A somali family are celebrating Christmas and they also have a dog

[Saciid]

We're not discussing whether they were well-loved or not, no? Though it does seem reer Miyi did not hate dogs back then. What it seems to me you are almost saying is that Burton made what he wrote up for some reason and Somalis didn't really keep dogs back then. If so, I'm sorry but I won't entertain stuff like "I will disregard this perfectly reliable source because I don't like what it says." that is nonsense, I fear. It also does plainly fit with the archaeology and it makes perfect sense that they'd have had dogs back then. Every nomadic group around them did. I don't see why they'd be some magic exception.



Walaal, by 1764 Somalis were already making up quarters of magaalo in Yemen:

By the 1800s they were everywhere in Aden:

THE SOMALI COMMUNITY AT ADEN IN THE NINETEENTH CENTURY on JSTOR

Edward A. Alpers, THE SOMALI COMMUNITY AT ADEN IN THE NINETEENTH CENTURY, Northeast African Studies, Vol. 8, No. 2/3 (1986), pp. 143-168

www.jstor.org

The northeast was relatively destitute at this time and the ports there were tiny and practically villages like Dubai and Sharjah used to be but there were a lot of them. Bandar Qassim, Bandar Beyle, Calula, Qandala... the list goes on to a point where even in this terribly arid region non-nomads like the inhabitants of these towns made up at least 15% of the population:

Of a total population of 82,653 for the Mijertein region, 59,554 are pastoralist, 5,297 agriculturalist-pastoralist, 920 sedentary cultivators, 9,692 fishermen and sailors, and 3,097 merchants. - Peoples of the Horn of Africa: Somali, Afar and Saho ​

In the northwest Berbera, if memory serves me right, would balloon up to as much as 40,000 people at its famous high season, a lot of those nomads and traders from the interior coming from places like Harar. By the 1850s before the arrival of the Egyptians or Abyssinians which laid waste to the place's original demographics, Somalis pretty much made up 1/3rd of Harar with the remaining 1/3rd who were nomads who came and went appearing to be Somalis as well. The local Amir's first wife among 4 was the daughter of a local Somali Garaad and one of his most important ministers who went on diplomatic missions for the town was a Somali of the same tribe:




Link

In Koonfur Gibil-Madows were the majority in Xamar and Baraawe and about half the population as well as the rulers in Marko. Yes, Reer Magaal culture was a minority like anywhere else in the world but it was firmly a part of our dynamics even in the 19th century. And I wouldn't say an extreme minority. In most of the world historically, outside of some minor exceptions like Classical Greece, an 80-90:10-20 split between rural and urban was fairly regular, walaal. Most people's ancestors everywhere in the world were overwhelmingly reer miyi.

And nowadays almost 50% of Somalis are urban (was like 25% in 1960, if I'm not mistaken). That's just urban. When you count the tuulo it becomes even more extreme, I reckon. I've driven around the countryside even in Bari and most of what I encountered were tuulos of varying sizes and then the occasional magaalad. Nomads were a scarce sight, to be honest. I'd just run into the occasional lone family most of the time and then it was more common to see them living in a modern hut than an Aqal.

It's not far-fetched, I would say, that reer magaal mentalities influenced Somalis in general today, especially given that the magaalo often were home to Shaykhs who had ambitions of proselytizing to and influencing the reer miyi iyo tuulo to whatever order and doctrines they subscribed to but this is honestly an unnecessary exercise. If you can disprove what Burton is saying with more than "It's one source and I want to act as though he made it up" then alright but otherwise you're arguing with data and asking me to put on a tinfoil hat and believe some cadaan man cared enough to make stuff up about seeing dogs; a fact he mentions as offhandedly as telling you that the sky is blue.

Nobody said Burton nade it up, just that maybe he was in his description of Somali-dog relationship or something else. U be surprised the mistakes travelers do.

As for the Reer Magaal stuff, many of the settlements of 19th century weren't Urban and Benaadir and Seylac were the exception to me. 19th century Berbera and Bosaaso (the biggest Bari town) are the prime examples of temporary Somali settlement that was common historically (as proven with Xiis).

