really? does that have to do with the mtdna?
My Somali female friend's 23&me results
- Thread starter CulturedKay
- Start date
It’s the y-chromosome, you can look like a blonde white male but the only way we will know you’re of somali descendent is through y-chromo passed down only from fathers.
Do you realize there is a such thing as autosomal DNA? We can tell you are of Somali descent that way. Also, though mtdna lineages are numerous. Both my parents are N1a1a3. Don't undermine its significance.
you are funny. kkkThis is not my area of expertise. It's just easy to tell that this combination is normally a confluence of mixtures found in Southern Somalia. If they were a recently admixed outlier in Northern Somalia/Somaliland. we would likely have South Asian with an absence of Bantu/Niger-Congo or Yemeni without South Asian.
Cadcads and Barwanis have a unique mixture not found in other parts of Somalia. They have so many genetic inputs making them heterogeneous but because of their preponderance for first-cousin marriage more so than ethnic Somalis they increase their homozygosity/incidence of genetic disease(s).
don't let rer hamars catch you talking so much smack but you are right. they sure do love cousin marriages because they probably don't wanna marry ethnic "somalis". is it to avoid getting tainted with dark skin? i think so.
Nah it’s not about dark skin they have a lot of darkskins and Madow admixture. They just like to keep it in the family.
It’s not as recent as the y though right?
There are light-skinned 100% ethnic Somalis and they have sharper features than them. So that isn't the issue. They can still practice endogamy and keep their group alive by engaging in intra-qabil marriage without practicing intergenerational first-cousin marriage.
MtDNA is slow to change relative to YDNA. And there are so many haplogroups so it's a little less exciting.
What is s a tad embarrassing is that some Somali Twitter trolls demonize L-lineages. They aren't the brightest bunch so they erroneously assume dark skin = L-lineage. Especially when they catch their eyes on a tall, ebony Somali sister who doesn't look that Somali but is wearing a swimsuit. Saying something to the effect of "she is a libidinous L of Nilo extraction".I wish I was making this stuff up. These suugoscientists must be stopped.They know, I haveI refuse to believe that these communities don't know they have Hindi DNA, come on now, look in the mirror, that's not an Arab face, baby.
I've seen many hatimi with y-dna G-PF3296 on 23andMe, which has a subclade G-Y32613 , Prominent among the Ba'alawi from Hadhramaut https://www.yfull.com/tree/G-PF3293/
We all have that L maternal haplogroups but I always wanted to know if there’s men out there who carry it as their paternal haplogroup. Did your brothers take 23&me or any dna and what’s their haplogroup? I don’t have any SM relatives on my relatives list there.There are light-skinned 100% ethnic Somalis and they have sharper features than them. So that isn't the issue. They can still practice endogamy and keep their group alive by engaging in intra-qabil marriage without practicing intergenerational first-cousin marriage.
MtDNA is slow to change relative to YDNA. And there are so many haplogroups so it's a little less exciting.
There are light-skinned 100% ethnic Somalis and they have sharper features than them. So that isn't the issue. They can still practice endogamy and keep their group alive by engaging in intra-qabil marriage without practicing intergenerational first-cousin marriage.
MtDNA is slow to change relative to YDNA. And there are so many haplogroups so it's a little less exciting.
What is mtDNA L4A2 haplogroup associated with?
My brother is T1a and N1a3a. My father is also on Y-full.
To my surprise, I have seen Somalis on Twitter copy and paste the Somali T subclade tree there. As usual, they were spreading genetic misinformation.I miss a time before Twitter. I feel like it enables their pathologies. Chronic constipation + Internet addiction + Attention seeking = Bad news. Some of them are so provocative that all we can do is ignore them.
From what I gather there are 8 African lineages or L haplogroups (L0-L7). The oldest lineage of the L lineages are L0, L1 and L5 and tend to peak in the Khoisan, Baka and Mbuti. The most widespread L lineage in Africa is L2 for two main reasons (1) climatic conditions that drove migration 50,00 –70,000 years ago from East Africa Westward and (2) more recent back migration from the Bantu Expansion. L3 is the basal haplogroup that left Africa and is ancestral to all non-Africans. It evolved into other out-of-Africa lineages like M, N and others. I’m not too familiar with the L4 haplogroups other than they are most diverse in East Africa though they have spread across the entire African continent. Though I know L4a2 (20,000 – 40,00 years old) and is most common among the Hadza compared to all other groups in the African continent. L4 lineages are also in high frequency among the Omotic (Hamer) in Ethiopia, and the Nilotic (Gumuz).
