The Case for Jubaland Independence

[Abaq]

The case is very simple, we never signed up to join Somalia Italiana. Unlike Mijertenia and the South which was conquered by conquest and colonised after being forced to sign the dotted line, or Somaliland which willingly joined Somalia Italiana, we never experienced either of those things.

This is the land the Ogaden Waamo Sultanate controlled in 1888, all the land between the Jubba and Tana rivers and down to the coast including the coastal towns of Lamu, Kismayo and in between:

We then signed an agreement of protection with the British in 1896 to make Jubaland (all the above territories including NEP and current Jubaland) a British Protectorate (indigenous self-governance to remain as per the terms of the agreement):

The British betrayed us and broke this agreement when it ceded Jubaland to Italy in 1925 (British kept NFD). The Italians forcefully added Jubaland to its Somalia Italiana colony (no more self-rule) even though it only controlled the Kismayo area. The British then betrayed us again by adding NFD to the Kenya colony after a few years.

Point between, the Waamo Ogaden sultanate was a sovereign entity that signed an agreement of protection with the British (it was never colonised), just like Thailand signed with the British. We never relinquished our sovereignty nor did we agree to our lands being partitioned, nor did we agree to join Somalia Italiana. All of that was forced on us ILLEGALLY.

We therefore have every right to leave the failed Somalia Italiana project just as the former British Protectorate of Somaliland has done (the mistake they made is they agreed to join Somalia Italiana).

 

[Galguduudguy]

Ngl, Somalia should just kick out Jubaland and Puntland. Can’t stand em. Don’t want em anymore. I wish them the best but the Somali government needs to progress and these man are just spoilers

 

[DR OSMAN]

If we all start this game it doesn't end well.

Majerteniya and Hobyo Kingdom were sovereign and even recognised by Italy who then flipped like a fascist mad man does and bombarded the Seat of Baargaal with a naval assault which is the first to happen on the continent by the way.

A huge war also happened in Hobyo sultanate after they turned on that Kingdom sovereignty.

Either way both subjects of either kingdom found themselves under colonial rule not so much North East or Central but inside Hamar. I saw the look of hopelessness and sorrow in Boqor Osman eyes as he was held in house arrest in Mogadishu.

PL didn't join Somalia willingly infact it was forced too thru violence and bloodshed. But once they found themselves there it spearheaded the SYL independence movement.

Darawish who themselves had a Territory even as far as Eyl could also technically reclaim those lands under Darawish. They were also bombed by the British airforce a first in the continent also. They didn't join SL willingly either.

Makhir Kingdom.was forcefully sacked and their sultan was held prisoner in Seychelles and their is a huge makhiri descendants still there. These guys didn't join SL willingly either.

As you said SL joined willingly Somalia which is a huge distinction to Harti clans who never did and felt like sovereign people.

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Abaq

There is one common theme if you see it or if u don't the Europeans especially Italy and UK but more so UK are not friendly to darod interests.

Look what they did to Ogadeniya and NFD and JL. Look at what they did to Makhir and Darawish. Look at what Italy did to Majerteniya and Hobyo.

We got a huge problem, since ww2 at least the British run the world either directly or thru great influence on the USA as a more experienced empire. That's why France and UK still hold onto veto seats in the UN, mainly due to their colonial footprint worldwide.

I am pretty certain we Darods are not on their preference list and its something we really need to change.

 

[RiceMuncher]

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Abaq

From our ancestor perspective they were semi right, they saw the shocking schools with hidden missionary objectives leading to noone going there and alot of resentment on cultural and religious genocide.

For that they were right as you can see how fucked up colonial areas are today, an identity less people is the worst possible scenario.

I think tho in 1950 trusteeship period they made a huge mistake, ww2 was over, they saw Italy fell in Europe war and Germany, yet they still chose the italians as trustees while they were preparing for self rule. I think that was very poor choices which I don't think the UK took lightly.

Maybe it was guided by the huge grief we had with the british, who knows why but it was a crazy decision either way.

The soviets were OK not that they had any preference for anyone in the region but they didn't pick n choose either like the west does and supported each equally and said may the best man win untill we found ourselves outside Addis Ababa and they called in their other communist allies like Cuba and South Yemen to save Ethiopia. After that they even said no.more and all ties were cut

They had bigger empire objectives we had regional objectives, they wanted this whole red sea lane under them or their loyal subjects. Either way they fell too in 89 after the Berlin breach by America and we also fell pretty quickly with them.