U might be right ab both, somali history is poorly studied and dominated by poor characterizations. Allahu Aclam

 

[sufilife]

Okay and ? Are they related to you in any way or form if not mind your damn business. Just because someone shares the same ethnicity as you doesn't mean you can tell them what to do with their lives, for fucks sakes somalis are probaly the only retarded people who cannot acknowledge this simple fact.

Like don't yall have your own lives, goals, purposes? Why is everything about gossip with you people. I even see grown ass abtis and habaryars gossiping what a random somali person does with their life, literally pathetic.

For someone named malab you really are not sweet and kind .

 

[Shimbiris]

Nobody said Burton nade it up, just that maybe he was in his description of Somali-dog relationship or something else. U be surprised the mistakes travelers do.

As for the Reer Magaal stuff, many of the settlements of 19th century weren't Urban and Benaadir and Seylac were the exception to me. 19th century Berbera and Bosaaso (the biggest Bari town) are the prime examples of temporary Somali settlement that was common historically (as proven with Xiis).

U might be right ab both, somali history is poorly studied and dominated by poor characterizations. Allahu Aclam

Hmm, I don't see much of a difference between most of the coastal settlements, both big and small. It seems apparent from reading the accounts that most had permanent dwellers all year round but would indeed balloon up during their high seasons with ajanabi traders, nomads, Somali traders coming in from the hinterland and so on. Xamar and Saylac were the same. The actual permanent inhabitants all around were very small and not usually more than 10,000-15,000 in my experience. Harar was about the same size too and in Harar's case it is noted that about 1/3rd or 1/4th of that population, if memory serves me right, are nomads who come and go which seems fairly regular on the coast as well. I wouldn't be shocked if some of the smaller settlements only boasted a few hundred permanent inhabitants, to be honest. But this isn't unique to Somalis and was very much the case in neighboring Arabia, from what I've noticed.

The archaeology and accounts on the late Middle Ages makes you think the magaalo were maybe bigger in terms of permanent inhabitants back then but I would be surprised if they ever surpassed 30-40K, though maybe I'm being too harsh. If you read accounts from people like Ibn Battuta and Ibn Khaldun you notice the clearly strong nomadic presence even in Xamar where camels are all over:

The next leg of the sea voyage lasted fifteen nights and brought Battuta to Maqdashaw (Mogadishu). He described the town as “endless in its size” and mentioned the large number of camels and sheep slaughtered there. Mogadishu was also famous for its cloth, which was sold as far away as Egypt.[COMMENT: If the sea voyage took fifteen days and the land voyage took two months, then a ship traveled four times as fast as a person could walk.

https://visitmogadishu.com/ibn-battuta-travels-to-mogadishu-city-in-1331/

And Ibn Khaldun describes its mode of civilization as nomadic.

Pre-modern cities were often very small by modern standards in general, to be fair. The greatest of them like Ancient Rome were just around scratching 1,000,000 and that was the beating heart of a vast empire that constantly had to replenish itself with ruralites and migrants of all sorts with all the disease it's population density would cultivate.

The population of ancient cities, depending upon which definition of `city' one uses, differed sharply from what one might consider proper for a city in the modern day. Professor Smith claims, “Many ancient cities had only modest populations, often under 5,000 persons” (26) while other scholars, such as Modelski, cite higher population possibilities in the range of 10,000 to 80,000 depending upon the period under consideration. Modelski, for example, cites the population of Uruk at 14,000 in the year 3700 BCE but 80,000 by the year 2800 BCE (12).

https://www.worldhistory.org/city/

Nobody said Burton nade it up, just that maybe he was in his description of Somali-dog relationship or something else. U be surprised the mistakes travelers do.

