New Nubian genetic study [Christian Early Medieval Period]

[Asaana]

I didn't say he isn't nubian. I said he had arab blood like most nubians. Some have more some have less.
Anwar Al sadat was nubian (half sudanese) but it's obvious he had arab admixture as well

Yeah but in Sudanese society you only acknowledge your fathers lineage, many Nubians have multiple non-Nubian female ancestors ranging from Turkey, Egypt, Syria, Greece, etc but they do not claim any of those ancestries.

 

[Som]

Still haven't read it entirely, lol, but in it they postulate theories that current Nubians and Sudanese Arabs have admixture from Nilotes and Arabians that those Medieval Christian Nubians did not have. It is somewhere in the study.

Still haven't read it entirely, lol, but in it they postulate theories that current Nubians and Sudanese Arabs have admixture from Nilotes and Arabians that those Medieval Christian Nubians did not have. It is somewhere in the study.

Which also raises another question. Why did the medieval nubian adopt a nilosaharian language (old nubian is confirmed nilosaharian) if they are basically only 40% nilotic?
I think this study shouldn't really be used to talk about nubians in general

 

[Apollo]

Which also raises another question. Why did the medieval nubian adopt a nilosaharian language (old nubian is confirmed nilosaharian) if they are basically only 40% nilotic?
I think this study shouldn't really be used to talk about nubians in general

Historians and anthropologists are still not sure when exactly Nubians adopted a Nilo-Saharan language. It could be much older than we think.

 

[Som]

Yeah but in Sudanese society you only acknowledge your fathers lineage, many Nubians have multiple non-Nubian female ancestors ranging from Turkey, Egypt, Syria, Greece, etc but they do not claim any of those ancestries.

Of course but if we are talking about the "original" nubians from

Historians and anthropologists are still not sure when exactly Nubians adopted a Nilo-Saharan language. It could be much older than we think.

Anyway they said : The rise (∼300 BCE) and collapse (∼350 CE) of the Meroitic Kingdom in Nubia provides a possible historical context for admixture between Egyptian peoples carrying West Eurasian-related ancestry and local Nubians (who may also have already had some amount of West Eurasian-related ancestry by this time, a process that would be further clarified by additional ancient DNA analysis of older individuals from Nubia).

If i got this correctly the west eurasian thing in these nubians was probably introduced after the fall of meroe. The study also said : Thus, despite a superficial resemblance on our PCA, present-day Nubian populations are not descended directly from a population related to the earlier Kulubnarti Nubians without additional admixture following the Christian Period.

Again if i got this correctly they are saying modern nubians are not direct descendants of these medieval nubians

 

[Som]

Historians and anthropologists are still not sure when exactly Nubians adopted a Nilo-Saharan language. It could be much older than we think.

We don't know exactly because merotic is still debated but we know for sure that old nubian is nilosaharian and that they started speaking old nubian by 4th century AD.
Anyway this makes the whole ancient nubian ancestry even more interesting. I expect pre christian nubian kushites to be more nilotic shifted

 

[Apollo]

@Som

We will have to wait for more ancient DNA studies from that area. IMO, I think they will be similar over time. Perhaps only the sub-type of Eurasian/Mediterranean autosomal affinity changes. More Taforalt/Natufian-like the earlier you go and more Neolithic Anatolian/Iranian and modern Arabian the closer to modern times.

 

[Asaana]

@Som
Darfur itself is very diverse, here are the people of North Darfur:

 

[Apollo]

Honestly it's kinda like if you used benadiris as an example of how somalis look.
Most nubians are distinct from arabs, those who look arab are actually mostly recently admixed people.
For example Anwar al sadat was nubian, but he was mixed
Nubian people:

The people in that video were nearly all Nubians. Some people have a wrong perception of what Nubians look like (just look at that 'big nose' silly comment in the second page).

 

[Mujahid Nur Marehan]

I read some where that the pure Nilotic language was at time considered Afro asiatic language by scientist. So when they mix with races they produce proto somali.

 

[Apollo]

I read some where that the pure Nilotic language was at time considered Afro asiatic language by scientist. So when they mic with races they produce proto somali.

Sources?

It was never considered Afro-Asiatic.

Some linguists however criticize that Nilo-Saharan is just a ''left over'' language family where everything that is not Niger-Congo nor Afro-Asiatic is thrown in.

 

[Mujahid Nur Marehan]

Sources?

It was never considered Afro-Asiatic.

Some linguists however criticize that Nilo-Saharan is just a ''left over'' language family where everything that is not Niger-Congo nor Afro-Asiatic is thrown in.

Yes that's what I meant.

 

[Som]

The people in that video were nearly all Nubians. Some people have a wrong perception of what Nubians look like (just look at that 'big nose' silly comment in the second page).

My point is, aren't these people mixed with arabs? If they are they aren't representative of nubians in general

 

[-adobe_7853]

My point is, aren't these people mixed with arabs? If they are they aren't representative of nubians in general

Nubians and members of the major sudani arab tribes are phenotypically indistinguishable by the eye. The difference is sudani arabs have an arab paternal lineage and do not speak a Nubian language.
A nubian would not be mistaken for a darfuri or south Sudanese.

Both Nubians and sudani Arabs cluster closer to cushites like bejas and Ethiopians than Nilotics.

 

[Som]

Nubians and members of the major sudani arab tribes are phenotypically indistinguishable by the eye. The difference is sudani arabs have an arab paternal lineage and do not speak a Nubian language.
A nubian would not be mistaken for a darfuri or south Sudanese.

View attachment 172032View attachment 172033View attachment 172034

Both Nubians and sudani Arabs cluster closer to cushites like bejas and Ethiopians than Nilotics.

I know, I'm talking about some nubians being very light skinned which may be because of arab admixture.
Some darfuris may pass as nubian or sudanese arab, almost impossible for south sudanese.
Anyway my point is that OG nubians are usually dark skinned and look close to horners, the ones who look egyptian have probably more arab blood

 

[Apollo]

My point is, aren't these people mixed with arabs? If they are they aren't representative of nubians in general

They all have Egyptian ancestry. There are no Nubians without it.

 

[Asaana]

They all have Egyptian ancestry. There are no Nubians without it.

In all historically Nubian towns you can still see Copts, ranging from the Egyptian border all the way down to Rabak (southernmost "industrialized" city in Sudan). Their facial features are actually quite different from Arabs.

 

[Som]

In all historically Nubian towns you can still see Copts, ranging from the Egyptian border all the way down to Rabak (southernmost "industrialized" city in Sudan). Their facial features are actually quite different from Arabs.

They look like regular egyptians to me

 

[Asaana]

They look like regular egyptians to me

Well regular Egyptians look distinct from Arabs. Copts are basically the original Egyptians, not Bedouin settlers.

 

[convincation]

Werent the original Egyptians cushites or is that just another myth?

 

[-adobe_7853]

Werent the original Egyptians cushites or is that just another myth?

Cushites have interacted with Egyptians throughout history but they are a separate people.