 

[TheLand]

Ngl, Somalia should just kick out Jubaland and Puntland. Can’t stand em. Don’t want em anymore. I wish them the best but the Somali government needs to progress and these man are just spoilers

What’s progress sxb, suicide nukes instead of car bombings?

 

[Galguduudguy]

What’s progress sxb, suicide nukes instead of car bombings?

I didn’t say it did progress. I’d advise you to learn to read. I’m saying I want progress.

if jokes about bombs entertain you the please understand we are not compatible for conversations.

 

[TheLand]

I didn’t say it did progress. I’d advise you to learn to read. I’m saying I want progress.

if jokes about bombs entertain you the please understand we are not compatible for conversations.

You claimed that PL and JL were a hinderance to progress. Please let me know what this progress is because all I see is bombings and assassinations.

 

[DR OSMAN]

You claimed that PL and JL were a hinderance to progress. Please let me know what this progress is because all I see is bombings and assassinations.

This is a common sentiment that Somalia problems start and end with darods, I'm not saying I agree but it's definitely in the hearts and minds of hawiye and isaaq leaders and the whole reason samaale coalition exists.

They assume thru a samaale inspired political landscape which is really two cities Mogadishu and hargeisa who will hold presidency titles and they name governors for the rest of the 90 districts lol. I know it's insane and outrageous but that's what they seek.

In between those radical goals, they resort to deny, deflect, distract, economic embargo, scholarship embargo, terrorism, and the great one is waa inoo shir kale which never concludes in anything tangible just buying more time

They also love transitional solutions like ku meel gaar, press releases, memorandum.of understanding nothing to serious or legal as long as it buys time for irir samaale goals.

 

[TheLand]

This is a common sentiment that Somalia problems start and end with darods, I'm not saying I agree but it's definitely in the hearts and minds of hawiye and isaaq leaders and the whole reason samaale coalition exists.

They assume thru a samaale inspired political landscape which is really two cities Mogadishu and hargeisa who will hold presidency titles and they name governors for the rest of the 90 districts lol. I know it's insane and outrageous but that's what they seek.

In between those radical goals, they resort to deny, deflect, distract, economic embargo, scholarship embargo, terrorism, and the great one is waa inoo shir kale which never concludes in anything tangible just buying more time

They also love transitional solutions like ku meel gaar, press releases, memorandum.of understanding nothing to serious or legal as long as it buys time for irir samaale goals.

Then they will cry that you are making light of their self-bombings

 

[DR OSMAN]

Then they will cry that you are making light of their self-bombings

Terrorism is a jambal also, all the bombing and suicide shit u see is just a way to keep the nation unstable enuff untill the samaale vision can be seen thru, as of yet its not possible and they know that so they resort to terrorism as one tactic among a range of tactics to buy time untill irir samaale can be achieved.

Other great tactics deployed never ending meetings that just conclude with ill see you another meeting. They also love press releases, memorandums, transitions, it's a great way to buy time for the ultimate glory of samaale.

The rest is horgals sent to other clans, stirring up rural conflicts so it can spread to clan level, economic and scholarship embargo. These are all tactics they wrote down on how to buy time untill samaale dream is fully seen.

It's like a religious thing that irir samaale dream, their all inside of it mentally and all bedazzled by it.

And this is me when I sniff or smell that wicked idealogy, these ppl r clearly not ready.

 

[Galguduudguy]

You claimed that PL and JL were a hinderance to progress. Please let me know what this progress is because all I see is bombings and assassinations.

Yes, they see things too differently. I don’t know why your playing victim when I’m saying I want you to be able to make your own decisions and us our own. You’ve failed on every level of comprehension. I hope you’ll reflect on this conversation and realise than not everyone from the south hates you. We just don’t want to factor you in to our decisions, just like you don’t want to accept Mogadishu’s decisions.

plus you find Muslims dying funny. Like it’s not even Puntland and Jubaland I want gone, it’s people like you. A Pakistani who values Muslim lives is more Somali to me than people like you

 

[TheLand]

Yes, they see things too differently. I don’t know why your playing victim when I’m saying I want you to be able to make your own decisions and us our own. You’ve failed on every level of comprehension. I hope you’ll reflect on this conversation and realise than not everyone from the south hates you. We just don’t want to factor you in to our decisions, just like you don’t want to accept Mogadishu’s decisions.

