What was the territorial extent of Axum

[Ibn Amer]

How can we confidently say that the ezana tablet is not a boast an empty bravado by the axumite king? We need at the very least another outside source to confirm the claim. If anything the descendent of the axumite today are well known for their outrageous claims.

Many many documents in Arabia attest to Axumite conquest of Yemen and parts of Saudi Arabia, a Roman traveller also attests to Axumites having control over parts of Sudan theres no reason to believe this is an "empty bravado" Somalia was no way near as developed or relevant as South Arabia or Kush(at this point in time), 2 regions which have both been confirmed by non Axumite sources to have be conquered by Axumites, so why would they lie about conquering Somalia?

Its funny because if there were texts in Somalia that said that they conquered Habeshas/Axumites and there was no non-Somali sources to prove it, no one here would care and everyone would treat it as gospel and scream from the rooftops that Somalis conquered Axum.

 

[Garaad diinle]

Many many documents in Arabia attest to Axumite conquest of Yemen and parts of Saudi Arabia, a Roman traveller also attests to Axumites having control over parts of Sudan theres no reason to believe this is an "empty bravado" Somalia was no way near as developed or relevant as South Arabia or Kush(at this point in time), 2 regions which have both been confirmed by non Axumite sources to have be conquered by Axumites, so why would they lie about conquering Somalia?

Warya stop your axum fanboying and give us tangible evidence that supports this claim. Rulers in ancient time were well known propagandists. We know for example that ancient egypt didn't win all their battles yet they always wrote that they were victorious in each an every battle.One can tell the truth and hid small white lies in between them. If somalia was irrelevant why would the axumite conquer it? Your not making much sense here. Further more how can you conquer nomadic pastoralist if china itself couldn't do that?

Its funny because if there were texts in Somalia that said that they conquered Habeshas/Axumites and there was no non-Somali sources to prove it, no one here would care and everyone would treat it as gospel and scream from the rooftops that Somalis conquered Axum.

Absolutely you can bet on it kkkkk.

 

[SuperBantuWeyne]

There is absolutely no evidence for Kunamas being part of Aksum, Afars live in Eritrea they weren't part of Aksum either whats your point? Oromos live in Ethiopia the weren't part of Aksum, your arguments make no sense.

When i say no Nilo Saharan influence I mean anything on top of whats already within Cushitic influence, I can't believe I have to explain that are you being dense on purpose?


I can post alternative etymologies for half of those words which indicate they are of Ethio Semitic or Cushitic origin, either way no one knows for sure where these words come from.

You need to address why Habeshas genetically have no more Nilotic than any other population in the Horn. Given the fact that they lived amongst them according to you they should have extra Nilotic-related ancestry relative to other Horners associated with Kunamas which is not the case at all. Also where is the Kunama influence in Ethio-Semitic languages? Post the data showing this, if Kunamas lived amongst Habeshas then there should be some Kunama influence on a lingustic level too.

It's not that Kunama just live in Eritrea like afar do, their known homeland is located in the center of the former Aksum. Unlike you can provide evidences of their recent migration to the area, it's quite obvious that they were part of it. Kunama even lost ground to other ethnic groups in the last centuries. There's the Nara people too. Compared to Somalis or Afars, Habeshas do have extra Nilotic and Mota like dna . At K=18 below, you can see a purple cushitic-like component maximized in Somalis. Tigray and Ahmara have less of this component but have additional Mena(south arabian) and African admixture (Anyak, Gumuz and Ari). There you have your genetic proof.

When it comes to linguistic, i don't think a study on it was made but given their minority status, they probably didn't influence it or not thoroughly enough. The fact that Africa is understudied doesn't help at all.

 

[SuperBantuWeyne]

Your own source says Aksums territory was no further east than Adulis lol Afars are not Aksumites they were at best, conquered people who were under Aksum and paid tribute to the King, your just throwing shit at a wall and hoping it sticks you lack an actual coherent argument

The only people who can truly claim Aksum is Tigrinya/Tigray, Tigre, certain Agaws like the Bilen and maybe Saho and Amharas.

Any other tribe was either peripheral, conquered, or had nothing to do with it at all.

You're right about the Afar but my point still stands withwith

 

[SuperBantuWeyne]

You're right about the Afar but my point still stands withwith

Sahos

 

[Al hashimi]

But Axum was ruled by habesha and dir

 

[Noble]

Not axum actually
it's the period up to Ahmed gureys conquest in the medieval era

 

[somaliconq]

Not axum actually
it's the period up to Ahmed gureys conquest in the medieval eraView attachment 266278

Why does it say vassal king tho gragn was fully independent of ethiopian control and it wasn't a revolt it was a full scale jihad and conquest

 

[Emir of Zayla]

Why does it say vassal king tho gragn was fully independent of ethiopian control and it wasn't a revolt it was a full scale jihad and conquest

I’m pretty sure both Muslims & Christians in the Horn thought of themselves to be one people in terms of being related & all. But Ahmed Ibrahim wasn’t a vassal lol

 

[Khaem]

I’m pretty sure both Muslims & Christians in the Horn thought of themselves to be one people in terms of being related & all. But Ahmed Ibrahim wasn’t a vassal lol

Do Horners still think like that?
I mean a oromo who crossed the border into boroma in the back of a truck can be accepted as a Somali in somalia but a non cushite would have a massively hard time hundreds years after the fact.

 

[Emir of Zayla]

Do Horners still think like that?
I mean a oromo who crossed the border into boroma in the back of a truck can be accepted as a Somali in somalia but a non cushite would have a massively hard time hundreds years after the fact.

If they speak the language & look similar enough they’ll assimilate in a generation easily. Yemeni’s & Indians on the coast assimilated in no time at all

 

[Khaem]

If they speak the language & look similar enough they’ll assimilate in a generation easily. Yemeni’s & Indians on the coast assimilated in no time at all

Assimilate yes but being considered ethnic somali is a different type of assimilation.
All sorts of Europeans got assimilated into White Anglo culture in America and now are just white anglos.
West Africans got assimilated into Anglo culture as well but they are seen as distinct and use hyphens like "Black American".

If you are a minority in a country and land that is locked by one peoples ofc you will assimilate but whether or not you are considered the same by yourself and by others is a different type of assimilation Don’t you think?

 

[Emir of Zayla]

Assimilate yes but being considered ethnic somali is a different type of assimilation.
All sorts of Europeans got assimilated into White Anglo culture in America and now are just white anglos.
West Africans got assimilated into Anglo culture as well but they are seen as distinct and use hyphens like "Black American".

If you are a minority in a country and land that is locked by one peoples ofc you will assimilate but whether or not you are considered the same by yourself and by others is a different type of assimilation Don’t you think?

Them being assimilated basically means people & themselves forget about their original roots. If everyone has considered you Somali your whole life but your not, they’re being none the wiser

 

[Himmler]

This is a 6th century inscription written in Himyarite left in Saudi Arabia by Abraha.

Many of the tribes mentioned here have direct links to Arab groups across North Africa and the Middle East, like the Hilal in North Africa as they are a tribe of Bani Amir. Somali mercenaries we’re probably involved in these conquests btw.