Why Do Some Muslims Deny Where Allah is?

[Garaad Awal]

Most Muslims do not even know what Ash’ari and Maturidi are, so applying the majority argument here is disingenuous.

At-Tirmidhi (2167) narrated from Ibn ‘Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “Allah will not cause my ummah to agree on falsehood; the hand of Allah is with the jamaa‘ah (the main body of the Muslims).” Classed as hasan by al-Albaani.

Ibn Abdulwahab’s Aqeedah is a tiny minority of the Ummah. Do you believe the entire Ummah for over a millenium was misguided?

 

[Omar del Sur]

The people you have cited mistranslate and misquote I will not rely on their word. We have the pure and correct manuscripts.

I posted the original Arabic from my copy of Al-Mazuni's sharh us sunnah (with the sharh of Sheikh Ubayd al-Jabri)! I posted the original Arabic. The translation was only given in case people couldn't read the Arabic. The Arabic is very clear and it was not a mistranslation.

 

[Omar del Sur]

I am amazed at the Ash'aris. A scholar who was a student of Imam Shafi'i- his aqeedah now is somehow "Wahhabism".

 

[daljirkadahsoon]

I am amazed at the Ash'aris. A scholar who was a student of Imam Shafi'i- his aqeedah now is somehow "Wahhabism".

I can quote to you from the Qur'an verbatim. That's the simplest way to settle this.

This eliminates the Wahabi position.

The Qur'an says that nothing is like Allah. Surah al Ikhlas is the Aqeedah of Ahlus Sunnah

 

[Keep it a boqol]

At-Tirmidhi (2167) narrated from Ibn ‘Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “Allah will not cause my ummah to agree on falsehood; the hand of Allah is with the jamaa‘ah (the main body of the Muslims).” Classed as hasan by al-Albaani.

Ibn Abdulwahab’s Aqeedah is a tiny minority of the Ummah. Do you believe the entire Ummah for over a millenium was misguided?

We affirm Allah has a hand that befits his majesty.

keep coping maturidi

 

[Keep it a boqol]

I can quote to you from the Qur'an verbatim. That's the simplest way to settle this.

This eliminates the Wahabi position.

The Qur'an says that nothing is like Allah. Surah al Ikhlas is the Aqeedah of Ahlus Sunnah

We can affirm nothing is like allah as he describes himself in surah ikhlas and say he is above the throne and seven heavens like the quran states and our prophet saws states.

 

[Omar del Sur]

I can quote to you from the Qur'an verbatim. That's the simplest way to settle this.

This eliminates the Wahabi position.

The Qur'an says that nothing is like Allah. Surah al Ikhlas is the Aqeedah of Ahlus Sunnah

You continue to use anti-"Wahhabi" rhetoric to attack the aqeedah of Al-Mazuni- student of Imam Shafi'i!

It is not enough just to quote the Quran, even 12er Shia kaffirs quote the Quran. It is necessary to understand it the way the salaf understood it. And they did not understand the Quran and Sunnah with the understanding of Ashari aqeedah.

 

[daljirkadahsoon]

We can affirm nothing is like allah as he describes himself in surah ikhlas and say he is above the throne and seven heavens like the quran states and our prophet saws states.

As long as you understand the 'above throne' is metaphorical and do not ascribe the created attribute of direction to Allah, we are all good.

The Mutashabihat are to be accepted and left alone. The Mujassima end up basically doing blasphemy with their ridiculous explanations.

 

[Keep it a boqol]

As long as you understand the 'above throne' is metaphorical and do not ascribe the created attribute of direction to Allah, we are all good.

did the salaf say it was metaphorical? What gives you the assumption that what Allah is saying it’s metaphorical

 

[daljirkadahsoon]

did the salaf say it was metaphorical? What gives you the assumption that what Allah is saying it’s metaphorical

A direction is an attribute of a CREATED thing.

As Allah is the Creator and not encompassed by his Creation, HE CANNOT HAVE A DIRECTION OR LOCATION. This is basic aqeedah and also common sense.

Time and space were created by Allah. There was 'a time' where nothing existed but Allah. If we go with your interpretation (false btw Salaf never believed it imam Malik was angry at those who said it), then you are implying that change has occurred to Allah as once He existed alone and now you are saying when He created the Throne He is now 'above the throne' literally wal iyadubilah.

Use your brain. You will see this is a nonsensical argument.

Did the Maliki Jurist Ibn Abi Zayd Believe Allah is Literally Above the Throne?