You are a clown. I asked you a simple question you keep dodging mooriyaan. What is the progress you claim JL and PL are a hinderance to? You know that they aren’t and it is you who are a hinderance, this is what you are trying to avoid. You are from Galguduud, one of the worst terrorist infested xaar-holes in Somalia. Pray tell, what is the progress going on there that PL/JL/SL or anyone else is hindering? Pathetic stuff sxb.

 

[TheLand]

Terrorism is a jambal also, all the bombing and suicide shit u see is just a way to keep the nation unstable enuff untill the samaale vision can be seen thru, as of yet its not possible and they know that so they resort to terrorism as one tactic among a range of tactics to buy time untill irir samaale can be achieved.

Other great tactics deployed never ending meetings that just conclude with ill see you another meeting. They also love press releases, memorandums, transitions, it's a great way to buy time for the ultimate glory of samaale.

The rest is horgals sent to other clans, stirring up rural conflicts so it can spread to clan level, economic and scholarship embargo. These are all tactics they wrote down on how to buy time untill samaale dream is fully seen.

It's like a religious thing that irir samaale dream, their all inside of it mentally and all bedazzled by it.

And this is me when I sniff or smell that wicked idealogy, these ppl r clearly not ready.

They aren’t serious about fighting terrorism because they are the terrorists. Remember a few years ago when Fiqi the mooriyaan of all people handed a bunch of HG terrorists over to PL to execute on behalf of GM? It was because even a tuug like him couldn’t trust them to get the job done. Then the HG like candhoweyne claimed that GM is just a maamul goboleed of PL because HG were being handed over to them to be executed for crimes committed in GM

 

[DR OSMAN]

@TheLand

Somalis know me, they don't dare test that shit on me, they know I'm like this

So they go and work their bullshit on naive people who think their actually ready when I fully know that's not the case nor will it be as long as the samaale crap isnt buried, burned, outlawed, anyone caught even near it given death penalties for causing social division and hatred.

When I see the conditions are right and their no games being played behind the scene, I'll be the first to say finally Somalia has moved on.

 

[Galguduudguy]

You are a clown. I asked you a simple question you keep dodging mooriyaan. What is the progress you claim JL and PL are a hinderance to? You know that they aren’t and it is you who are a hinderance, this is what you are trying to avoid. You are from Galguduud, one of the worst terrorist infested xaar-holes in Somalia. Pray tell, what is the progress going on there that PL/JL/SL or anyone else is hindering? Pathetic stuff sxb.

The constitution changes. I didn’t realise I need to spell it out. You know the thing they are disputing and hindering. Dumb ass

 

[TheLand]

The constitution changes. I didn’t realise I need to spell it out. You know the thing they are disputing and hindering. Dumb ass

That’s what you call progress? A dictatorship by your uncle? Caqli lix sac waxaas ka ahow yaa xayawaan

 

[Galguduudguy]

That’s what you call progress? A dictatorship by your uncle? Caqli lix sac waxaas ka ahow yaa xayawaan

That’s what I mean. You don’t have to see it my way. I just want a recognised sole government. I’d literally take the fat man from Djibouti, so long as power is centralised. I’d take Isaias. Nigga I’d take Kim jong un, so long as there is only one man who calls himself president that is progress. Undeniable.

I want my people to just accept someone. It’s been in over 30years

 

[DR OSMAN]

@TheLand

The biggest victims of irir samaale tend to be innocent victims of it who are usually hawiye or isaaq, don't blame them, it's that silly IOG who u should have alot of contempt for who only fuels it for his own self preservation goals as he knows its not realistic I mean 2 towns rulling 90 like wtf? he knows it won't happen but his assuming if Somalia can remain in conflict he benefits as he won't be overshadowed nor be scared of his own locals toppling him for a better system then what siyad barre taught him.

As for the people don't blame them, they are the biggest victims always thru terrorism and suicide bombings which is a tool to hold Somalia in the status quo untill samaale vision can happen.

The other soft tactics like never ending meetings, sending horgals, fuelling rural conflict so it can escalate to clan, economic and scholarship embargo, corruption are all ways to make Federalism appear unworkable, secondly it buys time for favorable conditions for irir samaale to emerge.

The sad thing rather then wasting 40 years and harming your own people because your leaders r chasing the harm of others, i see as careless leadership and totally low iq.