Muslim senator in Australia banned and intimidated by her circle for her pro-Palestine stance, Muslim Party was formed

[Kizaru]

This guy's British, not even Australian, but has the audacity to barge in with his baseless doom-and-gloom arguments even going as far as calling me out for being naive when I'm older than him, kulaha "You have to understand that life isn't all blue skies and soft clouds, it is much more than that"

How old are you?
"You have to understand that life isn't all blue skies and soft clouds, it is much more than that"
Because it is. I said the same thing to the somalis in nariobi who were getting their shops looted. Its a known fact, if your against yhe yahuud standard you wont get anywhere.
You have neither money or influence to decide.
Even if your older, your not immune for being naive.
You cant chimp out and tell me to hide my comments when im saying the reality on the ground is much more real then the pr you see shes winning online

 

[DojaKhat]

Why would i put spoilers to the truth
You care too much what other people think.
Shes better off putting that 200k to support her people. Its a lose lose situation in with these gaalo so theres no point in trying

How old are you?
"You have to understand that life isn't all blue skies and soft clouds, it is much more than that"
Because it is. I said the same thing to the somalis in nariobi who were getting their shops looted. Its a known fact, if your against yhe yahuud standard you wont get anywhere.
You have neither money or influence to decide.
Even if your older, your not immune for being naive.
You cant chimp out and tell me to hide my comments when im saying the reality on the ground is much more real then the pr you see shes winning online

 

[Kizaru]

View attachment 333565

it was 3 sentences. Ofc you wouldnt

 

[DojaKhat]

it was 3 sentences. Ofc you wouldnt

Because I've come to understand that you're incredibly ignorant on not only the topic at hand, but on how the world works in a broader sense and have decided from this point onwards, not to waste my energy on you because you've shown a massive lack of self-awareness that just can't be helped.

I mean, what were you thinking telling older Australian users that they don't know how their own senator is being perceived in real life so brazenly when you live on the other side of the globe? Just hold your L and move on.

 

[munaad]

@Kizaru warya forget about australian politics and go vote for your country

 

[Kizaru]

Because I've come to understand that you're incredibly ignorant on not only the topic at hand, but on how the world works in a broader sense and have decided from this point onwards, not to waste my energy on you because you've shown a massive lack of self-awareness that just can't be helped.

I mean, what were you thinking telling older Australian users that they don't know how their own senator is being perceived in real life so brazenly when you live on the other side of the globe? Just hold your L and move on.

ignorant in what sense lol. You can be 50, i will still critize you. Iv noticed, everytime someone actually hold you to contempt you chimp out, and go on a rampage. Your chimping out because i dont agree with your opinion. Am i not allowed to hold a opinion on a forum which i joined before you
Your acting like your 70 years older then me if you are older then me then i suggest getting a job, even i have one
I told the politician to stop trying on grounds where the whole foundation is against you, it didnt require a response from you.

 

[DojaKhat]

ignorant in what sense lol. You can be 50, i will still critize you. Iv noticed, everytime someone actually hold you to contempt you chimp out, and go on a rampage. Your chimping out because i dont agree with your opinion. Am i not allowed to hold a opinion on a forum which i joined before you
Your acting like your 70 years older then me if you are older then me then i suggest getting a job, even i have one
I told the politician to stop trying on grounds where the whole foundation is against you, it didnt require a response from you.

That's the thing - there is no subjectivity here so your opinion as a non-Australian who didn't even know who Senator Payman was until 24 hours ago means absolutely f*ck all.

It's a matter of correct or incorrect and you're just embarrassingly wrong.

You keep going on about how "She's only winning online" (which implies you live here but you don't) but @Periplus and I have already told you that really isn't the case.

She's receiving heaps of support from the general public in real life as indicated by the polls you can read online and the backlash this has all gotten here. The whole reason why this is even a media spectacle here in the first place is because many Australians here are shocked that democracy is being undermined like this in a way they see as limited to US politics with the higher frequency of lobbying and "buying politicians" over there.

Furthermore, we've had several liberal/left-wing senators in our Parliament of various Muslim backgrounds who have successfully made it in their ethnic-filled areas and haven't been removed from the House of Representatives or the Senate as immediately as you make it out to be for making the slightest sympathetic statement about the Palestinians.

For example, this is Senator Mehreen Faruqi from NSW and is from Pakistan originally. She's with the Greens which isn't one of our two major parties (Labour and Liberal, who are like the Tories you have in the UK) but it's one of the largest factions of our minor parties who advocate for a lot of left-wing policies here. She did a whole speech condemning Labour for not doing enough for the people in Gaza but she's still there representing her party in her region.



Next time, don't speak on matters you know nothing of.

 

[Kizaru]

That's the thing - there is no subjectivity here so your opinion as a non-Australian who didn't even know who Senator Payman was until 24 hours ago means absolutely f*ck all.