Answered by Shaykh Rami Nsour Question: Assalamu alaykum wa rahmatullah After studying for a while and increasing my understanding in many issues, one issue still causes me confusion, and that is the issue of Allah and the ‘Arsh. I accept the verses of the Qur’an as they are about this matter...

seekersguidance.org

 

[Garaad Awal]

We affirm Allah has a hand that befits his majesty.

keep coping maturidi

You believe in a pagan version of Allah. Allah is nothing the human mind can imagine. He doesn’t have hands or a shin

I quoted a verse in the Qur’an earlier about a verse that Allah stated he is closer to us than our jugular veins. Why do the followers of Ibn Abdulwahab pick and choose which verses they take literally and which they take as metaphors

 

[Omar del Sur]

You believe in a pagan version of Allah. Allah is nothing the human mind can imagine. He doesn’t have hands or a shin

Fear Allah.

What Are the Four Things Allah Created with His Hands? - Islam Question & Answer

These are the four things that Allah created with His Hand: the Throne, the Pen, the Garden of Eden, and Adam. As for all other created beings, they were created by the word “Kun” (Be), and they were.

islamqa.info

Praise be to Allah.

Firstly:

Allah, may He be exalted, singled out Adam (peace be upon him) to create him with His hands, as He has told us, and He did not create any other animate being with His hands. Allah, may He be glorified, says (interpretation of the meaning):

“[Allah] said, ‘O Iblees, what prevented you from prostrating to that which I created with My hands? Were you arrogant [then], or were you [already] among the haughty?’” [Saad 38:75].

In the hadith of intercession, the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “I will be the leader of the people on the Day of Resurrection. Do you know why that is? Allah will gather together the first and the last in one plain, so that the onlooker will be able to see them and the caller will be able to make them hear. The sun will be brought close to them, And some of the people will say: ‘Do you not see the state you are in? Do you not see what has happened to you. Why do you not look for someone who will intercede for you with your Lord?’ Some of the people will say, ‘[Go to] your father Adam.’ So they will go to him and say, ‘O Adam, you are the father of mankind, Allah created you with His own hand and breathed into you the soul that He had created for you, and commanded the angels to prostrate to you, and He caused you to dwell in Paradise. Intercede for us with your Lord. Do you not see the state we are in? Do you not see what has happened to us?’ [Adam] will say: ‘My Lord is angry today in a way in which He has never been angry before and will never be angry again. He forbade me to approach the tree, but I disobeyed Him. Myself, myself. Go to someone else, go to Nooh…’” Narrated by al-Bukhaari (3340) and Muslim (194).

 

[Omar del Sur]

 

[Keep it a boqol]

You believe in a pagan version of Allah. Allah is nothing the human mind can imagine. He doesn’t have hands or a shin

I quoted a verse in the Qur’an earlier about a verse that Allah stated he is closer to us than our jugular veins. Why do the followers of Ibn Abdulwahab pick and choose which verses they take literally and which they take as metaphors

 

[محمود فارح]

 

[Omar del Sur]

just to be transparent: I haven't checked this but I don't see any reason to take it as not being authentic. if someone wants they can look up the Arabic.

ok but this below- I have this book- this book is Harb al-Kirmani reporting ijma of the salaf and look what he says:



if anyone doesn't know- Harb Al-Kirmani is a student of Imam Ahmad.

So Allah is above the throne according both to Al-Mazuni, student of Imam Shafi'i and Harb Al-Kirmani, student of Imam Ahmad. To claim these great imams and their students were Asharis would simply not be true historically.

 

[Samaale55]

just to be transparent: I haven't checked this but I don't see any reason to take it as not being authentic. if someone wants they can look up the Arabic.

ok but this below- I have this book- this book is Harb al-Kirmani reporting ijma of the salaf and look what he says:



if anyone doesn't know- Harb Al-Kirmani is a student of Imam Ahmad.

So Allah is above the throne according both to Al-Mazuni, student of Imam Shafi'i and Harb Al-Kirmani, student of Imam Ahmad. To claim these great imams and their students were Asharis would simply not be true historically.

Looks like Imam at-Tahawi was unaware of this supposed "Ijma"

 

[Haragwaafi]

Cuz their Imams are Greek philosophers kkk

 

[Omar del Sur]

Looks like Imam at-Tahawi was unaware of this supposed "Ijma"

Tahawi huh. I should have specified that when I referred to "great imams" I meant Imam Malik, Imam Shafi'i and Imam Ahmad.

 

[Omar del Sur]

Sheikh Fawzan's commentary: