History of unified rule in Somalia

[World]

Yeah, geography can be a big obstacle in centralising rule but it is not impossible. The Arabs managed to do it during the early caliphate period despite their tribalism, although I acknowledge that it was a short-lived phenomenon.

You could give the argument that it was their religious zeal and the memory of the beloved prophet that kept them together in the early conquests. I still feel that these things were part of various other factors though and not the whole picture.

Why would somalis in the semi arid desert unite? For what purpose? What would they gain from uniting? There was no resources in the region. Only livestock. Nomadic people historically united to conquer settled people. There was hardly any settled people in Somalia.

 

[Bundasliga]

It wasn't necessary in the past. Our lifestyle & geographic situation was build for the people to rule a local area .
Somali territory was too big .

Post-colonial time a United Somali territory is the only logical & most beneficial to every somali.
Unfortunately we have too many 68 IQ munafiqs.

 

[Gantaal97]

Yeah, geography can be a big obstacle in centralising rule but it is not impossible. The Arabs managed to do it during the early caliphate period despite their tribalism, although I acknowledge that it was a short-lived phenomenon.

You could give the argument that it was their religious zeal and the memory of the beloved prophet that kept them together in the early conquests. I still feel that these things were part of various other factors though and not the whole picture.

Even before Islam Arabian peninsula had multi tribal kingdoms like the Lakhamid Kingdom and Himyarate Empire. Arabs unlike Somalis never isolated themselves from their neighbors as every Arab kingdom always incorporated different Arab tribes in their kingdom during expansion campaigns while Somalis on the other hand kicked out tribes from the land that they have conquered from and also gave monarchial titles to their tribal chieftains something Arabs don't do.

 

[Gantaal97]

Why would somalis in the semi arid desert unite? For what purpose? What would they gain from uniting? There was no resources in the region. Only livestock. Nomadic people historically united to conquer settled people. There was hardly any settled people in Somalia.

There was plenty of a reason as a united somali kingdom would absolutely have a significant control or influence in trading routes like Indian ocean and Gulf of Aden which have realy made us a powerful kingdom and also the possibility of ending the Habeshi empire by taking muslim lands and the Eritrean coast lines would have reduced the Habeshi kingdoms into becoming vessele states depended on Somalis for their economic survivability

 

[World]

There was plenty of a reason as a united somali kingdom would absolutely have a significant control or influence in trading routes like Indian ocean and Gulf of Aden which have realy made us a powerful kingdom and also the possibility of ending the Habeshi empire by taking muslim lands and the Eritrean coast lines would have reduced the Habeshi kingdoms into becoming vessele states depended on Somalis for their economic survivability

Habesha empires were so far away and isolated from Somalis. We don’t even border them. Also what do nomads know about the ocean? They don’t even eat fish.

 

[Dima&Damo]

Habesha empires were so far away and isolated from Somalis. We don’t even border them. Also what do nomads know about the ocean? They don’t even eat fish.

My Town Eat Everything The Ocean Offers It Is Only People In The Interior Who Shun Sea Food This Notion That All Somalis Hate Sea Food Must Stop

 

[Clllam]

The vast somali semiarid desert is not a good place to build roads, cities, palaces etc. The ajuran sultans ruled the juba and shabelle valleys along with the southern coast so they were lucky enough. Adalites got their food from ethiopia’s highlands so they too were lucky. Warsenglis had some coastal towns in bari and did lots of trade.
Ajuran, Warsangeli, and Adal were separated by a desert with wandering nomads; had there been some good rivers and valleys in galmudug and ogaden, War between these sultunates could've very well happened. Ajuraan was one clan and they were oppressive, I think Adal, which was superior in numbers and military might, might’ve defeated them. With the newly gained land and rich cities, they could’ve won in Ethiopia and dominated the whole horn. If such a thing happened, Somalis, hararis, and Afars been under a single muslims Sultan united under Islam, then we wouldve been rivalling Egypt and Persia.