I dunno, walaal. He seemed very well informed and kept speaking to Qadis, Wadaads, Suldaans and the like. He recounts a lot very vividly and mostly correctly like the Somali seasons and general routine. And he doesn't put much time into dogs. They seem to him as normal and unremarkable a thing to mention as sheep. They're just there, common and plain to see is the impression I get and it's very damning that he mentions them with several tribes like Cisse, Habar Awals and Geri Kombe, and when he speaks of the general Somali views toward them he doesn't hone in on one tribe as someone who travelled from east to west all the way to Harar along the north and recounts meeting Isaaqs, Dirs, Daroods and Hawiyes. It seems fairly reliable to me.

 

[Abba Sadacha]

May Allah guide them. A Somali sister should advise them about this situation.

 

[kickz]

People saying "mind your business", this attitude is foreign and contrary to Islam. If they're Muslim you have a duty to give naseehah. If they take it or not is up to them.

Yep exactly, people always crying about leaving people alone forget this.

 

[DubatDiaries]

Dogs are actually, funnily enough, an original part of our culture. They seem to have been lost and forgotten rapidly after the 1800s or early 1900s due to the mentality in the magaalo spreading throughout the country in time:



But during the 1800s it seems most nomadic Somali and even some reer Tuulo had dogs so much so that you could tell they were nearby through the sound of barking:











Source: First Footsteps in East Africa by Richard Burton. He travelled across much of the north all the way to Harar and many times was a guest to different local leaders, meeting everything from various different Daroods, Isaaqs, Dirs and even Hawiyes so it's interesting how he describes the presence of dogs like this as a normal part of Somali culture and not isolated to one tribe.

There is also the fact that dogs were part of the original Cushitic cultural package when our ancestors began migrating from Sudan as early as 3000 BCE. They brought cattle, goats, sheep, donkeys and dogs with them and display as much in several of their cave paintings:

Sada Mire interviewed by CNN: ‘First-aid’ needed for 5,000-year-old Somali cave paintings | Sada Mire

www.sadamire.com

Arabians were similarly laden with dogs historically. They even have a specific and currently well-known breed the Bedouin used to be quite affectionate toward to the point of letting them into their tents:



But with them as well the Reer Magaal (Xadhar) mentality toward them, that I think grew more extreme since movements like that of Muhammad ibn Abd al-Wahhab, spread and became more uniform. Nowhere is it stated they are xaraan, saaxiib. It's just their saliva and getting it on you requiring you redo your ablution before praying. The only mention of dogs in the Qur'an itself, from what I remember, is like one story that was actually positive.



They are good, loyal and useful beasts especially for one on a farm/ranch. Somalis need to let this absurd fear and hatred of them go, I reckon.

There is a childish fear of dogs adopted by Muslims. We need to stop being so close-minded and reactionary. On the other hand the way these cadaans treat their dogs like a replacement for children is repulsive.

 

[Shimbiris]

There is a childish fear of dogs adopted by Muslims. We need to stop being so close-minded and reactionary. On the other hand the way these cadaans treat their dogs like a replacement for children is repulsive.

I couldn't agree more. Even when I see such said by well-meaning and kindly types I somewhat cringe when I hear things like "fur babies". I love animals. Waa one of life's great joys to run around on a field with goofy goats and sheep or to field a horse or know a dog's adulation or simply sit in nature and watch the ebb and flow of the circle of life but no animal is equivalent to a human child.

Your child will grow. You are creating a whole person who will one day have opinions of their own, who may even choose to stand against you in many cases... it is a real journey. A dog will not change much. Maybe grow wearier and slower with age but they will still be that goofy, simplistic creature that turns to you for food and affection and offers no conversation, no conflicting views, no criticisms, no real rebellion and will never become a man or woman grown ready to explore world on their own whether you like it or not. Truly silly to ever compare a dog to such.

 

[AbrahamFreedom]

Me waiting for Somalis to make threads critiquing random Somalis for marrying a non Somali, not fasting, being secular, owning a pet (I have seen a guy get mocked in real life for owning a shimbir, forget about a dog which is the topic of this thread), going to clubs (which they do themselves), etc.

