Somalis were mentally and physically enslaved

[Canuck]

Too much Coke killed their brain cells

 

[Nin xun]

Too much Coke killed their brain cells

 

[Canuck]

 

[Canuck]

If you agree Somalis enslaved each other, what is so difficult in accepting they would sell them off to other groups?

Your contention assumes that males were allowed to produce offspring, which was generally not the case in the Arab slavetrade. The paternal haplotypes would have died off. That, of course, takes the notion that there is a genetic construct for what is a Somali, and the jury is still out on that one.

If we did slave each We would have known the names of tribes but it did not happen !!!

 

[Canuck]

Lies. Our Boqor may Allah swt have mercy on him, freed the Bantus, gave them jobs and lands. They're all appreciative to him and hail him as their hero.

The MJ sultan never discriminated any body or tribe, he even encouraged the marriage from sab tribes and rejected the discrimination against them.

 

[Canuck]

This is actually wrong. I believe @Thegoodshepherd did an interesting topic on this of a thriving puntite community in Southern Arabia alongside their mehri brethren. Why don't they show up in your nobel-prize winning studies?

The notion that there has not been any sort of genetic exchange between the two regions is not only laughable but completely unrealistic from a scientific standpoint.

That is all besides the point. All it takes is just one slave from one of the clans being sold in the Arabian peninsula to shatter your narrative. It is an extraordinary claim that Somalis from completely different tribes would not sell Somalis from other tribes to Arabs, while having no qualms selling habeshis and others. A claim that requires extraordinary evidence.

I can help in this matter, Somalis had migrated during 11, 12 centuries from city Zelia to Arabia and Yemen and those immigrants are called Zelia tribe or people. They wrote books about their ancestors. They were never slaved and very proud of their ancestors.

 

[Prince of Lasanod]

This is actually wrong. I believe @Thegoodshepherd did an interesting topic on this of a thriving puntite community in Southern Arabia alongside their mehri brethren. Why don't they show up in your nobel-prize winning studies?

The notion that there has not been any sort of genetic exchange between the two regions is not only laughable but completely unrealistic from a scientific standpoint.

That is all besides the point. All it takes is just one slave from one of the clans being sold in the Arabian peninsula to shatter your narrative. It is an extraordinary claim that Somalis from completely different tribes would not sell Somalis from other tribes to Arabs, while having no qualms selling habeshis and others. A claim that requires extraordinary evidence.

We only enslaved you(Bantus), xabeshas and oromos. Ethnic Somalis could not be enslaved according to xeer law. Also all of the groups named before were NOT muslim.

 

[Cognitivedissonance]

What complete useless eater, they live to appease others, fickle minded & subservient self hating kowtowing brown nosing buck dancing coon nacaala iyo waxa tihiin ba waasa dheh vafankoolo warankilo!

 

[The Cushitic One]

Is it just me or one of her gigantic boobs is smaller than the other? Lol

:siilaanyolaugh:

 

[Dhabaal]

This is what a Somali couple on yt is claiming. I've seen throughout different social medias Somalis running with the same narrative...they want a history of enslavement so bad it's ridiculous. What's up with that?

Finally, the historians of SSpot should way in on this. Were Somalis enslaved? discuss!

I will go over multiple academic sources on the African slavery. Somalis were not enslaved ever. Period. There is no ''IF'' or ''But'' to it.

Somalia did not supply slaves -- as part of the Islamic world Somalis were at least nominally protected by the religious tenet that free Muslims cannot be enslaved.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=hv6244EfR_MC&pg=PA6&dq=somalia+did+not+supply+slaves&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiZ3-jFhc_QAhXJ5oMKHfrZC64Q6AEIJTAC#v=onepage&q=somalia did not supply slaves&f=false

Source: Unraveling Somalia: Race, Class, and the Legacy of Slavery By Catherine Besteman

Secondly well known fact that Arabs never enslaved us.

"Muuse Galaal (Somali poet, historian, sheekh, teacher, UNESCO representative for the Ministry of Education, and presently a member of the Somali Language Commission)[...] notes, where Arabs do miscegenate, it is with peoples they have enslaved. The Somalis, being warlike, and close racially to the Arabs, have never been enslaved by them. So although the Arab peninsula was the foundation of the religion of the Somali people, the degree of Arab cultural influence has been rather small."

https://books.google.ca/books?id=LR8A4tEYZUAC&q=enslaved#v=snippet&q=enslaved&f=false

Source: Politics, Language, and Thought: The Somali Experience
By David D. Laitin