 

[𐒈𐒈𐒆𐒍]

A unified Somali people or a nation under one rule was never a popular idea among Somali various qabils who favored to rule for themselves and driving away other qabils during expansionist campaigns instead of absorbing them in their kingdoms like Arab tribes do, the idea of Somalweyne only got support among the populace after ww2 especially when Hawd Reserve Area was given to Ethiopia which prompted the fear of British Somaliland locals that they will be next so they heavily campaigned for a unified somali state that will protect the somali people from any Ethiopian expansionist move.

That and mussolinis 1936 Somalia Grande ideology the south was indoctrinated with gave birth to unified somalia. It was doomed to fail as it was not a natural unity, maybe if somalis spent time working their form of rule instead of using using inherented ones and a constitution not based on xeer it could have worked.

 

[Som]

Does Somalia have many examples of unified statehood in its history excluding the post-colonial period up until the civil war?

I'm aware of the existence of multiple kingdoms and sultanates in Somali history but I'm pretty sure this was more of a decentralised sort of rule.

Adal was the closest thing to uniting Somalis, all other sultanates were either clan based or locally based.
The whole idea of Somalia uniting politically waa started by Sayyid Mohamed who actively engaged in talks with Somalis from all over somaliweyn to fight the British and the Italians . The dervish state was the first clearly pan Somali project

 

[Som]

That and mussolinis 1936 Somalia Grande ideology the south was indoctrinated with gave birth to unified somalia. It was doomed to fail as it was not a natural unity, maybe if somalis spent time working their form of rule instead of using using inherented ones and a constitution not based on xeer it could have worked.

That's a lie. The idea of unifying Somalia started with the Sayyid. He was a northener but tried to unite with southern and central clans to fight the brits.
The political idea of somaliweyn was inspired by the darwish, Italy United some Somali territories but everything was under their control. The key idea of somaliweyn is one country for all Somalis ruled by Somalis. Somaliweyn is more natural than the fake colonial borders in Africa, pan Somalis is truly an anticolonialist statement cause it opposes those arbitrary borders

 

[Gantaal97]

That's a lie. The idea of unifying Somalia started with the Sayyid. He was a northener but tried to unite with southern and central clans to fight the brits.
The political idea of somaliweyn was inspired by the darwish, Italy United some Somali territories but everything was under their control. The key idea of somaliweyn is one country for all Somalis ruled by Somalis. Somaliweyn is more natural than the fake colonial borders in Africa, pan Somalis is truly an anticolonialist statement cause it opposes those arbitrary borders

The sayyid wasn't pan somalian as you think he was as during that time no somali knew or cared about what a unified somali state is theyall cared about coming together under islamic rule bringing all muslims together that what the Sayyid and his followers had in their mind regardless all the killings and looting the daraawiish forces did to nomad somalis

 

[0117]

That's a lie. The idea of unifying Somalia started with the Sayyid. He was a northener but tried to unite with southern and central clans to fight the brits.
The political idea of somaliweyn was inspired by the darwish, Italy United some Somali territories but everything was under their control. The key idea of somaliweyn is one country for all Somalis ruled by Somalis. Somaliweyn is more natural than the fake colonial borders in Africa, pan Somalis is truly an anticolonialist statement cause it opposes those arbitrary borders

Unite with southern & central clans to fight Brits who only mandated Berbera whilst they themselves were brutally colonised by Italy
I guess killing sheikh Uways Al-Barawi and signing treaties with Italy was part of Somaliweyn?


Somaliweyn is a fascist concept birthed by Benito Mussolini and later pushed by Ernest Bevin after WW2.

 

[Bundasliga]

Unite with southern & central clans to fight Brits who only mandated Berbera whilst they themselves were brutally colonised by Italy
I guess killing sheikh Uways Al-Barawi and signing treaties with Italy was part of Somaliweyn?


Somaliweyn is a fascist concept birthed by Benito Mussolini and later pushed by Ernest Bevin after WW2.

Calling somaliweyn fascism meanwhile pushing your qabil supremacy into minority clans.

