recognised the border. President Siad Barre only withdrew the troops form galbeed after the 77 war he never recognised that galbeed is official Ethiopian, only to peace.

Somali Republic and Kacaan regime ofc didn't recognize the border during the 60 and 70s but the ones that are in power now recognize the Italian set up border before mussolin's invasion of Ethiopia in 1936 but Ethiopians have different interpretation on where the exact border is that's why there's dots on the map.

Afweyne in 1988 after normalizing relation with Mengistu he recognized the full soverginity of k5 to Ethiopia

 

[Khaem]

Somali Republic and Kacaan regime ofc didn't recognize the border during the 60 and 70s but the ones that are in power now recognize the Italian set up border before mussolin's invasion of Ethiopia in 1936 but Ethiopians have different interpretation on where the exact border is that's why there's dots on the map.

Afweyne in 1988 after normalizing relation with Mengistu he recognized the full soverginity of k5 to Ethiopia

Show sources for this

 

[Haragwaafi]

Show sources for this

They signed peace accord and ceased hostilities with Ethiopia withdrawing their forces from the border

 

[Khaem]

They signed peace accord and ceased hostilities with Ethiopia withdrawing their forces from the border

They signed peace and withdrew doesn't mean they officially recognise the border??

 

[Haragwaafi]

They signed peace and withdrew doesn't mean they officially recognise the border??

It means that which is why Ogadeens abandoned his regime and formed another rebel group SPM in the south led by the former military colonels belonging to that clan

 

[johnsepei5]

Taiwan is the biggest producer of semi conductor chips and is a global tech powerhouse with high HDI

wtf is somaliland

 

[Khaem]

Taiwan is the biggest producer of semi conductor chips and is a global tech powerhouse with high HDI

wtf is somaliland

Saar we waz british protectorate of somaliland we forced unite wid italia somalia 1960 they're darker and diff caltar to us northern somalilanders