Me waiting for Somalis to make threads admonishing the many families for producing convicted rapists and murders and drug dealers in the west which ruins the community's image especially for integrated law abiding Somalis who have a future, criticizing war criminals and corrupted leaders from their clans, anti-women sentiments, taking a stand against extremism in the diaspora communities which has resulted in the more extreme ones dying for Al Shabab and ISIS (I know like 4), etc

 

[Angelina]

Hmm, I don't see much of a difference between most of the coastal settlements, both big and small. It seems apparent from reading the accounts that most had permanent dwellers all year round but would indeed balloon up during their high seasons with ajanabi traders, nomads, Somali traders coming in from the hinterland and so on. Xamar and Saylac were the same. The actual permanent inhabitants all around were very small and not usually more than 10,000-15,000 in my experience. Harar was about the same size too and in Harar's case it is noted that about 1/3rd or 1/4th of that population, if memory serves me right, are nomads who come and go which seems fairly regular on the coast as well. I wouldn't be shocked if some of the smaller settlements only boasted a few hundred permanent inhabitants, to be honest. But this isn't unique to Somalis and was very much the case in neighboring Arabia, from what I've noticed.

The archaeology and accounts on the late Middle Ages makes you think the magaalo were maybe bigger in terms of permanent inhabitants back then but I would be surprised if they ever surpassed 30-40K, though maybe I'm being too harsh. If you read accounts from people like Ibn Battuta and Ibn Khaldun you notice the clearly strong nomadic presence even in Xamar where camels are all over:

https://visitmogadishu.com/ibn-battuta-travels-to-mogadishu-city-in-1331/

And Ibn Khaldun describes its mode of civilization as nomadic.

Pre-modern cities were often very small by modern standards in general, to be fair. The greatest of them like Ancient Rome were just around scratching 1,000,000 and that was the beating heart of a vast empire that constantly had to replenish itself with ruralites and migrants of all sorts with all the disease it's population density would cultivate.

https://www.worldhistory.org/city/

I dunno, walaal. He seemed very well informed and kept speaking to Qadis, Wadaads, Suldaans and the like. He recounts a lot very vividly and mostly correctly like the Somali seasons and general routine. And he doesn't put much time into dogs. They seem to him as normal and unremarkable a thing to mention as sheep. They're just there, common and plain to see is the impression I get and it's very damning that he mentions them with several tribes like Cisse, Habar Awals and Geri Kombe, and when he speaks of the general Somali views toward them he doesn't hone in on one tribe as someone who travelled from east to west all the way to Harar along the north and recounts meeting Isaaqs, Dirs, Daroods and Hawiyes. It seems fairly reliable to me.

No one can downplay the reliability of Burton’s account. It is without doubt incredibly vivid and well informed. His description of Qabils, the views our ancestors had of our tribal origins which funnily enough is still believed today, his inclusion of Somali words, his first hand account of nomads to the Ugaas and the tribal conflict of different Qabils was just incredibly too detailed for it to be doubtful

His description of Somalis of that era reminded me of some aspects of modern Somalis. The attitudes, the general spirit of the people felt very authentically Somali and it was a great snapshot of us in times of old. I laughed at times, especially when he described the general suspicions Somalis had for certain groups and their mocking poetry. I was reminded of the elderly in my family and I was left thinking, ‘yep, not much has changed’. Clearly our xenophobia and our humorous nonchalant nature is quintessentially Somali. Yet, at the same time there were practices and elements that felt incredibly distant and foreign about our ancestors.

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Many will question Burton simply because many Somalis don’t know much about their history, regardless of how recent it is. 1850 isn’t that long ago and it is literally the lifetimes of our grandparents own grandparents, but the reality is that many of us don’t even know how different the early lives of our grandparents were to what we now see amongst Somalis and that many aspects of their childhood has been lost to history.