Arabs did not consider the Somalis to be "black Africans"; they considered them racially distinct from the latter . This was enshrined in law too that Somalis cannot be enslaved. Here's a passage on Sayyid Said bin Sultan, the ruler of Oman and of Omani possessions in East Africa

"In December 1839, small additions to the Moresby Treaty were agreed upon by Said. One addition shifted the line marking the limits of the "internal" Omani slave trade slightly westward so as to insulate the British "protected" states in India from the virus of the Arab slave trade. Another clause was designed to protect the "caucasoid" Somalis from enslavement. Said agreed that the Somalis, being "free men," i.e. Muslims, were not to be carried away from Africa as slaves.14 By implication, non-Muslims were suitable objects of enslavement."

http://www.jstor.org/stable/2717375?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents


I have to add also to mark the point that this was around the time that Geledi Somalis was forcing Omani Sultans to bow down to us and sumbit tribute. That should tell you a lot of how we were feared.

The dynasty reached its apex under the successive reigns of Sultan Yusuf Mahamud Ibrahim, who successfully consolidated Geledi power during the Bardera wars in 1843, and Sultan Ahmed Yusuf, who forced regional powers such as the Omani Empire to submit tribute.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=DPwOsOcNy5YC&printsec=frontcover&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=omani empire&f=false

Source :Historical Dictionary of Somalia
By Mohamed Haji Mukhtar

 

[Dhabaal]

Somalis probably enslaved other Somalis on an individual basis.

Ok this is nonsense. This is starting to get annoying, please stop assuming things. Somalis never enslaved eachother ever. There is no historical proof or basis for that assertion.

R.Pankhurst comprehensive article on on trade in these ports, the author is careful to add on p.42 . The Somalis did not enslave their own people; this is discussed subsequently in the main text.

Arabs trading up and down the Indian ocean coast had no justification in taking any Somalis nor could the Muslim Somalis North or South, enslave eachother.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=22...hinvolume&q=+did+not+enslave+their+own+people

Source: Political Culture in Somalia: Tracing Paths to Peace and Conflict by Mary-Jane Fox

You must have no understanding of Somali social system or culture to even hint at the idea that we enslaved each other. Somalis have an ingrained culture to be autonomous and protected in our xeer tradition.

 

[Canuck]

The Zayla'i tribe in Middle East, the same story after migrated of Darood from Yemen to Somalia around 7 century, later his kids migrated to Arabia and made the Zayla'i tribe in Middle East. The tribe has maintained its ancestory line till today.

 

[Canuck]

Darood people migrated from Zalia city to ME. They made their own tribe in ME Zayla'i tribe. He was well respected sheikh and considered to be saint.

 

[Dhabaal]

"we assume that we were probably enslaved, we're not sure because where does the superiority complex in East Africa come from?" She's so dumb which makes her that much cuter. lol bless them

I cannot comprehend how two grown people can sit in front of the camera to discuss something that never happened.

''WE don't know. but let us talk about it.''??

How is it natural for you to think or ponder on the idea if you were enslaved or not? GEEE!!! i wonder if my ancestors were enslaved'' that is not normal to ask yourself this from a place of ignorance.

''Somalis think they are superior because think they were never enslaved and think its an achievement''

Nothing to do with superiority, it is just not our experience or history. We cannot take other peoples experiences and treat it like its ours.

 

[Dhabaal]

Apart from the Arab slave trade, enslaving Somalis during the Atlantic slave trade was just not possible or inconvienient due to its location.

Nothing to do with inconvenience of location , it was not possible because the Portuguese failed in conquering our lands. They were defeated by us and chased away before they could even load their slaves ships on our dock during the 16th century and the same thing in 18th century.

Plus we traded with many European empires like the Venetians and the Dutch back in the middle ages, so our location was not unfamiliar to Europeans and Spanish muslims fleeing the inquisation migrated to Somalia for protection.

In fact our strategic location was heavy target for many reasons as you can imagine.

Slavery that happened in Kenya,Tanzania and Mozambique by the Portuguese would have happened to us a if they succeeded in conquering us but they were heavily defeated and we had strong centralized empires and allies to defend us.
Ajuran-Portuguese wars
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ajuran_Sultanate#Ajuran-Portuguese_wars

Ajuran's Somali forces would eventually militarily defeat the Portuguese. The Ottoman Empire would also remain an economic partner of the Somalis.[6] Throughout the 16th and 17th centuries successive Somali Sultans defied the Portuguese economic monopoly in the Indian Ocean by employing a new coinage which followed the Ottoman pattern, thus proclaiming an attitude of economic independence in regard to the Portuguese.

