Any proof of shewa sultanate and a horn based banu makhzum dynasty

[Aseer]

I’m speaking about Darood and yes we are Arabs.

We? Thats only you mate. Stop the coonery and be proud your somali african.

 

[Yabal]

but weren't the ifat and adalite sultans walashma and therefore darood?

Ibn Khaldun has already mentioned this.

 

[Yabal]

We? Thats only you mate. Stop the coonery and be proud your somali african.

My bro all respect to you but we are proud Arabs because our grandfather was Arab and our lineage will never change.

 

[Idilinaa]

I’m speaking about Darood and yes we are Arabs.

You know what's ironic about that, in the Yemeni Rasulid manuscripts would make clear that Ismail Ibrahim Al-Jabarti that the darood trace descent to was an ajami(non-arab) and the individuals who carried the Aqeeli lineages never claimed Arab either they claimed Al-Zayla'i and Al-Jabarti, they are also referred to as Ajami.

So i don't think it had much to do with claiming Arab cultural identity, as much as it had to with drawing one self closer to the religion.

Aqeeli lineage descent claim is also common for Dir, Raxanweyn and Hawiye. So it's a general Somali descent claim.

 

[Yabal]

You know what's ironic about that, in the Yemeni Rasulid manuscripts would make clear that Ismail Ibrahim Al-Jabarti that the darood trace descent to was an ajami(non-arab) and the individuals who carried the Aqeeli lineages never claimed Arab either they claimed Al-Zayla'i and Al-Jabarti, they are also referred to as Ajami.

So i don't think it had much to do with claiming Arab cultural identity, as much as it had to with drawing one self closer to the religion.

Aqeeli lineage descent claim is also common for Dir, Raxanweyn and Hawiye. So it's a general Somali descent claim.

Darood is the only tribe which has claimed Aqeeli lineage and there is proof for this such as Aqeeliyoon and Ibn Hajar Al Asqalani’s (who was a contemporary of Darood and his father Ismail) book where he mentions Darood’s father Ismail as a descendant of Aqeel.

 

[Idilinaa]

Darood is the only tribe which has claimed Aqeeli lineage and there is proof for this such as Aqeeliyoon and Ibn Hajar Al Asqalani’s (who was a contemporary of Darood and his father Ismail) book where he mentions Darood’s father Ismail as a descendant of Aqeel.

That's not true. Hawiye and Dir trace their ancestry to Aqil through Samaale, and Raxanweyn through Sab. So most Somali clans claim that descent.

Ismail Al-Jabarti is actually mentioned in rasulid manuscripts from that period. There was plenty of other individuals with Al-Jabarti and Al-Zaylai before him that claim that descent.
It was literally what Somali scholars became known for.

You don't even have to look at him being described as black ajami in the Suluk, ''Al-Jabarti'' makes it obvious he is from northern Somalia because Jabarta was the region of Zayla.

So it's not even something specific to the Awfat/Awdal Sultans, almost every Somali was claiming it at that time.

 

[Aseer]

My bro all respect to you but we are proud Arabs because our grandfather was Arab and our lineage will never change.

Warya you are a coon and we arent ayrabs.

 

[Midas]

That's not true. Hawiye and Dir trace their ancestry to Aqil through Samaale, and Raxanweyn through Sab. So most Somali clans claim that descent.

Ismail Al-Jabarti is actually mentioned in rasulid manuscripts from that period. There was plenty of other individuals with Al-Jabarti and Al-Zaylai before him that claim that descent.
It was literally what Somali scholars became known for.

You don't even have to look at him being described as black ajami in the Suluk, ''Al-Jabarti'' makes it obvious he is from northern Somalia because Jabarta was the region of Zayla.

So it's not even something specific to the Awfat/Awdal Sultans, almost every Somali was claiming it at that time.

So ismiak jabart was likely born in the early 1300s. But how do we have the darod sub clans like harti already in the 1500s mentioned in the 1500s. Does this mean that the somali geanolgies are actually very accurate.

