USC failed miserably, but what about SNM?

[horumar]

Once again @xisaabiye the mujahid is destroying the barre sympathisers with pure facts. Nice clean up walaal

 

[Prince of Lasanod]

War niinyo do i deny that . Wallahi i'm a truthful person, Isaaq knew darood, specifically MOD was the enemy and it was afweyne who pinned them against eachother. When you see the darood being evacuated from your cities before curfew and mass executions started what else would they think about your tribe

This was when the SNM was first founded in England, before Siad Barre even targeted Isaaq, before the SNM even began any operations and before Siad Barre had to rely on MOD. Even so, the Ogaden were also the ones who founded the SPM, the second strongest rebel group.

The day SNM was formed, it was a movement fighting for the sake of tribalism.

Jubair ibn Mut’im reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said, “He is not one of us who calls to tribalism. He is not one of us who fights for the sake of tribalism. He is not one of us who dies following the way of tribalism.”

Source: Sunan Abu Dawud 5121

"Subsequent Isaaq propaganda(poems, radio broadcasts) to mobilize their population was filled with a most vile, abusive and racist language against the Daarood people. Demonstrations held by students in Isaaq cities like Hargeysa and Burco were notable for the vile anti-Daarood slogans chanted by the participants. It became soon became fairly obvious to anti-government Daarood students that the Isaaqs were not so much anti-government as they were anti-Daarood."

 

[Prince Abubu]

This debate is getting tiring now. Believe what you wish to believe. There's ample evidence and proof to Afweyne's actively aggressive policies against Isaaq long before the SNM were founded and his arming of anti-isaaq clans. Quite frankly, this debate is getting tedious at this point. It's obvious some people are just fed cuqdad at the breast.

 

[Professor]

This debate is getting tiring now. Believe what you wish to believe. There's ample evidence and proof to Afweyne's actively aggressive policies against Isaaq long before the SNM were founded and his arming of anti-isaaq clans. Quite frankly, this debate is getting tedious at this point. It's obvious some people are just fed cuqdad at the breast.

But the southerners think siad was a god and the blame the north for everything. Listen untill they take account for the actions and blame the failure as their own responsibility they will keep on blaming the north. Since the is still chaos in the south then I think this baseless argument they sprout will keep on going. I honestly can'tget my head around how the keep on blaming the snm for everything.

 

[merka]

When Siad Barre lost power in 1991, USC had the chance to unite all somalis and rule them just like the tigray did with Ethiopia, but instead they went on an rampage ethnic cleansing.
I will never understand their logic behind that action.

Now what i want to know is, if Isaaq SNM had the same chance as USC, would they do the same thing or would they be smarter?

Getting back to your topic. The SNM had existed for 10 years prior to the collapse of the Barre Regime. As a rebel group they had 4 Chairmanships so they already had practice in changing power and a detailed chain of command. Once the regime fell there was already an organized group to take over and able to prevent the chaos that happened in the South.

The USC on the other hand was formed late in 1989 so they didn't really have the experience to deal with leadership struggles. So when they took control of the capital in 1991 they didn't have the experience to take control of the country. Once the capital fell and thereby all the state revenues that wasn't looted by the fleeing regime fell to them, they weren't able to take control of the situation and were too weak organizationally to effectively control the situation.

 

[Prince of Lasanod]

But the southerners think siad was a god and the blame the north for everything. Listen untill they take account for the actions and blame the failure as their own responsibility they will keep on blaming the north. Since the is still chaos in the south then I think this baseless argument they sprout will keep on going. I honestly can'tget my head around how the keep on blaming the snm for everything.

@jugjugwacwac is Isaaq himself. Don't know why everybody who goes against this false narrative is automatically a "southerner".

 

[Bahal]

It's obvious USC and SNM were the Somali counterparts of EPLF and TPLF. Sadly, unlike the latter groups, they failed to consolidate control following MSBs ouster due to vicious infighting and a lack of foresight.

I have no real issue with trying to overthrow a government that itself came to power after overthrowing their predecessors but there was no reason to toss the baby out with the bathwater

If I was Aideed in 1991, I'd declare a general amnesty for all government officials willing to turn themselves in, assure civilians I had no interest in clan reprisals, form a coalition with the SNM and declare general elections which I'd probably win quite handily, and isolate and destroy Siyadist remnants with the blessing of the West

 

[merka]

Umm, yes it actually does. It well known that there was no beef between Siyaad and ISaaq at that time.

I think because of the coup d'etat in 1978 by MJ military officials caused Barre to fear of future coup d'etats by other "unpatriotic" clans. It was well known that Siyad Barre had some mistrust of MJ and Isaaq elites since he took power away from them back in 1969.

After 1978 Siyad Barre was purging Isaaq generals and government officials out in favor of his own clan members. The leadership of the SNM was mostly government officials who were kicked out by Barre.

 

[Canuck]

You've got a point, and btw why the hell would dulbahnte rebel against Siad Barre in those times, they were one of the clans who were eating good under him, shit doesnt make any sense

Hodan nalayah's dad rebelled against barre 's administration although he was governor at that time who fought on Ogaden war. He even ran with silanyo to Ethiopia. but he didn't want to turn traitor. So, he left to Canada. The passports of family were confiscated and they left without passports to Egypt (the manager of Somali airlines was dhulo man) at Egypt the family were treated as political refugees.

 

[SultanuuFicaan]

A better question would be... what if Egal Aun had ordered Caydiid aun and the rest of the army to quash Siyaad barre mutineers in 1969 and prevented the dreaded coup of 1969 and saved the Republic. The republic was corrupt, ridiculously corrupt during Sharmake's AUN administration but when you look at it in hindsight, a brutal repressive regime which began to become maniacal after the failure of the 77 war. Things cannot be compared.

