Somali women, anjabi children: dispelling a pervasive lie.

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Although I agree that culture, language, religion can be passed down through the mother, the Somali identity is inextricably linked with the clan structure which is also the Islamic model. Allah says: Call them by their fathers (Surah Ahzab).

So in that sense, they can be Somali only somewhat culturally, and only through a 0.5 type of cultural assimilation. But they will have no clan because that is passed from the father alone and they will always be categorised separately for better or for worse.

Also the habar and Bah relations between clans is designed to denote a maternal relation and has nothing to do with clan lineages, it only adopts the name identification but is still a paternal clan lineage.

That's the official Somali line, but in reality, plenty of people got absorbed, whose only link to Somalinimo, is through their maternal lineage. And they got adopted by clans, who like to boost their population. For instance, the Boon/Aweer people in South Somalia, and this was during Colonialism, so they've only been 'Somali' for 100+ years.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Somalis whose ancestors are 100% honest about their roots, are "0.5" Somalis.
These are the Shanshis, Banadiris, Barawanis, Bantus, and even Somalised Arabs like Carab Saalax, are politically part of "0.5", and don't claim to be originally Somali.

But there are plenty of people, who are now part of 'major clans', who technically belong to that umbrella. I can literally name the kind of clans that adopted them, but don't want this topic thrown into FKD section.

If we ever had a leader, who wanted to play ethnic purity, some Somali clans would lose a good number of their population.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

It’s very common in many countries, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia UAE etc. Descent is passed from the father not the mother and I don’t see that changing in Somalia especially where there is Qaabil.

This is the correct manner, the Islamic manner. But do Somalis really practise Islam?

I do think that some people are accidental adoptees into clans, and have no idea, maybe they were found as orphans, or their existence is the result of rape or some other haram or even, criminal, event.

But I do believe, that there are people who purposefully claimed lineages that are not theirs, I assume to make their lives easier, to escape discrimination and so forth.

 

[Garaad Hirabu]

Most Somalis might not even know the oness of Allah.

 

[Madaafiic]

Funny thread, there is a reason why there are mainly only 2 dominant male lineages in the Somali populous and a few irregularities here and there whilst there are several female lineages.

Anyway, we live in a different time and place, most women end up conforming to the culture of the man they marry anyway.

 

[World]

As long as they assimilate into somali culture and marry somalis etc then i don’t think it matters

 

[Banadiri Warrior]

Gibil cad is enough proof that Somali women pass down culture. Not to mention DNA testing has proved that some clans like Dir and half of Isxaaq are paternally ajnabi yet we’re obviously Somalis culturally and are even apart of the big 4 clan structure.

Don't think you understand what gibil cad means, it means lightskin ie people of lightskin origin ( Arab & Persians) , gibil cads on the coast intermarried with eachother historically , the interior was were more gibil cad men took wives from Samaale's or Digil clans . Secondly each gibil cad tribe still maintained their culture there's no adopted cushitic or nilotic or omotic culture

 

[Lumo]

I don't really get this debate

Why do these women that marry out constantly beg it?

What's wrong with your children claiming their fathers side?

It's like they are embarrassed and trying to cope with their "controversial marraige". The daqan and deen is very clear on this matter.
The kids probably has the dad's last name nothing wrong with it.

OP is talking about assimilated people and with foregin lineages centuries back. Stuff like that's gets filter out beacuse of generational mixing. Most carab salax would probably get 90% somali on a dna test. We all know clan origin stories like Isaaq and Darood are made up genetics disprove the arab zaddy myth. People back home need to cut it out. Claiming others lineage is haram.

 

[TekNiKo]

I'm a proponent of Somali guur, but I do laugh to myself, when I see Somali men spread lies that half-Somalis, with Somali mothers, don't get absorbed into Somalinimo. That Somali women don't have a lineage and can't pass it on. These are malicious lies and easily dispelled.

In fact, a good number of Somali men, hail from lineages, that are only Somali through the maternal side; as in, they are only Somali, because their maternal ancestor had a child with a foreign man. I suspect a lot of these non-Somali haplogroups entered Somali lands, in the 1500s, when Somalis had wars with the Abyssinnians, and foreign Muslim fighters came to help Somalis.

Even Sheikh Maxamed Idris, is Eritrean paternally, but his mother is Somali, but he's a Somali man, through and through. Mothers tend to be the primary caretaker and pass on the MOTHER tongue, culture and so forth.

If you choose to marry a foreign man, make sure he's better than any Somali man you know, and then pray istikhara, but don't ever let a Somali male bully you into thinking you are not able to pass on your culture and language. All you need is for your half-Somali son/s, to marry Somali women and then the rest is history, in fact, the true history of a lot of Somalis.

Next time you see them coming at some miskeen girl and her foreign hubby with these lies, ask them to take a DNA test first.

Sheekh Maxamed Idriis is a horrible example his father was adopted by Somalis and was raised as Somali.

