Sudan autosomal study

[Menelik III]

That's a semantics game and nit-picking, but you get the point, they came from the area somewhere between Egypt and Eritrea. They definitely didn't come from Ethiopia that's for sure.



No evidence of Khoisan admixture in Somalia. Somalis are the least hunter-gatherer like of all Horn African groups, even less than the Tigre-Tigray.

They most likely formed in northern Ethiopia/Eritrea before heading your way.

 

[XoosBoos]

@Amun Eyle are whole complete ethnic group. They are not Somalis or bantus. They are hunter gatherer whom are complete different to the Hadza. They are like bushman. How they ended up in Somalia is very hard to find out.

 

[Grant]

Eyle a khoisanoids, they are a very miniority. The earliest inhabitants of South, whom are the Sab Somalis, they said the hunter gatherer eyle are like nomads but walk long distances to find prey. So they are not native to any land.

The archaeological record at Buur Heybe goes back to the middle stone age. Seems native enough to me.

 

[Apollo]

They most likely formed in northern Ethiopia/Eritrea before heading your way.

The Agaw group of Cushites (proto-Habesha ancestors) kept having contact with Egypt and Northeast Sudan, as they have certain Coptic/Egyptian markers lackining in LE Cushites and S Cushites.

 

[XoosBoos]

The archaeological record at Buur Heybe goes back to the middle stone age. Seems native enough to me.

There found archaeological records of pre-nomadic people in Balcad and Bay area of Somalia who are very similar to ones in Laas geel? Eyle are not native to Somalia. They must be remnants of Khoisanoids from South East Africa.

 

[Apollo]

The land of Punt was most likely West Eritrea/Northwest Ethiopia.

It's embarrassing how Puntland hijacked this name. Sort of like Ghana.

 

[XoosBoos]

The archaeological record at Buur Heybe goes back to the middle stone age. Seems native enough to me.

There found rock arts in moutains of Buur Heybe like in Laas geel. Again your theory is wrong.

 

[Apollo]

What are the oldest human remains found in Somalia?

I'm not into archaeology. Perhaps they can test pre-Somali bones in Somalia from before 5000 BC.

 

[XoosBoos]

What are the oldest human remains found in Somalia?

I'm not into archaeology. Perhaps they can test pre-Somali bones in Somalia from before 5000 BC.

Not sure. But Eyle can't be natives. There are no remains of their settlements in any parts of Somalia. The archeological findings haven't been published but this what the locals say. "Another local rock shelter is referred to as Abka Eeden I Oboy Haawo ("Adam and Eve's court"). In addition, several rock formations in the area feature cave art"

 

[Grant]

There found rock arts in moutains of Buur Heybe like in Laas geel. Again your theory is wrong.

What has that got to do with anything? Las Gaal is Ethio-Arabian, much too early to be related to Samaales.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laas_Geel

 

[Apollo]

Not sure. But Eyle can't be natives. There are no remains of their settlements in any parts of Somalia. The archeological findings haven't been published but this what the locals say. "Another local rock shelter is referred to as Abka Eeden I Oboy Haawo ("Adam and Eve's court"). In addition, several rock formations in the area feature cave art"

We'll have to go by the ancient DNA results produced from Ethiopia, Kenya, Tanzania, Sudan etc then.

 

[Menelik III]

The Agaw group of Cushites (proto-Habesha ancestors) kept having contact with Egypt and Northeast Sudan, as they have certain Coptic/Egyptian markers lackining in LE Cushites and S Cushites.

Multiple waves of migration or religious/trade connections between the people. Ethiopians were present in Israel before Christianity.

 

[Grant]

Not sure. But Eyle can't be natives. There are no remains of their settlements in any parts of Somalia. The archeological findings haven't been published but this what the locals say. "Another local rock shelter is referred to as Abka Eeden I Oboy Haawo ("Adam and Eve's court"). In addition, several rock formations in the area feature cave art"

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00438243.1988.9980055?needAccess=true

"Recent archaeological excavations of a large rocksheiter at Buur Heybe, southern Somalia, resulted in the discovery of fourteen human burials of early Holocene age. The Gogoshiis Qabe burials represent: 1) the first primary context prehistoric skeletal remains from Somalia; 2) the earliest chronometrically dated burials from the Horn of Africa (Somalia, Ethiopia and Djibouti); and 3) the earliest definitive evidence in eastern Africa for grave goods (lesser kudu horns). The mortuary data are examined in light of an ecological model of hunter/gatherer socio/territorial organization which predicts that when critical human resources are spatio/temporally unpredictable and scarce, hunter/gatherers are unlikely to bury their dead in formal burial areas or build grave monuments. Conversely, when resources are abundant and predictable across time and space, conditions will arise that favour the construction of grave monuments and/or formal burial areas, possibly as a means of ritualizing corporate lineal descent."