Here is an interesting article that goes into greater depth.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9232647/
The alchemist
VIP
L is the majority of Somalis. 66% of my DNA relatives on 23andMe are L. N and M are likely mutations that happened in North Africa or back migrations from when they formed in Southwest Asia on a relatively quick subsequent scale. This idea that they came back all the way from South Asia is an outdated model. Saharan samples from Libya showed basal N lineages that were second to Oase 1, and they had their separate lineage. I bet that Libyan pastoralists got it from the Taforalt instead of the Levantine, for we know IBM had N and M too.There are light-skinned 100% ethnic Somalis and they have sharper features than them. So that isn't the issue. They can still practice endogamy and keep their group alive by engaging in intra-qabil marriage without practicing intergenerational first-cousin marriage.
MtDNA is slow to change relative to YDNA. And there are so many haplogroups so it's a little less exciting.
"It is worth noting, however, that when geometric morphometric analysis of the skull of TK RS H1 is compared with a large published dataset it shows closer affinities with sub-Saharan contests, such as Gobero in Niger whose occupation is dated from ~9.6–4.8 ka. Unfortunately, no genetic data are available for this region that could help understanding the possible origin of the haplotype found at Takarkori."
Ancestral mitochondrial N lineage from the Neolithic ‘green’ Sahara - PMC
Because Africa’s climate hampers DNA preservation, knowledge of its genetic variability is mainly restricted to modern samples, even though population genetics dynamics and back-migrations from Eurasia may have modified haplotype frequencies, ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
The people who occupied Gobero were Iberomaurusian descendants, no doubt about that.
The alchemist
VIP
Maternal lineages I have observed with those coastal mixed minorities (Benadiri): H14a and M3.
That's not how genetics works my friend. Ashkanazi yews can be more than 20% middle-eastern, but that does not mean they have a middle-eastern grand-parent.
I would have thought it to be 60%. I used to joke that M and N were mutated L3s.L is the majority of Somalis. 66% of my DNA relatives on 23andMe are L. N and M are likely mutations that happened in North Africa or back migrations from when they formed in Southwest Asia on a relatively quick subsequent scale. This idea that they came back all the way from South Asia is an outdated model. Saharan samples from Libya showed basal N lineages that were second to Oase 1, and they had their separate lineage. I bet that Libyan pastoralists got it from the Taforalt instead of the Levantine, for we know IBM had N and M too.
"It is worth noting, however, that when geometric morphometric analysis of the skull of TK RS H1 is compared with a large published dataset it shows closer affinities with sub-Saharan contests, such as Gobero in Niger whose occupation is dated from ~9.6–4.8 ka. Unfortunately, no genetic data are available for this region that could help understanding the possible origin of the haplotype found at Takarkori."
Ancestral mitochondrial N lineage from the Neolithic ‘green’ Sahara - PMC
Because Africa’s climate hampers DNA preservation, knowledge of its genetic variability is mainly restricted to modern samples, even though population genetics dynamics and back-migrations from Eurasia may have modified haplotype frequencies, ...
The people who occupied Gobero were Iberomaurusian descendants, no doubt about that.
So, it's speculated that M and N are North African rather than Levantine. I find it a bit confusing determining tracking the phylogenetic dispersion of these haplogroups and determining the correct branching order. I'm not a genetic fetishist like you guys so I'll leave the debate open-ended. I have no skin in the game, my L2-carrying friend.
Though I actually got a little bored so I was playing around with PCA calculators.
I tried various permutations and for some reason, I was getting noise level South East Asian once which was absent from the other Somali samples.
I will post it some other time.
The alchemist
VIP
Fetishist... now why did you have to put it like that? I don't apply ideology around the fascination with the ancient past and migration waves, mixture events (not fully true), and sequential segmentation of interwoven recombinatory time-stage gene flow pulsations of populations that cause distinct signatures.I would have thought it to be 60%. I used to joke that M and N were mutated L3s.
So, it's speculated that M and N are North African rather than Levantine. I find it a bit confusing determining tracking the phylogenetic dispersion of these haplogroups and determining the correct branching order. I'm not a genetic fetishist like you guys so I'll leave the debate open-ended. I have no skin in the game, my L2-carrying friend.
View attachment 248749
Though I actually got a little bored so I was playing around with PCA calculators.
View attachment 248752
I tried various permutations and for some reason, I was getting noise level South East Asian once which was absent from the other Somali samples.
If I’m fetishistic with the anthro thing, you do it behind closed doors in secret...you're actually a pervert. Look at you creating PCAs in the dark, while hiding in some closet, losing your mind over the small AASI DNA that is in your body, while getting aroused from not knowing if your pure pristine DNA is tainted or not. I might call you Punjaba from now on. Would you like that?
