72% of Certain Community live in Social Housing - UK MP

[Kisame]

Who said it has to be a gulf country

Tekniko became a blogger in Kenya after leaving Canada . It pays the bills.

 

[Sigmundd]

Yea but like if your focus was to leave the UK, than you would have found a way by now. You could have earned a degree that could have given you access to better job opportunities in Muslim countries.

You aren't a broke ass teenager

I'm having a different career change. Teaching is what I'm going for. I feel like overseas recuirt teachers more. You can move up if your a teacher here

 

[Calaf]

Ignorance truly is a bliss. Do you people think the scholars are ignorant or that they are faasiqs that will willingly ignore the ayahs of the Quran? Is that just the arrogance you people have in your own petty knowledge or is that how low you think of the scholarss? Do you think Abu Haneefah and the thousands of scholars that came after him would just ignore this ayah when he gave his fatwa? His evidence is a saheeh hadith in Bukhari. But don’t let facts get in the way of your blind emotion.

Yet again a hadith does not have any weight over a ayah. Scholars are humans, they aint infailable. If its stated in the Quran its haram, then how could you possibly interpret it differently?

Tafsir Surah Al-Baqarah - 278 - Quran.com

Read Ibn Kathir (Abridged) for Ayah 278 of Surah Al-Baqarah

quran.com

Taking riba is basically declaring war against Allah SWT.

And even if you listen to these "scholars", how can you justify getting a mortgage for a house as a necessity. How is if a life or death situation when there is multiple other housing solutions including renting?

 

[Abaq]

Yet again a hadith does not have any weight over a ayah. Scholars are humans, they aint infailable. If its stated in the Quran its haram, then how could you possibly interpret it differently?

Tafsir Surah Al-Baqarah - 278 - Quran.com

Read Ibn Kathir (Abridged) for Ayah 278 of Surah Al-Baqarah

quran.com

Taking riba is basically declaring war against Allah SWT.

And even if you listen to these "scholars", how can you justify getting a mortgage for a house as a necessity. How is if a life or death situation when there is multiple other housing solutions including renting?

Riba is haram, the question here is when does riba apply and when does it not. Go learn usul fiqh

 

[reer]

Riba is haram, the question here is when does riba apply and when does it not. Go learn usul fiqh

and 3 out 4 madhabs dont agree with you.

 

[Kun_Ciil]

Yet again a hadith does not have any weight over a ayah. Scholars are humans, they aint infailable. If its stated in the Quran its haram, then how could you possibly interpret it differently?

Tafsir Surah Al-Baqarah - 278 - Quran.com

Read Ibn Kathir (Abridged) for Ayah 278 of Surah Al-Baqarah

quran.com

Taking riba is basically declaring war against Allah SWT.

And even if you listen to these "scholars", how can you justify getting a mortgage for a house as a necessity. How is if a life or death situation when there is multiple other housing solutions including renting?

Bro I remember my dad in the mid 90s wanted to a buy a house with a mortgage that involved riba. He went to an Egyptian sheikh to ask for a fatwa regarding its permissibility. The sheikh told him it is not a life or death situation, that he could rent or even if he couldn't afford rent he could buy a house in a Muslim country such as Syria/Egypt and move his kids there and provide for them whilst working abroad.

My dad refrained, and alxamdullilah Allah blessed him with a lot of khayr in this life and children that love him. As a Muslim it must be terrifying to engage in riba and knowing the accountability that is waiting on the day of judgement.



@Abaq

This riba thing in the west is such a fitna. My dad or the Somalis in 90s could've bought a lot of cheap houses(even outside london). When you look at the Pakistani population they don't live in council estates and all have bought their own houses through riba based mortgage. Looking at it worldly wise they are financially and socially better off than Somalis who don't own property.

But bro what do we do as Muslims? Do we choose the dunya over aakhira? As Allah says in the quran

And whosoever fears Allah and keeps his duty to Him, He will make a way for him to get out (from every difficulty).
3. And He will provide him from (sources) he never could imagine. And whosoever puts his trust in Allah, then He will suffice him. Verily, Allah will accomplish his purpose. Indeed Allah has set a measure for all things.-(Surah talaaq)

Tho i think the future generations in the west will accept paying riba to get a house since that is the only way they can in the western systems. Laakin now tbh i don't its worth it even from a financial perspective since the cost of houses and the riba involved is extortionate, 30 years paying for a property? That is bondage.

 

[Abaq]

Bro I remember my dad in the mid 90s wanted to a buy a house with a mortgage that involved riba. He went to an Egyptian sheikh to ask for a fatwa regarding its permissibility. The sheikh told him it is not a life or death situation, that he could rent or even if he couldn't afford rent he could buy a house in a Muslim country such as Syria/Egypt and move his kids there and provide for them whilst working abroad.