 

[Saciid]

No one can downplay the reliability of Burton’s account. It is without doubt incredibly vivid and well informed. His description of Qabils, the views our ancestors had of our tribal origins which funnily enough is still believed today, his inclusion of Somali words, his first hand account of nomads to the Ugaas and the tribal conflict of different Qabils was just incredibly too detailed for it to be doubtful

His description of Somalis of that era reminded me of some aspects of modern Somalis. The attitudes, the general spirit of the people felt very authentically Somali and it was a great snapshot of us in times of old. I laughed at times, especially when he described the general suspicions Somalis had for certain groups and their mocking poetry. I was reminded of the elderly in my family and I was left thinking, ‘yep, not much has changed’. Clearly our xenophobia and our humorous nonchalant nature is quintessentially Somali. Yet, at the same time there were practices and elements that felt incredibly distant and foreign about our ancestors.

Many will question Burton simply because many Somalis don’t know much about their history, regardless of how recent it is. 1850 isn’t that long ago and it is literally the lifetimes of our grandparents own grandparents, but the reality is that many of us don’t even know how different the early lives of our grandparents were to what we know see amongst Somalis and that many aspects of their childhood has been lost to history.

He was also a rabid racist and orientalist who was one of the first to perpetuate the Galla myth. His book is filled with racist and Orientalsist trops, exaggerations and inaccuracies. So to boil down the doubts of some of his statements to "don't know much ab their history" is just disrespectful

 

[Angelina]

He was also a rabid racist and orientalist who was one of the first to perpetuate the Galla myth. His book is filled with racist and Orientalsist trops, exaggerations and inaccuracies. So to boil down the doubts of some of his statements to "don't know much ab their history" is just disrespectful

Yep, he was a racist, however hardly any of his general account about Somali culture can be disputed. He, without doubt described every detail from even recording Somali phrases incredibly accurately and even understandable for modern readers, his reports of what Somalis of old thought of our tribal origins which is practically identical to what Somalis would still argue, to his reports of Somalis everyday routine, the conflicts of different qabils ect. The differences between town life and the meey ect.


There is no denying that Burton would make comments that betrayed his own bias and orientalist leanings, but from reading the book it was very evident when he did this occasionally and I was able to differentiate between his mere opinions and what he actually saw on the ground as in those accounts he was pretty objective. Also, crazily enough some of his opinions of us, did sound very Somali LOOOL. I mean he practically said we were Xenophobes, humorous, mock

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. Wallahi I was blown away by that description tbh. Obviously, other views I didn’t agree with.

 

[Shimbiris]

No one can downplay the reliability of Burton’s account. It is without doubt incredibly vivid and well informed. His description of Qabils, the views our ancestors had of our tribal origins which funnily enough is still believed today, his inclusion of Somali words, his first hand account of nomads to the Ugaas and the tribal conflict of different Qabils was just incredibly too detailed for it to be doubtful

His description of Somalis of that era reminded me of some aspects of modern Somalis. The attitudes, the general spirit of the people felt very authentically Somali and it was a great snapshot of us in times of old. I laughed at times, especially when he described the general suspicions Somalis had for certain groups and their mocking poetry. I was reminded of the elderly in my family and I was left thinking, ‘yep, not much has changed’. Clearly our xenophobia and our humorous nonchalant nature is quintessentially Somali. Yet, at the same time there were practices and elements that felt incredibly distant and foreign about our ancestors.

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Many will question Burton simply because many Somalis don’t know much about their history, regardless of how recent it is. 1850 isn’t that long ago and it is literally the lifetimes of our grandparents own grandparents, but the reality is that many of us don’t even know how different the early lives of our grandparents were to what we know see amongst Somalis and that many aspects of their childhood has been lost to history.

One really interesting tradition that now seems completely gone is the trial by fire tradition he mentions:

The Somal, as usual amongst the heterogeneous mass amalgamated by El Islam, have a
diversity of superstitions attesting their Pagan origin. Such for instance are their oaths by stones, their reverence of cairns and holy trees, and their ordeals of fire and water, the Bolungo of Western Africa. A man accused of murder or theft walks down a trench full of live charcoal and about a spear’s length, or he draws out of the flames a smith’s anvil heated to redness: some prefer picking four or five cowries from a large pot full of boiling water.