 

[wheel]

Never got why so many somali women try to raise their mixed kids like a somali kid. Kid needs to value and identify with both sides of his ancestry. Expose the child to that community, ingratiate them with their father's family, encourage them to learn about their culture, language and history.
As for this topic, your referring to clans who were already present in somalia for hundreds/thousands of years, the process of adoption ultimately dilutes the clan that does it anyway. No one really sees rahanweyne's as proper somali anyway.

 

[techsamatar]

Keep coping even European law and every religion the identity and lineage and name gets passed on from the father and it even has something to do with blood and the unseen hence Quran speaks on it.

And majority of Somalis get 99%-100% Somali on ancestry to point its a trend and we are accused of incest when its truly because we are pure semites and was not punished with Persian and roman dilution like Original Arabs.

 

[GaradShabeel]

Never got why so many somali women try to raise their mixed kids like a somali kid. Kid needs to value and identify with both sides of his ancestry. Expose the child to that community, ingratiate them with their father's family, encourage them to learn about their culture, language and history.
As for this topic, your referring to clans who were already present in somalia for hundreds/thousands of years, the process of adoption ultimately dilutes the clan that does it anyway. No one really sees rahanweyne's as proper somali anyway.

No one? Don't speak for us nor on matters you know nothing about! RX as a clan, in particular those with RX lineage, are recognized by everyone as proper Somalis.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Funny thread, there is a reason why there are mainly only 2 dominant male lineages in the Somali populous and a few irregularities here and there whilst there are several female lineages.

Anyway, we live in a different time and place, most women end up conforming to the culture of the man they marry anyway.

Every "irregularity" still represents a group of people, whose population cannot be ignored. In fact, it's mostly your Gabooye people, who have Semitic haplogroups. If we follow the rules set out by the Somali males on here, it's mostly your people that would be disenfranchised from Somalinimo.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Never got why so many somali women try to raise their mixed kids like a somali kid. Kid needs to value and identify with both sides of his ancestry. Expose the child to that community, ingratiate them with their father's family, encourage them to learn about their culture, language and history.
As for this topic, your referring to clans who were already present in somalia for hundreds/thousands of years, the process of adoption ultimately dilutes the clan that does it anyway. No one really sees rahanweyne's as proper somali anyway.

I agree that mixed-people need to embrace both sides of their heritage. Unfortunately, we have prejudiced buffoons, like the language centre mentioned in this topic, that even try to gatekeep the Somali language from Half-Somalis. These are the same type of men, who go online to bully half-Somalis on social media and tell them they are not half of what they are.

Trust me when I say this, it's not just D&M that have adopted people into their ranks.

 

[Bundasliga]

A lot of clans, carry foreign lineages, and should be called "Habar XYZ", if they are being truthful.

You, yourself, could be one of them. Qosolka, oohin miyaa ka dambeeya?

What's your point? Who are the ones passing on those lineages? Exactly
You beating a dead horse . Your abtiris will end with you ,if you like or not.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

What's your point? Who are the ones passing on those lineages? Exactly
You beating a dead horse . Your abtiris will end with you ,if you like or not.

If you actually read my posts, you'd know that I don't care about that.

 

[Journey.]

Don't think you understand what gibil cad means, it means lightskin ie people of lightskin origin ( Arab & Persians) , gibil cads on the coast intermarried with eachother historically , the interior was were more gibil cad men took wives from Samaale's or Digil clans . Secondly each gibil cad tribe still maintained their culture there's no adopted cushitic or nilotic or omotic culture

Gibil cad, bar few, did adopt Somali identity, language and culture. They're not foreign minority groups in Somalia, they're fully assimilated and considered Somali.

 

[Angelina]

Thats the point sheegato are actively deceiving Somalis about their lineage to be Somali. They are transforming their identity to fit the criteria of being Somali. A mix kid who openly states his foreign lineage will not be considered a ethnic Somali for a number of generations

Not necessarily as most people are none the wiser. The way our ancestors saw things is different to how we see things. A foreign man who had children with a Somali woman would be absorbed into the clan to increase numbers. Life was tough and brutal and most of our history is based on qabil wars due to resources. People simply had different priorities. Their descendants are seen as fully Somali now and if you try to dig up the past and yap on about how they’re not Somali, you’d be seen as a mad man.

Different time and different perspective.

 

[Angelina]

Sheekh Maxamed Idriis is a horrible example his father was adopted by Somalis and was raised as Somali.

It isn’t a horrible example since a lot of young Somali men would reject a man like him and find it preposterous that his father was adopted by the Somali community and would question his mother as to why she didn’t migrant to Eritrea and why did she raise her son as a Somali man. That’s how stupid and racist this generation of Somali men are.

 

[Hassan77]

Somali women will just have to cope with the fact if they marry out their children won’t be considered Somali nor will they. Also soon when radicals like myself gain power we will also outlaw any form of citizenship to women who marry out.!!