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buur_Heybe

"The Gogollis Qabe or Gogoshiis Qabe ("the furnished place"), a local rock shelter, is the seat of the first professional excavation in the country.[1][2] In 1935, Grazioni found a Middle and Later Stone Age archaeological sequence here. The ancient implements belonged to the Somaliland Stillbay culture typified by points and scrapers produced through flat percussion flaking.[3] J.D. Clark a decade later excavated a nearby site, the Gury Waabay ("the poisonous house"), located around half a kilometer to the north.[2] In the 1980s, Brandt also excavated the granitic inselberg, uncovering a top level Holocene layer.[3] Fourteen burials were found therein, which constitute the earliest chronometrically dated burials from the Horn of Africa and contain the earliest definitive grave artefacts in the wider region.[4] A lower layer was likewise associated with the Stone Age Eibian (Doian) industry.[3] Another local rock shelter is referred to as Abka Eeden I Oboy Haawo ("Adam and Eve's court"). In addition, several rock formations in the area feature cave art.[2]

Buur Heybe historically served as a key religious and political hub.[2] According to oral tradition in the Doi ("red soil") belt, several dynasties were based in the town.[2][5] The Eyle aver that the area was at various times invaded and occupied by a succession of early Cushitic settlers, the Jidle, Maadanle and Ajuran, whom they each managed to defeat. A number of ancient burial sites dated from this pre-Islamic period sit atop the mountain's peak, and are a center of annual pilgrimage (siyaro). A trench near the holy places is said to serve as a passage toward heaven (siraad), and as such is off-limits to individuals possessing a nefarious past. These burial sites on the mountain's summit were later made into Muslim holy sites in the ensuing Islamic period, including the Owol Qaasing (derived from the Arabic "Abdul Qaasim", one of the names of Prophet Muhammad) and Sheikh Abdulqadir al-Jilaani (named for the founder of the Qadiriyya order).[2]

Additionally, the area is a center of pottery production. The Bur Ecological and Archaeological Project, established in 1983, uncovered hundreds of sherds from the site and other rock shelters. Oral tradition suggests that the Eyle were the first people to make pottery in Buur Heybe.[2]

Demographics
Buur Heybe is today primarily inhabited by the Eyle, an ethnic minority community of agropastoralists, potters and part-time hunters. Their ethnonym translates as the "hunters with dogs".[2] The Eyle are believed to be remnants of the somali hunter-gatherers Afro-Asiatic populations of the Cushitic branch.[6] Buur Heybe is consequently also known as Buur Eyle ("Eyle mountain"), in recognition of the first inhabitants in the surrounding villages of Howaal Dheri, Berdaale and Muuney.[2]"

 

[Apollo]

There have been multiple cases documented of agro-pastoralists reverting to hunter-gatherer lifestyles. Just because they had primitive lifestyles into the modern age it doesn't necessarily mean they are racially different from other Somalis.

 

[Grant]

What are the oldest human remains found in Somalia?

I'm not into archaeology. Perhaps they can test pre-Somali bones in Somalia from before 5000 BC.

Love the way you're phrasing that. One author I read said he tested graves pointed out to him by Somalis as those of dadka hore and they were all under 250 years. The oldest so far known were from Gogoshiis Qabe. See the link at my post.

 

[XoosBoos]

There have been multiple cases documented of agro-pastoralists reverting to hunter-gatherer lifestyles. Just because they had primitive lifestyles into the modern age it doesn't necessarily mean they are racially different from other Somalis.