The clans against the idea of unification amongst ALL Somalis fear that they loose power & can't dominate smaller anymore. Somaliweyn is a concept empowering all Somalis minorities clans & most fair.

Funnily enough the same people expand their qabil domintaion wherever they can Djibouti,puntland,somaliland jubbaland etc.. Hence why they against somaliweyn.

Unlike somaliland & Djibouti former Italian Somaliland atleast split into at least 3 & has no reminisce of the colonial borders

 

[Dima&Damo]

Calling somaliweyn fascism meanwhile pushing your qabil supremacy into minority clans.

The clans against the idea of unification amongst ALL Somalis fear that they loose power & can't dominate smaller anymore. Somaliweyn is a concept empowering all Somalis minorities clans & most fair.

Funnily enough the same people expand their qabil domintaion wherever they can Djibouti,puntland,somaliland jubbaland etc.. Hence why they against somaliweyn.

Unlike somaliland & Djibouti former Italian Somaliland atleast split into at least 3 & has no reminisce of the colonial borders

Who Would You Say Is Against Somaliyeeweyn Apart From The Triangle State

 

[0117]

Calling somaliweyn fascism meanwhile pushing your qabil supremacy into minority clans.

The clans against the idea of unification amongst ALL Somalis fear that they loose power & can't dominate smaller anymore. Somaliweyn is a concept empowering all Somalis minorities clans & most fair.

Funnily enough the same people expand their qabil domintaion wherever they can Djibouti,puntland,somaliland jubbaland etc.. Hence why they against somaliweyn.

Unlike somaliland & Djibouti former Italian Somaliland atleast split into at least 3 & has no reminisce of the colonial borders

Somaliland expanding qabil domination?
Explain that for us?

 

[Bundasliga]

Somaliland expanding qabil domination?
Explain that for us?

Somaliland in itself was & is a forced unification started during colonial times.

Pull out the maps of Somali territory & all the territory clans used to inhabited & still inhabiting .
Ask anyone from somaliland that doesnt share your clan

How are you against forced unification amongst all Somalis, but support forced unification & domination in your federal state ?

 

[Bundasliga]

Who Would You Say Is Against Somaliyeeweyn Apart From The Triangle State

Somaliweyn doesnt include afars.
If you mean them .
The truth is Djibouti is majority afar territory & again forced unification started during colonial times. Nearly all problems of us started with colonialism.

 

[Som]

Unite with southern & central clans to fight Brits who only mandated Berbera whilst they themselves were brutally colonised by Italy
I guess killing sheikh Uways Al-Barawi and signing treaties with Italy was part of Somaliweyn?


Somaliweyn is a fascist concept birthed by Benito Mussolini and later pushed by Ernest Bevin after WW2.

The sayyid forces reached as far as beledweyne. He is the roots of pan somalism

 

[Som]

The sayyid wasn't pan somalian as you think he was as during that time no somali knew or cared about what a unified somali state is theyall cared about coming together under islamic rule bringing all muslims together that what the Sayyid and his followers had in their mind regardless all the killings and looting the daraawiish forces did to nomad somalis

He wanted to bring SOMALI Muslims together. If this was about just muslims he would have tried to include afars, hararis, eastern oromos etc.
Read any book about Somali history and you will know somaliweyn was envisioned by the SYL with the inspiration from the Sayyid

 

[Som]

To say somaliweyn was invented by Italians is incorrect.
Somaliweyn as an idea is very nationalist and anticolonialist while the "Grande somalia" project by the Italians was just a big colonial province for somalis.
SYL wanted one country ruled by Somalis, the Italians wanted one province in east Africa inhabited by Somalis but rules by the colonial occupation forces.
If Ethiopia conquered all of Somalia, NFD and Djibouti and created a Somali province there would you say ethiopia is pro somaliweyn? Of course not.
Saying somaliweyn is a colonial idea is like saying white people invented panAfricanism or panarabism because they conquered and occupied all African and Arabs nations