My dad refrained, and alxamdullilah Allah blessed him with a lot of khayr in this life and children that love him. As a Muslim it must be terrifying to engage in riba and knowing the accountability that is waiting on the day of judgement.



@Abaq

This riba thing in the west is such a fitna. My dad or the Somalis in 90s could've bought a lot of cheap houses(even outside london). When you look at the Pakistani population they don't live in council estates and all have bought their own houses through riba based mortgage. Looking at it worldly wise they are financially and socially better off than Somalis who don't own property.

But bro what do we do as Muslims? Do we choose the dunya over aakhira? As Allah says in the quran

And whosoever fears Allah and keeps his duty to Him, He will make a way for him to get out (from every difficulty).
3. And He will provide him from (sources) he never could imagine. And whosoever puts his trust in Allah, then He will suffice him. Verily, Allah will accomplish his purpose. Indeed Allah has set a measure for all things.-(Surah talaaq)

Tho i think the future generations in the west will accept paying riba to get a house since that is the only way they can in the western systems. Laakin now tbh i don't its worth it even from a financial perspective since the cost of houses and the riba involved is extortionate, 30 years paying for a property? That is bondage.

This is a respectful stance and I applaud your father. It is always better to err on the side of caution. I am merely against those that scream haram haram and are intolerant of other opinions.

However, if this is a choice you make knowing the consequences, you really need to ask yourself if the West is for you. If you are worried about Riba, why are you also not worried about the rampant kufr and fisq? For folks that take this path, they should seriously plan their returns home.

 

[Rayaale]

Riba is haram, the question here is when does riba apply and when does it not. Go learn usul fiqh

Are you really debating when riba is acceptable,are you hearing yourself subhanallah

 

[Idilinaa]

Yes and that’s my point.

A bunch of trolls can’t change the landscape of hatred filled by these right wingers who would have always attacked Somalis regardless, but the fact of the matter is that many of our trolls and dare say many of our young chaps have tirelessly tried to desperately separate themselves from the black category and have day and night gone on a social media rampage going on about how they’re ’not black’ and many Somalis have opted for their own category which puts the Somali community in their own spotlight and no where to hide.

I would have welcomed this separation if we were actually doing great but we weren’t. We are a relatively new community in a sense that the bulk of us have mostly arrived after 1991 and it’s not as if we were economic migrants so of course there would be issues and a need for social housing. Also, not only that, the same issues that plague other madows also plague Somalis but still many of these anti Madows wanted a separate category because they thought they’re better and doing better when they’re not. In fact all of the stereotypes that you find with madows you’re seeing in the Somali community and now that we have our own category and stats, the coming years will be a humbling and bumpy ride.

As far as i remember it wasn't that Somalis asked to not be lumped together with black. It was that they requested a category of their own under the Black African category in the census data.

And it was a youth organization that lobbied this because they wanted accurate information about Somali situation in the UK/London , so there could be sensible tailored policies and directions towards it. Instead of it being hidden under a category shared by others who we may not share much with.

this does not produce Somali-sensitive data. Population figures remain inaccurate, insensitive, and lead to an underestimation of resources needed, often resulting ‘in the British-Somali community’s experiences being overlooked’.

There was no Anti-Madow logic behind this, so it's false framing. What you guys need to do is stop projecting internet trolls behaviour onto the average real life Somalis , we are not fighting being called black or not. It's not something we sit around debating and discussing despite the popularity of it on the internet

What Somalis wanted was Somali sensitive data so they can allocate resources to help eachother and progress their community. That's it, and i agree with their mentality.

 

[AppleBoat398]

As far as i remember it wasn't that Somalis asked to not be lumped together with black. It was that they requested a category of their own under the Black African category in the census data.

And it was a youth organization that lobbied this because they wanted accurate information about Somali situation in the UK/London , so there could be sensible tailored policies and directions towards it. Instead of it being hidden under a category shared by others who we may not share much with.



There was no Anti-Madow logic behind this, so it's false framing. What you guys need to do is stop projecting internet trolls behaviour onto the average real life Somalis , we are not fighting being called black or not. It's not something we sit around debating and discussing despite the popularity of it on the internet

What Somalis wanted was Somali sensitive data so they can allocate resources to help eachother and progress their community. That's it, and i agree with their mentality.

This may be your only useful post in this thread.
If it is true, I want to know the name of the youth organisation. The census has been released for more than 2 years now, I have yet to see any meaningful productive community sessions on it. We barely have any somali organisations that are regularly active nationwide.

It will be a major disaster for us to try and separate ourselves from the Black African category; our group data is not very pleasant (to put it nicely) as it now, the black African category will conceal a lot of it. There are even worse and damning data for somalis that I've uncovered through FOI requests and do you know what I'VE DONE with it? Deleted the email and kept it quiet, not display it out to the public!