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00438243.1988.9980055?needAccess=true

"Recent archaeological excavations of a large rocksheiter at Buur Heybe, southern Somalia, resulted in the discovery of fourteen human burials of early Holocene age. The Gogoshiis Qabe burials represent: 1) the first primary context prehistoric skeletal remains from Somalia; 2) the earliest chronometrically dated burials from the Horn of Africa (Somalia, Ethiopia and Djibouti); and 3) the earliest definitive evidence in eastern Africa for grave goods (lesser kudu horns). The mortuary data are examined in light of an ecological model of hunter/gatherer socio/territorial organization which predicts that when critical human resources are spatio/temporally unpredictable and scarce, hunter/gatherers are unlikely to bury their dead in formal burial areas or build grave monuments. Conversely, when resources are abundant and predictable across time and space, conditions will arise that favour the construction of grave monuments and/or formal burial areas, possibly as a means of ritualizing corporate lineal descent."


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buur_Heybe

"The Gogollis Qabe or Gogoshiis Qabe ("the furnished place"), a local rock shelter, is the seat of the first professional excavation in the country.[1][2] In 1935, Grazioni found a Middle and Later Stone Age archaeological sequence here. The ancient implements belonged to the Somaliland Stillbay culture typified by points and scrapers produced through flat percussion flaking.[3] J.D. Clark a decade later excavated a nearby site, the Gury Waabay ("the poisonous house"), located around half a kilometer to the north.[2] In the 1980s, Brandt also excavated the granitic inselberg, uncovering a top level Holocene layer.[3] Fourteen burials were found therein, which constitute the earliest chronometrically dated burials from the Horn of Africa and contain the earliest definitive grave artefacts in the wider region.[4] A lower layer was likewise associated with the Stone Age Eibian (Doian) industry.[3] Another local rock shelter is referred to as Abka Eeden I Oboy Haawo ("Adam and Eve's court"). In addition, several rock formations in the area feature cave art.[2]

Buur Heybe historically served as a key religious and political hub.[2] According to oral tradition in the Doi ("red soil") belt, several dynasties were based in the town.[2][5] The Eyle aver that the area was at various times invaded and occupied by a succession of early Cushitic settlers, the Jidle, Maadanle and Ajuran, whom they each managed to defeat. A number of ancient burial sites dated from this pre-Islamic period sit atop the mountain's peak, and are a center of annual pilgrimage (siyaro). A trench near the holy places is said to serve as a passage toward heaven (siraad), and as such is off-limits to individuals possessing a nefarious past. These burial sites on the mountain's summit were later made into Muslim holy sites in the ensuing Islamic period, including the Owol Qaasing (derived from the Arabic "Abdul Qaasim", one of the names of Prophet Muhammad) and Sheikh Abdulqadir al-Jilaani (named for the founder of the Qadiriyya order).[2]

Additionally, the area is a center of pottery production. The Bur Ecological and Archaeological Project, established in 1983, uncovered hundreds of sherds from the site and other rock shelters. Oral tradition suggests that the Eyle were the first people to make pottery in Buur Heybe.[2]

Demographics
Buur Heybe is today primarily inhabited by the Eyle, an ethnic minority community of agropastoralists, potters and part-time hunters. Their ethnonym translates as the "hunters with dogs".[2] The Eyle are believed to be remnants of the somali hunter-gatherers Afro-Asiatic populations of the Cushitic branch.[6] Buur Heybe is consequently also known as Buur Eyle ("Eyle mountain"), in recognition of the first inhabitants in the surrounding villages of Howaal Dheri, Berdaale and Muuney.[2]"

Love the way you're phrasing that. One author I read said he tested graves pointed out to him by Somalis as those of dadka hore and they were all under 250 years. The oldest so far known were from Gogoshiis Qabe. See the link at my post.

There are found older cave formats in south somalia predating the holocene time.

 

[Grant]

There are found older cave formats in south somalia predating the holocene time.

Where?

 

[XoosBoos]

@Grant The eyle are descended of Bushmans and where the bushman descend from? The todays Eyle were absorbed by Mushangalis and Sabs in medievel time. They don't look one bit like bushmans. I wouldn't call them natives as there are cushitics remnants in South Somalia who surpasses Eyle's one. North Kenya also has remnants of Cushitic settlement surpassing Eyle. Examples are Rendille but have been absorbed by Nilotes same goes for Massai. Nice attempt to twist evidences.

 

[Grant]

There have been multiple cases documented of agro-pastoralists reverting to hunter-gatherer lifestyles. Just because they had primitive lifestyles into the modern age it doesn't necessarily mean they are racially different from other Somalis.

Agreed. But even you should recognize that Gogoshiis Qabe is much too early. Who was it said the Eyle had a yellow cast?

 

[XoosBoos]

Where?

In Balcad and Baidoa