Funnily enough, this appears in the time of the Futux al-Xabasha 300 years earlier as well as something practiced by the Imam Axmad ibn Ibrahim al-Ghazi. An Ethiopian scholar used this to theorize that he was an Canfar, at least maternally, but I think this scholar should have read the Futux more closely because he would discover that there were no Canfars involved.

In an attempt to corroborate the discussion by
Trimingham, I came across the same information in the Futuh and in Tekletsadik
Mekuria‟s book mentioned earlier. In both of these works, it is reported that by the
time Gragn reached the Rock Hewn churches of Lalibela, priests were gathered in
great number ready to die for their religion. Gragn then had the articles of wood piled
up and set on fire in one of the churches, apparently not the Rock Hewn churches,
wishing to see what they would do. He put them to the test and instructed them to
select one person from the Christians and one from the Muslims, presumably to
prove the true religion. Then, the chief of the priests made himself ready to throw
into a raging blaze fanned deliberately. But before that, a certain lady who were told,
was a nun, took the initiative and threw herself into the fire and ultimately half of her
face was burnt before Gragn instructed his followers to pull her out.42 As for the
Muslims, our sources remain silent.

They are only mentioned as a far away people to the north and the only groups fighting for the Imam are Somalis and the mysterious "Harla" who may have very well been some unique Somaloid group like the Raxanweyn. The "Malassai" he thinks are Canfars are actually just a mix of elite fighters, Somalis included, from across his army who make up the center of his army. Nevertheless, him displaying this custom does seem to imply a Cushitic, likely Somali, origin.

Around the same period as Burton a Majeerteen ruler all the way in the northeast also displayed this tradition:



Completely foreign to Somalis today but for 500 years at least it seems to have been a regular part of our dhaqan. Some of our brothers on this thread just seem shaken by how contrary some things from 100-200 years ago are to our current culture and seem to adopt some excess skepticism or even denial. A lot changes in a couple of centuries, especially after modernization, gaal influence, a horrific civil war and salafis running around proselytizing. But, as you say, in some ways Geeljires still Geeljire.

 

[Shimbiris]

He was also a rabid racist and orientalist who was one of the first to perpetuate the Galla myth. His book is filled with racist and Orientalsist trops, exaggerations and inaccuracies. So to boil down the doubts of some of his statements to "don't know much ab their history" is just disrespectful

"The Galla Myth" is just something he assumes and he never says the Somalis themselves gave him that impression or told him about it. Also, please share a book talking about all these supposed inaccuracies or go into them in detail yourself. There mostly are none such, walaal. His descriptions are very vivid and actually fit with everything we already know about Somalis. In fact, it's amazing how he recounts the exact same tribes living around Harar as the ones who lived there 300 years earlier in the Futux. Also, what is the premise here? "He was racist and made up seeing countless dogs everywhere for some reason"? C'mon, saaxiib...

 

[Shimbiris]

@Garaad diinle

Posted the wrong Twitter link for the MJ thing. My bad. Corrected it.

 

[Garaad diinle]

One really interesting tradition that now seems completely gone is the trial by fire tradition he mentions:



Funnily enough, this appears in the time of the Futux al-Xabasha 300 years earlier as well as something practiced by the Imam Axmad ibn Ibrahim al-Ghazi. An Ethiopian scholar used this to theorize that he was an Canfar, at least maternally, but I think this scholar should have read the Futux more closely because he would discover that there were no Canfars involved.



They are only mentioned as a far away people to the north and the only groups fighting for the Imam are Somalis and the mysterious "Harla" who may have very well been some unique Somaloid group like the Raxanweyn. The "Malassai" he thinks are Canfars are actually just a mix of elite fighters, Somalis included, from across his army who make up the center of his army. Nevertheless, him displaying this custom does seem to imply a Cushitic, likely Somali, origin.