The future will get brighter though, 48% of somalis are under 21, we have to wait until a substantial portion of them are working, and our parent's generations have retired or moved back to Somalia, until we want to separate ourselves.

 

[berberaboy66]

This may be your only useful post in this thread.
If it is true, I want to know the name of the youth organisation. The census has been released for more than 2 years now, I have yet to see any meaningful productive community sessions on it. We barely have any somali organisations that are regularly active nationwide.

It will be a major disaster for us to try and separate ourselves from the Black African category; our group data is not very pleasant (to put it nicely) as it now, the black African category will conceal a lot of it. There are even worse and damning data for somalis that I've uncovered through FOI requests and do you know what I'VE DONE with it? Deleted the email and kept it quiet, not display it out to the public!


The future will get brighter though, 48% of somalis are under 21, we have to wait until a substantial portion of them are working, and our parent's generations have retired or moved back to Somalia, until we want to separate ourselves.

Brother this next census will be in 2031. I feel like you are overreacting lol most people here will be 30+ and everyone will be at least 25. You seem like you follow stats a lot you’d know we’re not the worst black African group in the entire country lol

 

[AppleBoat398]

Brother this next census will be in 2031. I feel like you are overreacting lol most people here will be 30+ and everyone will be at least 25. You seem like you follow stats a lot you’d know we’re not the worst black African group in the entire country lol

We're the second biggest black African group and one of the biggest ethnic groups in the UK. Unfortunately walaal, we have the worst data compared to all of the biggest ethnic groups which there are reasonable explanations (asylum seekers etc).

There are 176,645 of us (0.3%). We are not as small as you may think!

 

[Idilinaa]

This may be your only useful post in this thread.
If it is true, I want to know the name of the youth organisation. The census has been released for more than 2 years now, I have yet to see any meaningful productive community sessions on it. We barely have any somali organisations that are regularly active nationwide.

It will be a major disaster for us to try and separate ourselves from the Black African category; our group data is not very pleasant (to put it nicely) as it now, the black African category will conceal a lot of it. There are even worse and damning data for somalis that I've uncovered through FOI requests and do you know what I'VE DONE with it? Deleted the email and kept it quiet, not display it out to the public!


The future will get brighter though, 48% of somalis are under 21, we have to wait until a substantial portion of them are working, and our parent's generations have retired or moved back to Somalia, until we want to separate ourselves.

It's anti-tribalism movement if i remember correctly

This is how i know you people are out of touch of with Somali community on the ground .

Somalis have many different organizations across the UK and they regularly engage with the Somali populous on matters such as housing, education, resource building etc

The CSO Member Organisations

We have over 200 Somali led community organisations, including 40 mosques, as members of the Council of Somali Organisations across 12 metropolitan cities.

You guys are too focused on how others perceive us, especially online and not looking at the wider goal. We could hide stuff but that wouldn't improve our situation and our true experiences would be overlooked

I still maintain my position that Somalis should focus on progressing their socio-economic indicators and ignore the noise right wing islamophobes and immigrant haters create. We have made great progress in spite of our obstacles , so it should be encouraging.

As i have shown in other threads that Somalis in certain American states have low crime rates and it's gone down as a result of us moving in and yet these right wingers & Donald Trump went to those places and slandered Somalis anyways with lies

Take for example the state of Maine i shared stats on, articles and posts to show how much of a model success story Somali immigrants have been for that city.


This did not prevent Donald Trump and their right wing co-horts in smearing Somali population in Maine with slanderous lies about crime, when he did his campaigning

Trump’s statements about Somali immigrants in Maine draw rebuke​

Trump’s statements about Somali immigrants in Maine draw rebuke

The Republican presidential nominee hints at a correlation between Somali immigrants and more crime, but local police chiefs say property crime and violent crime are down.

www.pressherald.com

Let me remind you that , Somalis have not formed gangs or participated in crime and their own police department came out against what Donald Trump said. They still tried to pin that narrative on us.

When asked if crime was up because of Somali immigrants, O’Malley said. “Not in Lewiston. Our crime rate has gone down. We have not seen any increase in crime due to the Somali immigrants.”

He said that since Somali immigrants began arriving in Lewiston in the 1990s, the city’s crime rate has steadily decreased. Meanwhile, overall crime rates are down across the state and across the nation, O’Malley said.

Portland Police Chief Michael Sauschuck said property and violent crime rates were down in his city as well. Sauschuck said property crime was down 14 and violent crime was down 24 percent compared to 2015.

So it's important to not try to locate and perceive your own people through the minds of these cadaan gaalos or racists online. What we should do instead is study ourselves to improve things, and adopt a pragmatic approach rooted in identifying our own best interests.