Vasco De Gama's son who was a leader of the portugese army was captured and got his head cut off by Somalis and then we sold his dead head on the Arabian market

There Gama was tortured in an attempt to force him to convert to Islam. Castanhoso's -- and Jerónimo Lobo's account after him—describe Gama's fortitude and death in language worthy of a hagiography, complete with miracles.[22] In the end Ahmad Gurey chopped off Gama's head and tossed it into a nearby spring, whose waters Castanhoso reported gained a reputation for giving "health to the sick"]

 

[Jubba_Man]

that makes zero sense. just because they live there (which makes sense because of the proximity and cultural exchange between somalis and the arabian peninsula) doesn't mean they went their as slaves. there is ZERO historical significance of this sis. try again.

You misunderstand the argument. Your buddy is claiming there is essentially zero genetic exchange between the two neighboring populations, which any anthropologist worth their weight would laugh at outright. One way this is done is through slavery, but there are many other conventional ways that do not involve slavery. This heavily puts the 'data' he keeps citing heavily in doubt. It's only common sense to expect some kind of genetic presence of certain Somali haplotypes in the Arabian peninsula, the Puntite communities I mentioned earlier being a very blaring example, and does not necessarily mean they are artifacts of slavery.

 

[Jubba_Man]

We only enslaved you(Bantus), xabeshas and oromos. Ethnic Somalis could not be enslaved according to xeer law. Also all of the groups named before were NOT muslim.

Even your Somali fanatical purists @Amun and @Bahal don't deny it. Entire sub-clans have enslaved others sub-clans in their wars. I don't want this to be moved to the clan topic so you can do your own research on this matter.

There is no shame in being enslaved sxb. Even Europeans enslaved each other. Some of the most powerful nations and ethnic groups today were slaves at some point in their history to groups of people who today have nothing. Just accept the facts and move on.

 

[Canuck]

You misunderstand the argument. Your buddy is claiming there is essentially zero genetic exchange between the two neighboring populations, which any anthropologist worth their weight would laugh at outright. One way this is done is through slavery, but there are many other conventional ways that do not involve slavery. This heavily puts the 'data' he keeps citing heavily in doubt. It's only common sense to expect some kind of genetic presence of certain Somali haplotypes in the Arabian peninsula, the Puntite communities I mentioned earlier being a very blaring example, and does not necessarily mean they are artifacts of slavery.

The Arab considered the Darood sheikh a saint with miracles and he is buried in mosque and made his own tribe Zaylai 'I in 2 countries(Saudi and Yemen) and they are called the masters due the ancestors of sheikh Darood (prophet Mohamed 'family) I have all the resources in Arabic language. The sheikh is buried in this mosque

 

[Dhabaal]

Even your Somali fanatical purists @Amun and @Bahal don't deny it. Entire sub-clans have enslaved others sub-clans in their wars. I don't want this to be moved to the clan topic so you can do your own research on this matter.

There is no shame in being enslaved sxb. Even Europeans enslaved each other. Some of the most powerful nations and ethnic groups today were slaves at some point in their history to groups of people who today have nothing. Just accept the facts and move on.

Why don't you pick up a history book? instead of spewing garbage As i stated on page 5. http://www.somalispot.com/threads/s...-physically-enslaved.16172/page-5#post-365421


It is well documented historically that Somalis never enslaved each other nor were we ever enslaved by others

R.Pankhurst comprehensive article on on trade in these ports, the author is careful to add on p.42 . The Somalis did not enslave their own people; this is discussed subsequently in the main text.

Arabs trading up and down the Indian ocean coast had no justification in taking any Somalis nor could the Muslim Somalis North or South, enslave eachother.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=22...hinvolume&q=+did+not+enslave+their+own+people

Source : Political Culture in Somalia: Tracing Paths to Peace and Conflict by Mary-Jane Fox

Secondly on the Xeer Legal system during wars clans were not allowed to dominate one another or take each other as slaves. As this was against the code of Biirmageydo


This practice has never existed in Somali society and this is completely unlawful in the xeer tradition.

 

[Dhabaal]

@Jubba_Man The Law of Birmageydo in the Xeer legal system.

The Somali pastorals, which we are studying here, have, for example, developed rules of war of astonishing modernity. These rules identify certain groups of the population called "Birmageydo" who are spared and protected in the event of war. This category includes women, children, the elderly but also the Sages, men of science and religion, the hosts and all those who are foreign to the conflict. The dignity and certain rights of the wounded and prisoners of war are also defended in this "Geneva Convention" before the hour.

Source:“"The verdict of the Tree: The Xeer of Somalis Essay on Democracy" by Ali Mouse Iye