 

[Idilinaa]

So ismiak jabart was likely born in the early 1300s. But how do we have the darod sub clans like harti already in the 1500s mentioned in the 1500s. Does this mean that the somali geanolgies are actually very accurate.

They all either existed but took on that descent claim to Ismail through marriage integration or new clans were formed out of older ones. You can tell by how many sub clans there are.

That's my guess.

 

[Idilinaa]

Warya you are a coon and we arent ayrabs.

Being Arab is not a betrayal or anything, i am just being technical on the accuracy of what people identified with.

 

[Midas]

They all either existed but took on that descent claim to Ismail through marriage integration or new clans were formed out of older ones. You can tell by how many sub clans there are.

That's my guess.

What's confusing is why the geanolgies stop with him. What happened to the old clans.
Thete also must have been some massive event that causes this since I'd understand if it happened in the 700s as a part of the islamization process. But this began in the 1300s. 600 years after somalis had become Muslims

 

[Webb]

That's not true. Hawiye and Dir trace their ancestry to Aqil through Samaale, and Raxanweyn through Sab. So most Somali clans claim that descent.

Ismail Al-Jabarti is actually mentioned in rasulid manuscripts from that period. There was plenty of other individuals with Al-Jabarti and Al-Zaylai before him that claim that descent.
It was literally what Somali scholars became known for.

You don't even have to look at him being described as black ajami in the Suluk, ''Al-Jabarti'' makes it obvious he is from northern Somalia because Jabarta was the region of Zayla.

So it's not even something specific to the Awfat/Awdal Sultans, almost every Somali was claiming it at that time.

During my arguments with an Afar guy, I came across a text that said an Aqeeli man in Yemen hated being referred to by a certain nisba (can't remember if it was Zayla'i or Jabarti) because the 'ajam from Abyssinia liked to use it

 

[Step a side]

Harla were Ethio-Semitic speakers who probably lived in close proximity with Somalis and were genetically heavily Somali. They hated ethnic Somalis and had to be separated within the Imam’s army

Harla were the farmers on the fertile highlands while the Somalis were the nomads from the low lands. They are both the same ethnic group but with different occupations. No need to ascribe our history to ‘Ethio-Semites’ when you have one of the most authoritative ‘Ethio-Semite’ public historian of Ethiopia, former Minister of Education, Arts & Culture and Dean of the National Library and who is the Idajaa of the Amharic language and served as Selassies Education minister Takla Sadiq Mekuria compile a 1k long state sponsored monograph regarding the origin of the imam. In it he has constructed the lineage tree of the imam with the help of one of the most authoritative Muslim Harari scholar who has copies of the earliest history of Harar preceding Ifat.

The entire Harla division was led by Sultan Mohamed at one point. As you can see Sultan Mohamed is a close relative of the imam. He was chief of one of the Harla tribes from Zerba.

Vast majority of the big players in Futuh were connected to the imam in one way or the other. His cousin and right hand man Abu Bakr led the conquest of Wofla in modern Tigray region and Kanfat in southern Begemder, after which he was appointed governor of these respective regions. Garaad Mataan of Geri led the Somali contingent during shimbre Kure. He was married to Gurey’s sister Fardowsa. Gurey’s nephew waziir Abas was made grand vizier after leading the battle of Seraya in Eritrea. Sultan Mohamed’s nephew Imam Mohamed Gasa (circled in black) was the governor of Bale at one point. He moved the capital from Harar to Awssa to start the Awssa Imamate. He appears on the list of rulers that ruled Harar which was compiled by Ahmed Sami in his Jadwal. 53 to 58 were all Gasa’s bloodline and rulers of Awssa.

 

[Aseer]

As far as i know there is no authentic manuscript that ties Harari to Harla and the Futuh Mahdinat Harar and other manuscripts have been proven to be a fradulent writtings produced in 20th century.

They talk about fighting Italians and portuguese in 1200s and driving cars lmaao . It full of nonsense like that collapses modern day happenings into the past. They even mention people using rifles in the 13th century

Basically epic fiction pieces.

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[Midas]

I wonder why the futuh doesn't mention that harti and marehan are both darod. Could it be that harti and marehan was only connected to darod post 1500s .