It's a matter of correct or incorrect and you're just embarrassingly wrong.

You keep going on about how "She's only winning online" (which implies you live here but you don't) but @Periplus and I have already told you that really isn't the case.

She's receiving heaps of support from the general public in real life as indicated by the polls you can read online and the backlash this has all gotten here. The whole reason why this is even a media spectacle here in the first place is because many Australians here are shocked that democracy is being undermined like this in a way they see as limited to US politics with the higher frequency of lobbying and "buying politicians" over there.

Furthermore, we've had several liberal/left-wing senators in our Parliament of various Muslim backgrounds who have successfully made it in their ethnic-filled areas and haven't been removed from the House of Representatives or the Senate as immediately as you make it out to be for making the slightest sympathetic statement about the Palestinians.

For example, this is Senator Mehreen Faruqi from NSW and is from Pakistan originally. She's with the Greens which isn't one of our two major parties (Labour and Liberal, who are like the Tories you have in the UK) but it's one of the largest factions of our minor parties who advocate for a lot of left-wing policies here. She did a whole speech condemning Labour for not doing enough for the people in Gaza but she's still there representing her party in her region.



Next time, don't speak on matters you know nothing of.

haye

 

[JustSomeGuy]

Now we’re in 2024 and the Muslim senator has spoken up. She’s now a seasoned politician, having been in her third year and can now make a mark.

She calls what’s happening a genocide and criticises her party leader, the PM directly.

Important to note, the Labor party isn’t a conscience party. You have to toe the party line or get expelled. There is no room for personal opinion if it doesn’t align with the collective. (There is a historical reason dating back to unionism but tldr)

Anyways, the Greens call a vote in the Senate to recognise Palestine. The government request that they add some language to not put a time frame on it, they refuse and Fatima Payman joins the Greens on their motion.

Normally she would be expelled but the PM realised that he would be cooked. Muslims almost exclusively vote Labor and so do Christian Arabs and they are a very big group in Labor strongholds. Kicking her out is to say that he rejects her and by extension them.

So he gives her a warning. She goes on television and is asked if she would do it again and says yes. So he suspends her from taking part in party processes until she “agrees with party policy” but doesn’t expel her.

This basically threw Australian politics into chaos, the prime minister, his ministers all started getting questioned in the media, their socials started getting a lot of comments supporting the senator and it looks like they missed the mark.

Then media reports came out that a Muslim group is planning on targeting the government in many of their safe seats.

The PM claimed in parliament that the senator has plotted this stunt to set up a Muslim Party and hit job articles about the senator are now swirling.

Long story short: She has now resigned from the party, everyone is pissed at the government because they see them as hypocrites and the government is oblivious to how mad everyone is rn.

Arabs causing trouble in a western country once again lol, and these people wonder why the West dislikes them.

 

[Periplus]

Arabs causing trouble in a western country once again lol, and these people wonder why the West dislikes them.

She’s Afghan…..

 

[JustSomeGuy]

She’s Afghan…..

Close enough

 

[The alchemist]

Polls show in Australia that majority of people are not pro-Israel and more people support Palestine.

These are just fringe accounts on the internet..

Liberal Australians (irrespective of the "nuances" of the sides of the general political bodies) have "sympathy" for Palestinians but structurally and ideologically support Israel. This is the bottom line and why Israel runs amok. The Western world is imperialist deep down, their guilt never overwhelms that. Look how Europe paid empty signaling of virtue (that always knowingly shows underwhelming consequence) to the plight of Palestinians for a long time and then suddenly gave unconditional support of weapons to bomb women and children right after the Hamas attack, doubling down when the death tolls rose. That sympathy is always thin and used for moral narcissistic self-preservation to not become total schizophrenic, more so for self-image than for Palestinians (true resolve is not found).

But you're one of those well-to-do activist youth who thinks change is around the corner with the momentum of the children of those parents who rule the nation (that you will see calibrate over the years towards the mean Overton Window). Sorry to break it to you, but those polls have little bearing on deep policy. Those things stay consistent for the most part. Australia has in the past even made claims that the UN was too "harsh" on Israel. It has "security" relationships with Israel. These are compromising activities. I will deal with hard truths rather than flimsy one-moment opinions of polls that change with the seasons and are never conclusively exclusive of the support for the extant Israeli structural existence.

This finds roots in deep ideological Western imperial history that is far from unique to Australia, as every Western nation shares a similar disposition and is constantly reinforced by the notions of shared "values." I don't have time to go into that now. All you need to know is that all the realities are based on over a century-old historical continuity, where the legacy of that is the matter discussed.