Around the same period as Burton a Majeerteen ruler all the way in the northeast also displayed this tradition:



Completely foreign to Somalis today but for 500 years at least it seems to have been a regular part of our dhaqan. Some of our brothers on this thread just seem shaken by how contrary some things from 100-200 years ago are to our current culture and seem to adopt some excess skepticism or even denial. A lot changes in a couple of centuries, especially after modernization, gaal influence, a horrific civil war and salafis running around proselytizing. But, as you say, in some ways Geeljires still Geeljire.

I once read about a trial of fire in southern india and i also read about one of the tābi'ūn in yemen was subjected to a trial of fire too. Odd.

 

[Angelina]

One really interesting tradition that now seems completely gone is the trial by fire tradition he mentions:



Funnily enough, this appears in the time of the Futux al-Xabasha 300 years earlier as well as something practiced by the Imam Axmad ibn Ibrahim al-Ghazi. An Ethiopian scholar used this to theorize that he was an Canfar, at least maternally, but I think this scholar should have read the Futux more closely because he would discover that there were no Canfars involved.



They are only mentioned as a far away people to the north and the only groups fighting for the Imam are Somalis and the mysterious "Harla" who may have very well been some unique Somaloid group like the Raxanweyn. The "Malassai" he thinks are Canfars are actually just a mix of elite fighters, Somalis included, from across his army who make up the center of his army. Nevertheless, him displaying this custom does seem to imply a Cushitic, likely Somali, origin.

Around the same period as Burton a Majeerteen ruler all the way in the northeast also displayed this tradition:



Completely foreign to Somalis today but for 500 years at least it seems to have been a regular part of our dhaqan. Some of our brothers on this thread just seem shaken by how contrary some things from 100-200 years ago are to our current culture and seem to adopt some excess skepticism or even denial. A lot changes in a couple of centuries, especially after modernization, gaal influence, a horrific civil war and salafis running around proselytizing. But, as you say, in some ways Geeljires still Geeljire.

I do find it strange how aspects of Somali culture has changed significantly in the last 100 yrs or shall I say 40. In the 70s and early 80s when my mother would often visit the Miiy she would often see strange customs that are remnants of our traditions that are now completely abandoned. I think the city folk would look at some of things that some of the Reer Miiy would do as straight up outlandish and since the war broke out, many of the Reer Miiy have moved in cities and towns and now these practices are dead forever. Modernization is to be expected and I’m glad we’ve moved on. I just find it strange how quickly they’ve changed and how much we don’t know about things that would happen in our grandparents lifetime.

Also, I don’t know if you’ve noticed or maybe it’s just my family and relatives, I’ve noticed by mum’s generation don’t really care for history that much. I don’t think they used to sit there and ask their grandparent questions about their past and now we’re left with a generation who think Somali culture is simply the modern culture that you see when you go back home now.

With regards to the dog situation, It’s clear to see that even up until the 30s, Somalis would often utilize dogs as we actually have proof via video so now posters can’t even dispute that as much as they’d love to. Also,I don’t think it’s a big deal as in Islam, having dogs isn’t haram if you’re a farmer or Nomadic pastoralists (which Somalis were,) and since we used to live in an Areesh rather than homes, I highly doubt they’d keep them in their living area which is strictly forbidden in Islam.

 

[Angelina]

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[Saciid]

"The Galla Myth" is just something he assumes and he never says the Somalis themselves gave him that impression or told him about it. Also, please share a book talking about all these supposed inaccuracies or go into them in detail yourself. There mostly are none such, walaal. His descriptions are very vivid and actually fit with everything we already know about Somalis. In fact, it's amazing how he recounts the exact same tribes living around Harar as the ones who lived there 300 years earlier in the Futux. Also, what is the premise here? "He was racist and made up seeing countless dogs everywhere for some reason"? C'mon, saaxiib...

What? This isn't ab the dogs anymore, just didn't like how she gassed him up too much. My disagreements ab the dogs comes from something else lol

 

[Saciid]

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[Bernie Madoff]

Is it just me but I noticed a lot more muslim families in the west having dogs. Heck I got two muslims friends who own dogs and their parents are perfectly fine with it. Between a cat or a dog I would easily pick a dog they are more caring and loving compared to selfish cats. But hey that’s just me