1969 coup was a dark chapter in our history. Many things could have been prevented had this coup not occurred..

Republic was overthrown, a dictatorship followed by which ironically had the audacity to be called 'Somali democratic republic'.

Anyways, what is done is done. All we can do is repair this ridiculously fractured state and initiate an immediate clan reconciliation programme, cleanse out warlords, dhabadhilifs, jaajuus, terrorists, foreign enemies, criminals/mooriyans, religious fanatics, etc..

I'm an Old man, I would like to see a functioning state once again in my lifetime god willing.

 

[Prince Abubu]

It's obvious USC and SNM were the Somali counterparts of EPLF and TPLF. Sadly, unlike the latter groups, they failed to consolidate control following MSBs ouster due to vicious infighting and a lack of foresight.

I have no real issue with trying to overthrow a government that itself came to power after overthrowing their predecessors but there was no reason to toss the baby out with the bathwater

If I was Aideed in 1991, I'd declare a general amnesty for all government officials willing to turn themselves in, assure civilians I had no interest in clan reprisals, form a coalition with the SNM and declare general elections which I'd probably win quite handily, and isolate and destroy Siyadist remnants with the blessing of the West

That would require a level of intelligence and willingness to compromise outside the capabilities of Somalis.

 

[Bahal]

I think because of the coup d'etat in 1978 by MJ military officials caused Barre to fear of future coup d'etats by other "unpatriotic" clans. It was well known that Siyad Barre had some mistrust of MJ and Isaaq elites since he took power away from them back in 1969.

After 1978 Siyad Barre was purging Isaaq generals and government officials out in favor of his own clan members. The leadership of the SNM was mostly government officials who were kicked out by Barre.

Siilaanyo was a minister until 1982 when he joined the SNM.

Warancade was a high ranking member of the NSS

Ismail Faqash's name speaks for itself

Cawil was NSS

Cirro was NSS

Dr. Gaboose was MSBs personal doctor

 

[Prince Abubu]

Siilaanyo was a minister until 1982 when he joined the SNM.

Warancade was a high ranking member of the NSS

Ismail Faqash's name speaks for itself

Cawil was NSS

Cirro was NSS

Dr. Gaboose was MSBs personal doctor

Ironically, those are the same Somaliland elites I was referring to. They are the antithesis of everything the SNM stood for and yet they rule Somaliland today.

 

[Canuck]

Guys what are you expecting from opposition groups that ran to their historical enemy (Ethiopia) whom yesterday they were fighting it in Ogaden to help them?
Do you think Ethiopia care about Somalia 's benefit?
Those movements were trained and funded by Ethiopia!!!!!they were traitors.

 

[Prince Abubu]

Guys what are you expecting from opposition groups that ran to their historical enemies (Ethiopia) whom yesterday they were fighting it in Ogaden go help them?
Do you think Ethiopia care about Somalia 's benefit?
Those movements were trained and funded by Ethiopia!!!!!

You mean the same Ethiopia that afweyne negotiated with to get SNM rebels kicked out in exchange for K5? Munaafiqnimo is in your blood though, so I shouldn't expect anything else.

 

[Professor]

Hodan nalayah's dad rebelled against barre 's administration although he was governor at that time who fought on Ogaden war. He even ran with silanyo to Ethiopia. but he didn't want to turn traitor. So, he left to Canada. The passports of family were confiscated and they left without passports to Egypt (the manager of Somali airlines was dhulo man) at Egypt the family were treated as political refugees.

Well if isn't the websites crazy old lady. Have u remember to take your medications. Why don't u look after your cats and talk to them about your so long ago youth.

 

[Canuck]

You mean the same Ethiopia that afweyne negotiated with to get SNM rebels kicked out in exchange for K5? Munaafiqnimo is in your blood though, so I shouldn't expect anything else.

Barre was the head of the state and have the full right to talk to our enemy. But when ministers ran to Ethiopia and sell government 's secrets to them. They will be traitors.

 

[Canuck]

Well if isn't the websites crazy old lady. Have u remember to take your medications. Why don't u look after your cats and talk to them about your so long ago youth.

Seek help man!!!!! I know all these info because my family worked for the government.

 

[Bahal]

What happened in Somalia was a goddamn tragedy that could've been avoided with a little bit of thinking.

We're all victims of idiotic decision making and inability to compromise when there's really not much to fight for at this point.

Like @SultanuuFicaan said, whatever your political (clan) affiliation, I want to make sure we don't get left behind even further because God knows I have no intention of remaining a refugee in another man's land forever.

 

[Prince of Lasanod]

A better question would be... what if Egal Aun had ordered Caydiid and the rest of the army to quash Siyaad barre mutineers in 1969 and prevented the dreaded coup of 1969 and saved the Republic. The republic was corrupt, ridiculously corrupt during Sharmake's AUN administration but when you look at it in hindsight, a brutal repressive regime which began to become maniacal after the failure of the 77 war. Things cannot be compared.

1969 coup was a dark chapter in our history. Many things could have been prevented had this coup not occurred..

Republic was overthrown, a dictatorship followed by which ironically had the audacity to be called 'Somali democratic republic'.

Anyways, what is done is done. All we can do is repair this ridiculously fractured state and initiate an immediate clan reconciliation programme, cleanse out warlords, dhabadhilifs, jaajuus, terrorists, foreign enemies, criminals/mooriyans, religious fanatics, etc..

I'm an Old man, I would like to see a functioning state once again in my lifetime god willing.

Who knows? Perhaps if the coup didn't happen, Somalia may have collapsed in the early 1970s.