 

[Periplus]

Liberal Australians (irrespective of the "nuances" of the sides of the general political bodies) have "sympathy" for Palestinians but structurally and ideologically support Israel. This is the bottom line and why Israel runs amok. The Western world is imperialist deep down, their guilt never overwhelms that. Look how Europe paid empty signaling of virtue (that always knowingly shows underwhelming consequence) to the plight of Palestinians for a long time and then suddenly gave unconditional support of weapons to bomb women and children right after the Hamas attack, doubling down when the death tolls rose. That sympathy is always thin and used for moral narcissistic self-preservation to not become total schizophrenic, more so for self-image than for Palestinians (true resolve is not found).

But you're one of those well-to-do activist youth who thinks change is around the corner with the momentum of the children of those parents who rule the nation (that you will see calibrate over the years towards the mean Overton Window). Sorry to break it to you, but those polls have little bearing on deep policy. Those things stay consistent for the most part. Australia has in the past even made claims that the UN was too "harsh" on Israel. It has "security" relationships with Israel. These are compromising activities. I will deal with hard truths rather than flimsy one-moment opinions of polls that change with the seasons and are never conclusively exclusive of the support for the extant Israeli structural existence.

This finds roots in deep ideological Western imperial history that is far from unique to Australia, as every Western nation shares a similar disposition and is constantly reinforced by the notions of shared "values." I don't have time to go into that now. All you need to know is that all the realities are based on over a century-old historical continuity, where the legacy of that is the matter discussed.

I am not even going to bother responding to this yappa yappa when you don’t live in Australia nor have any knowledge about our politics.

It’s very clear from the first sentence that you know nothing about Australia.

Liberals is the term used for conservatives/Tories in Australia.

 

[The alchemist]

I am not even going to bother responding to this yappa yappa when you don’t live in Australia nor have any knowledge about our politics.

It’s very clear from the first sentence that you know nothing about Australia.

Liberals is the term used for conservatives/Tories in Australia.

Look at you. You quoted me on nonsense trying to paint a lie to people, then responded without respect to my text that put some minor effort into what you quoted me on in sincerity. That is why most of you forum losers deserve to be slapped across the face since your parents did not teach you enough manners, it seems.

I am going to correct you once again on your dishonesty and end it there since you are a character who lacks understanding of anything beyond your nose. And I would appreciate you don't quote me again. You clearly set the precedent for this but since you cannot engage in an adult conversation clearly, thus you drive the conversation to the lowest mean instead of showing humility by gracefully exiting when some people say things you don't carry prior knowledge of or have the self-respect to concede for. But I will take a mental note and remember that you're never worth responding to next time. That is fair.

Now, on to the reasons that will be final:

Liberals as in progressive and classical liberalism. We're talking ideology of the whole lot spanning the far majority of the political spectrum in the entire West. This is the number one driving bottom line of Israel's existence irrespective of nation-line or perceived internal nuance. But of course, you would not understand, you're an activist type; you never do things beyond having high enthusiasm about superficial things that lack depth. That's why you quoted me, trying to sell nonsense when the actual reality agrees with everything I wrote. It has clear ideological rooted support since Western imperialism functionally formed from the colonialist model, which your country was fully part of, being a willing participant and subsidiary of the British empire and it has that legacy based on its role in the Middle East since all Western countries transformed their imperialistic ideology into the Western value-chain of today that is mostly in agreement based on the liberalistic concept that also was the core of the ideals since the colonialist era. This includes Israel for a fact, as a material manifestation of such continuing evolving phenomena that have a strong consistent chain. That is why it was no coincidence that Australia was the first country to recognize Israel as a country, and here you are trying to make it seem like an exceptional neutral ground for the battle of conflicting ideals when it has never been historically or now. You have to have some shame.

As I said again, this is a Westernist-rooted cause. It has always been so; 100 years ago and now. You know this to be true if you're not too far outside the needed knowledge provisions and lack the decency to admit it. If you are clueless, Zionism was based on liberalistic colonial-imperialistic principles since Theodore Herzl was a big proponent (a fan) of these European nations and their action toward "liberalizing" the "savages" of the world. That is why he, being the father of what ideologically became Israel, shaped the core of its principles on being a Western instrumental imperialist peripheral embodiment and ally, an extension of it. That is why Israel always had support from the Western world because it played that role, inherently in its functions. There is plenty of literature on this.

You have scholarships that back everything I say. What Israel is today, what it means for the West, was always inherent to its construction. You can keep lying by saying I yap trying to undermine my takes, but that means only you're the fool who lacks a serious perspective on the matter. Your takes serve to convince impressionable children. What you are in truth is a stooge of Australia, trying to not only wash its history but also the true realities of its persistent legacy that drive the entire practical actions just to give some positive projections. That makes you an evil sellout who subverts the truth for a comforting lie that has plagued this discourse while people are getting killed in Palestine or a tool that does the same but you're less deliberately evil but sadly not knowledgable enough to hold a responsible conversation on this.