It shows you with or without stats they will come at Somalis through the prism of anti-immigration or anti-islam. If nothing unpleasant group data is available to them, they will just make stuff up. Which they have been caught doing time and time again.

In the UK we have seen them report about random white criminals as Somali immigrants and when correct by others they still kept it up. So they have a clear political agenda what the real facts are don't matter to them.

 

[AppleBoat398]

Brother this next census will be in 2031. I feel like you are overreacting lol most people here will be 30+ and everyone will be at least 25. You seem like you follow stats a lot you’d know we’re not the worst black African group in the entire country lol

Somalis in other European countries can get away with their data being publicly available. Here it is different the UK, is the epicentre of white supremacy!

 

[AppleBoat398]

It's anti-tribalism movement if i remember correctly

This is how i know you people are out of touch of with Somali community on the ground .

Somalis have many different organizations across the UK and they regularly engage with the Somali populous on matters such as housing, education, resource building etc

The CSO Member Organisations

You guys are too focused on how others perceive us, especially online and not looking at the wider goal. We could hide stuff but that wouldn't improve our situation and our true experiences would be overlooked

I still maintain my position that Somalis should focus on progressing their socio-economic indicators and ignore the noise right wing islamophobes and immigrant haters create. We have made great progress in spite of our obstacles , so it should be encouraging.

As i have shown in other threads that Somalis in certain American states have low crime rates and it's gone down as a result of us moving in and yet these right wingers & Donald Trump went to those places and slandered Somalis anyways with lies



It shows you with or without stats they will come at Somalis through the prism of anti-immigration or anti-islam. If nothing unpleasant group data is not available to them, they will just make stuff up.

We have seen them report about random white criminals as Somali immigrants and when correct by others they still kept it up. So they have a clear political agenda what the facts are don't matter.

I'm very well aware of the presence of both of those organisations. The second organisation I have personal gripes with. A few years ago a somali took the life of a serving politician This was the CSO's response:

https://www.councilofsomaliorgs.com/news/press-release-cso-welcomes-the-conviction-of-ali-harbi-ali/

What do you think of this statement? I want to hear your opinion before I share mine.

Also, you keep mentioning that we care about how others perceive us online.
This is past online my friend. It has reached mainstream politics, television, journalists!

 

[Idilinaa]

I'm very well aware of the presence of both of those organisations. The second organisation I have personal gripes with. A few years ago a somali took the life of a serving politician This was the CSO's response:

https://www.councilofsomaliorgs.com/news/press-release-cso-welcomes-the-conviction-of-ali-harbi-ali/

What do you think of this statement? I want to hear your opinion before I share mine.

It's a collective council for all different organizations and yes they are right in that response, i remember this incident and they found radical terror youtube videos and clips on his laptop , so he was brainwashed.

And they made a press release to let people know that it in no way shape or form represent Somalis or the Muslim community.

Also, you keep mentioning that we care about how others perceive us online.
This is past online my friend. It has reached mainstream politics, television, journalists!

Online was in reference troll accounts yall bring up, as far as the media immigration politics goes it's been like that since time we've arrived in the west in larger numbers in the 90s. So it's not like it's a new development.

 

[AppleBoat398]

1) It is an awful response. I would never have agreed for it to go out.

In 2017, there was a massive attack in a Manchester concert committed by a muslim. Look at the responses by these separate muslim organisations:

Collation of Responses to Manchester Attack | Muslim Council of Britain

Muslim Council of Britain: Following the attack on Manchester Arena last night, Harun Khan, Secretary General of the Muslim Council of Britain, issued the following statement: “My thoughts and prayers are with the victims and their families. I understand teenagers and children have been caught...

mcb.org.uk

Now compare it to the somali one. What do you notice?

 

[Idilinaa]

1) It is an awful response. I would never have agreed for it to go out.

In 2017, there was a massive attack in a Manchester concert committed by a muslim. Look at the responses by these separate muslim organisations:

Collation of Responses to Manchester Attack | Muslim Council of Britain

Muslim Council of Britain: Following the attack on Manchester Arena last night, Harun Khan, Secretary General of the Muslim Council of Britain, issued the following statement: “My thoughts and prayers are with the victims and their families. I understand teenagers and children have been caught...

mcb.org.uk

Now compare it to the somali one. What do you notice?

Somali council is a brief press release and the other is collective Muslim response to a major attack.

Only the first response at the top of the page is by the Muslim council and its shorter and similar to the press release.

 

[Man with a garuun]

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[Bazed]

I would like to see a source for his data. 72%? Plus most of social housing is brought up by their tenants, the simple fact is that it is easier to get into social housing and buy that house than to do mortgages.

Simple fact us if the made a method to buy house that was interest free then that percentage would be nearly nothing. But if they did that they would complain that the system is rigged. For example look at when Canda offers Muslim mortgages and how non Muslims complained.