Sudan autosomal study

[Grant]

Cushites is just an anthropological label and has nothing to do with the Kingdom of Kush. If there was a migration brining this language group it would have been around 10,000-6,000 years ago. Well before any of those civilizations.

Wow. Just wow.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cushite

"Cushite may refer to :

• Cushitic languages
  • the Beja language
  • Agaw languages
  • Highland East Cushitic languages
  • Lowland East Cushitic languages
  • South Cushitic languages
  • Kerma Culture (present-day southern Egypt and northern Sudan).
• the historical Kingdom of Kush
• a biblical tribal name, see Cush (Bible)
• a Hebrew term for "African", see Cushi"

 

[Apollo]

Wow. Just wow.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cushite

"Cushite may refer to

It's just a label for a language family and has no connection to this recent kingdom from 2,000 BC-350 AD.

Cushites were in Tanzania already by 3,000 BC, a thousand years before that Kingdom!

modern Nubians carry a different genetic cluster from Somalis and the Beja. They are not Cushites.

 

[Keo]

The Cushitic language family once covered most of the Nile valley, both Sudan and southern Egypt. Kerma was part of Kush.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cushitic_languages

"The languages spoken in the ancient Kerma Culture (present-day southern Egypt and northern Sudan) also belonged to the Cushitic branch of the Afroasiatic languages.[3][4] The languages spoken in the Savanna Pastoral Neolithic in the Great Lakes region are thought to have belonged to the Cushitic branch of Afroasiatic."

Where did these people go?

I suggest up the Nile, to the Great Lakes region, and from there into southern Ethiopia and points south and east. This would be the E1b1b that came to Somalia from the south. T is most likely from the north, either from the Red Sea hills or across the Red Sea.

Check out the archaeological work at Namoratunga, near Lake Turkana, in Kenya.

They were in Northern Egypt as well.

 

[Apollo]

That wouldn't make sense since the plethora of languages in the afroasiatic family are present in the Horn, which signifies indigenousness. Your theories of afroasiatic or cushtic migration into Ethiopia is absurd with no grounds. The people of the southern nile are not cushtic and have never been.

There's a 4,500 year old Ethiopian sample included in the study. From the Mota cave. He is genetically nothing like Cushites. They invaded the Horn between 10,000 to 4,000 years ago from NE Sudan.

 

[Grant]

There's a 4,500 year old Ethiopian sample included in the study. From the Mota cave. He is genetically nothing like Cushites. They invaded the Horn between 10,000 to 4,000 years ago from NE Sudan.

Mota man was E1b1. He was intermediate to the Ari and Sandawe, Omotic and Khoisanoid peoples. But he was said to have been contemporaneous with early Cushitic settlers.

 

[Apollo]

Mota man was E1b1. He was intermediate to the Ari and Sandawe, Omotic and Khoisanoid peoples. But he was said to have been contemporaneous with early Cushitic settlers.

He clusters even to the South of the Ari and has affinities to the Hadza.
E1b1* is 52,500 years old, that's ages ago.

pre-Cushitic inhabitants of Ethiopia were extremely different from Somalis.

 

[Grant]

He clusters even to the South of the Ari and has affinities to the Hadza.
E1b1* is 52,500 years old, that's ages ago.

pre-Cushitic inhabitants of Ethiopia were extremely different from Somalis.

So you do recognize there was a pre-Cushitic Ethiopia?

 

[World]

He clusters even to the South of the Ari and has affinities to the Hadza.
E1b1* is 52,500 years old, that's ages ago.

pre-Cushitic inhabitants of Ethiopia were extremely different from Somalis.

All Ethiopians have Khoisan and Omotic admixture, but not Somalis. It completely discredits the Southern Ethiopian migration theory to Somalia.

 

[Apollo]

So you do recognize there was a pre-Cushitic Ethiopia?

Yes, but Somalis killed them off and there's no trace of it in Somalia.

 

[Menelik III]

There's a 4,500 year old Ethiopian sample included in the study. From the Mota cave. He is genetically nothing like Cushites. They invaded the Horn between 10,000 to 4,000 years ago from NE Sudan.

The thing is that cushtites did not enter the Horn as cushites, from the Horn they developed into present day languages/people.

 

[Apollo]

The thing is that cushtites did not enter the Horn as cushites, from the Horn they developed into present day languages/people.

Cushites carry admixture from the Natufians and the Iranian Neolithic.. They are not the paleolithic natives of the region, but NE Sudanese invaders.

 

[Grant]

Yes, but Somalis killed them off and there's no trace of it in Somalia.

Interesting. What about the Eyle and Gogoshiis Qabe?

 

[Apollo]

Interesting. What about the Eyle and Gogoshiis Qabe?

They are just normal Somalis with primitive lifestyles, not Omotic/HG, and possibly may have introgressed with Maroon Bantus.

 

[Merca]

They are just normal Somalis with primitive lifestyles, not Omotic/HG, and possibly may have introgressed with Maroon Bantus.

I thought Eyle had a Khoisan admixture?

 

[Ferrari]

interesting thread. Where can I read more about this stuff?
I know very little to nothing, baby steps.

 

[Grant]

All Ethiopians have Khoisan and Omotic admixture, but not Somalis. It completely discredits the Southern Ethiopian migration theory to Somalia.

Not necessarily. The T clans in the north are relatively pure after what is likely a longer period of time. The Somalis preceded the Oromo and other Cushitic groups and may have moved through the Omo area quickly. Endogamy has been a powerful force among Somalis. Just look at the threads in this place!

 

[Menelik III]

Cushites carry admixture from the Natufians and the Iranian Neolithic.. They are not the paleolithic natives of the region, but NE Sudanese invaders.

What I'm saying is that The Proto-Afroasiatic people that migrated into the Horn went through rapid diversification forming cushites in the Horn (not before). So technically Cushite and associated groups are thus native to the Horn.

I haven't really looked into it but I wonder if they encountered any people in the Horn ie hunter gatherers etc before the diversification and formations of said groups.

 

[Menelik III]

Not necessarily. The T clans in the north are relatively pure after what is likely a longer period of time. The Somalis preceded the Oromo and other Cushitic groups and may have moved through the Omo area quickly. Endogamy has been a powerful force among Somalis. Just look at the threads in this place!

Unsubstantiated.

 

[Apollo]

What I'm saying is that The Proto-Afroasiatic people that migrated into the Horn went through rapid diversification forming cushites. So technically Cushite and associated groups are thus native to the Horn.

I haven't really looked into it but I wonder if they encountered any people in the Horn ie hunter gatherers etc before the diversification and formations of said groups.

That's a semantics game and nit-picking, but you get the point, they came from the area somewhere between Egypt and Eritrea. They definitely didn't come from Ethiopia that's for sure.

I thought Eyle had a Khoisan admixture?

No evidence of Khoisan admixture in Somalia. Somalis are the least hunter-gatherer like of all Horn African groups, even less than the Tigre-Tigray.

 

[XoosBoos]

They are just normal Somalis with primitive lifestyles, not Omotic/HG, and possibly may have introgressed with Maroon Bantus.

Eyle a khoisanoids, they are a very miniority. The earliest inhabitants of South, whom are the Sab Somalis, they said the hunter gatherer eyle are like nomads but walk long distances to find prey. So they are not native to any land.