And what the actual polls say is that 49% of Australians think no one should take sides on the matter of the Israeli genocide actions toward Palestinians. This is very different from what you tried to dishonestly paint. No action means that half of the Australian poll participants, and we are not counting the ones who side with Israel, a section that amounts to a significant number (2% short of ones who believe more should be done for Palestine (note that this does not mean not support Israel's current existence or that it should fundamentally change)), believe Palestinians don't have sufficient conditions to be sided with; the typical both-sides symmetry is usually a tactic that gives considerable weight to Israel without trying to seem like a monster but it is in support of the status quo to play itself out since they are practically morally unconvinced of the Palestinian cause that is apparently just., i.e., Israel doing the damage on Palestinians. This is the typical passive Westernism in action letting Israel do what it has for decades upon decades.

Almost half of Australians (49%) say the Australian Government should ‘not take sides’ in the current crisis in Israel and Gaza - Roy Morgan Research

www.roymorgan.com

But I know your kind. You are misrepresenting the polls:

This...

Does not mean being for Palestine or against Israel. You need to learn how to read polls.

Only 40% believe Israel should withdraw after all. Poll statistics are very particular in what they say, so you cannot extrapolate one sentiment from one thing towards another, which is clearly demonstrated here -- and if you remember, it was the first thing I responded to you with when you said I have no clue. Namely, feeling a circumstantial need to help Gazans which is mostly temporally provincial, does not mean that Australians want Israelis to reconstruct their state, so it stops the genocidal model they've had for many decades. In fact, evidence points to the contrary of what I also showed you, with how they have security relationships with Israel, sell fighter jets, and participate in its military economy for their self-gain that only exists to kill innocent, displace, and take over land...

And further, withdrawing from Gaza does not even mean being against Israel in its entirety. Watch them change sentiment when you place a condition on the poll question:

Do you think Israel's current model of operation is inexorably the cause of the genocide and thus, do you think we should pressure them to revert back to the 1967 border, and let Palestinians get a state that allows it an army? And/or become one nation where total democracy is set in place, where Israel cannot be the Jewish nation, where Zionism is abolished?

I will tell your naive arse right now, that the number that would respond in support for that in its entirety, would be low. Support for withdrawal from Gaza does not mean support for that hypothetical poll question, and the hypothetical poll question is the bare minimum to stop the conflict. If you think so, then you're frankly a liar trying to deceive people. The majority of Westerners believe the current operations of Israel are principally correct in its state framework but excessive in its projections. Exessivness is their only main problem. They don't even recognize that the issue is the underlying functions. But once you sus out the question that would require Israel to mold itself differently, watch Westerners get defensive. Most of those people do buy into that MENA is a savage land and Israel is its child.

You're one of those people who try to paint yourself as a leftist, I think. But I bet if you went and read Chomsky, something akin to what I wrote would pop up. I have not read his texts on this particular issue, but I know most left-leaning scholars, and I mean the serious ones, share a similar synthesis of things for the underlying problem of why the West (and this does not exempt Australia as you sort of naively think) have persistently supported Israel.

I'm going to leave you with this as you needed correction and end it here. But remember, teach yourself some discipline when you talk to people. Don't quote people without expecting to be held accountable for your words instead of being the equivalent of a floozy rolling her eyes. It's filthy behavior and reflects on your character as a man.

 

[Periplus]

I would appreciate you don't quote me again.

Writes this and then proceeds to write over 1400 words (yes I counted) directed at me.

But I will bite your bait and respond back....

 

[The alchemist]

Writes this and then proceeds to write over 1400 words (yes I counted) directed at me.

But I will bite your bait and respond back....

Nah, you don't need to. I gave you chance earlier. Now f*ck off.

I wrote that for the others but also set a correction on your BS from previously. You can write what you want but you're going to double down. You disqualified yourself from baring the standard for this topic and neither do you deserve my patience to school you through this as what I wrote already should have been enough for you to reflect on.

 

[Periplus]

Nah, you don't need to. I gave you chance earlier. Now f*ck off.

I wrote that for the others but also set a correction on your BS from previously. You can write what you want but you're going to double down. You disqualified yourself from baring the standard for this topic and neither do you deserve my patience to school you through this as what I wrote already should have been enough for you to reflect on.

You dedicate quite a large portion of your lengthy post to highlight my supposed "lack of manners" in addressing you. Meanwhile, in that same response, you resorted to mentioning my parents, providing an elementary level psychoanalysis and numerous ad-hominems.

All I did to warrant this was write three lines saying (in jest) that you were yapping. Seems like you were hurt that I did not take your "political analysis" seriously. You clearly seem like an intelligent individual, maybe my quick dismissal of your "hot take" irked you so much to write 1400 words. For that, I apologise, I will make sure to address your needs better in the future.

 

[Periplus]

As for your other points @The alchemist

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