Me having some hunter-gatherer gargoyle ancestry and you having dalit South Asian ancestry – we are both troglodytes. It’s alright, don’t beat yourself over it. <3
kkkk, jk. I needed to amuse myself at your cost.
On a serious note, yes. It is probably from North Africa or Southwest Asia. To be honest, Southwest Asia (Levant and Arabian Peninsula) in the Paleolithic to me is an extension of Africa. I have a sentimental attachment to Africa, you see.
I did not know you knew of G25. It's cool.
I could have said aficionado but it wouldn't have had the same effect. Fetishism has no sexual undertones to me. I use it loosely. I have not taken this as gospel. It's entertaining and no doubt the misinformed will misinterpret it and superimpose some narrative onto anthropological genetic findings.
Do you have something against Austroasiatics? I will have you know that 0.4% is more Samoan-like (minus the predisposition to obesity) and less Pajeet shifted.
I refuse to be affiliated with another gaajo in a sarong/macawiis from a different continent. One spindly-legged skinny is all I can handle. At least the ones from Africa won't ask about
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The alchemist
VIP
Yeah, I have no issues with other people by the way. Sometimes I'm willing to hold the hand of ignorance for the humor. I'm not the type to use genetics to streamline it through such unethical framing, or I try hard not to, at least.I could have said aficionado but it wouldn't have had the same effect. Fetishism has no sexual undertones to me. I use it loosely. I have not taken this as gospel. It's entertaining and no doubt the misinformed will misinterpret it and superimpose some narrative onto anthropological genetic findings.
I refuse to be affiliated with another gaajo in a sarong/macawiis from a different continent. One spindly-legged skinny is all I can handle. At least the ones from Africa won't ask about.You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.
Yeah, I know fetishism can be about some level of obsession in a non-sexual manner. I have heard about it in academic settings toward ideas. But do you expect me to let that opportunity go? I had to dunk on that one. Either way, with that term as you intended, I wouldn't even consider my interests in anthropological subjects like that. A lot of people exchange knowledge in these things for values or use it to feed into their messed up perspective of people or the world at large. I'm far from those.
Yo, I actually read wrong the first time and thought it was South Asian and not Southeast Asian. But when has being correct stood against saying something ridiculous?
Anyway, that is enough derailment of this thread from me.
Garaad diinle
I once watched a video about how all mitochondrial dna in humans today originate from an east african women is there some truth to the story? Can we trace them to east africa?L is the majority of Somalis. 66% of my DNA relatives on 23andMe are L. N and M are likely mutations that happened in North Africa or back migrations from when they formed in Southwest Asia on a relatively quick subsequent scale. This idea that they came back all the way from South Asia is an outdated model. Saharan samples from Libya showed basal N lineages that were second to Oase 1, and they had their separate lineage. I bet that Libyan pastoralists got it from the Taforalt instead of the Levantine, for we know IBM had N and M too.
"It is worth noting, however, that when geometric morphometric analysis of the skull of TK RS H1 is compared with a large published dataset it shows closer affinities with sub-Saharan contests, such as Gobero in Niger whose occupation is dated from ~9.6–4.8 ka. Unfortunately, no genetic data are available for this region that could help understanding the possible origin of the haplotype found at Takarkori."
Ancestral mitochondrial N lineage from the Neolithic ‘green’ Sahara - PMC
Because Africa’s climate hampers DNA preservation, knowledge of its genetic variability is mainly restricted to modern samples, even though population genetics dynamics and back-migrations from Eurasia may have modified haplotype frequencies, ...
The people who occupied Gobero were Iberomaurusian descendants, no doubt about that.
Here is the video start from 36:00. Check also 40:50.
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The alchemist
VIP
What the guy said was that the OOA population (non-Africans) is a founder-effect of the East African late Middle Stone Age diversity. I have no problem with this one. I think there is a new revised picture that simulates complex dynamic wave pulse radiations from Africa at different times. The simplistic model, useful as it is to conceptually portray a discrete picture, is not a realistic 1:1 explanation for migration out of Africa. Many of those I think were non-successful in creating lasting phylogenetic tree lineages, others likely migrated back to Africa after taking some peak into the Levant.
The topic of the origins of humans is a separate matter. It is hard to say where in Africa we come from. After limiting the conversation to mtDNA alone, where we leave out autosomal mixture processes, it's hard to say where our point of origin was. We are speaking about very wide time spans; it could be North Africa Central Africa or even West Africa too. It's hard to say. Inferring from extant diversity distributions and their geographic positions I don't think gives us a good indication.
There is also thing to say about if all modern mtDNA can be traced to East Africans instead of including the geographic constraints as the base factor.
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