 

[Idilinaa]

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I've already adressed this.
[URL unfurl="true"]https://www.somalispot.com/threads/futuh-al-habasha-somalis-as-bedouins.163690/page-9#post-3981960[/URL]

What's confusing is why the geanolgies stop with him. What happened to the old clans.
Thete also must have been some massive event that causes this since I'd understand if it happened in the 700s as a part of the islamization process. But this began in the 1300s. 600 years after somalis had become Muslims

If you look at the Rasulid corpus the early ones carrying Al-Zaylai and Al-Jabarti nisba didn't claim Aqili. But then it starts around 1300s and it was formed out of elite group of Somali scholars.

So Somalis were already Muslims before the Aqili lineage descent was incorporated into their clan structure. Like i said to you before in another thread i don't think it reflects Islamization, more than it reflects the founding of newer clans and Somali saint cult.

 

[Yabal]

That's not true. Hawiye and Dir trace their ancestry to Aqil through Samaale, and Raxanweyn through Sab. So most Somali clans claim that descent.

Ismail Al-Jabarti is actually mentioned in rasulid manuscripts from that period. There was plenty of other individuals with Al-Jabarti and Al-Zaylai before him that claim that descent.
It was literally what Somali scholars became known for.

You don't even have to look at him being described as black ajami in the Suluk, ''Al-Jabarti'' makes it obvious he is from northern Somalia because Jabarta was the region of Zayla.

So it's not even something specific to the Awfat/Awdal Sultans, almost every Somali was claiming it at that time.

Samaale is just folkore and Hawiye and Dir don’t trace their ancestry to Aqeel, only Darood do. If Hawiye and Dir were Aqeelis how come we don’t have any Arab Manuscripts confirming their genealogy. Also forget about Manuscripts, majority of Hawiye don’t even share the same haplogroup most are a combination of different haplogroups.

 

[Yabal]

So ismiak jabart was likely born in the early 1300s. But how do we have the darod sub clans like harti already in the 1500s mentioned in the 1500s. Does this mean that the somali geanolgies are actually very accurate.

Ismail was born in 1322 and died in 1406. If you do the math 6 Generations after 125 years = 256 descendants have 4 children resulting in 1,024 descendants. Take into the consideration that Darood’s had multipe wife’s.

 

[Som]

Most if not all horn African Muslim dinsaties claim Arab ancestry through the prophet because of prestige and honor. It's mostly not true .The Shewa kingdoms was Muslim habesha, the kfat kingdom was Muslim habesha with Somalis and Afars and the Adal kingdom was Somali + afar and some Muslim habeshas

 

[Idilinaa]

Ismail was born in 1322 and died in 1406. If you do the math 6 Generations after 125 years = 256 descendants have 4 children resulting in 1,024 descendants. Take into the consideration that Darood’s had multipe wife’s.

That's probably what happened they married each-other and passed on that descent through that paternally over generations.

Samaale is just folkore and Hawiye and Dir don’t trace their ancestry to Aqeel, only Darood do. If Hawiye and Dir were Aqeelis how come we don’t have any Arab Manuscripts confirming their genealogy. Also forget about Manuscripts, majority of Hawiye don’t even share the same haplogroup most are a combination of different haplogroups.

Samaale is not the formal name, it is Muhammad Yow son of Muhammad Abd al-Rahman who is claimed to be son of Aqil , just like Abdirahman Bin Ismail Al_Jabarti alternatively known as Darood who is the son of Ismail and so on.

I am not making a statement on where it is true or not i am just sharing that most Somali clans claim Aqili, it's just a general Somali lineage claim and that Somalis of the past shared that same tradition.

the kfat kingdom was Muslim habesha with Somalis and Afars and the Adal kingdom was Somali + afar and some Muslim habeshas

You can read my other posts on this thread zero proof to what you said. The population was a collection of Somali clans and Awfat/Awdal just expanded from the Somali coast.

Afar was known as Danakil and was a seperate entity altogether, its clearly outlied in ethiopian, portuguese and external arab sources.